Pretty good quote from John Farnam on lethal force.

Pretty good quote from John Farnam on lethal force.

This is a discussion on Pretty good quote from John Farnam on lethal force. within the Defensive Carry & Tactical Training forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; “Any intentional discharge of a firearm in the direction of another person is considered an exercise in lethal force, regardless of your expressed intent, or ...

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Thread: Pretty good quote from John Farnam on lethal force.

  1. #1
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    Pretty good quote from John Farnam on lethal force.

    “Any intentional discharge of a firearm in the direction of another person is considered an exercise in lethal force, regardless of your expressed intent, or ultimate result. When you are legally justified in employing lethal force against a threat, and have decided to do so, you are simultaneously justified in fatally wounding (killing) the person. When you are not justified in traumatically ending the offender’s life then and there, you are not justified in firing at all.”

    ~ John Farnam (found in an excellent online article at http://www.defense-


    Pretty much covers it.
    JD, ANGLICO and WHEC724 like this.
    "A first rate man with a third rate gun is far better than the other way around". The gun is a tool, you are the craftsman that makes it work. There are those who say "if I had to do it, I could" yet they never go out and train to do it. Don't let stupid be your mindset. Harryball 2013


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    Served with a guy by the name of John Farnam in the mid 70's he was on the base pistol/rifle team,but after seeing pictures of him a coupla years ago it's not the same guy.
    I agree 100% with the statement,people think that firing a warning shot to scare somebody off that otherwise would not justify deadly force are going to get a pass,hope they have a lawyer on retainer
    "Outside of the killings, Washington has one of the lowest crime rates in the country,"
    --Mayor Marion Barry, Washington , DC .

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    Makes sense to me.
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    Exactly. Quite a few jurisdictions will charge a person with either aggravated assault, or assault with a deadly weapon (both are felonies) when someone fires a warning shot for the exact reason John Farnam articulates.
    -Bark'n
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    "The gun is the great equalizer... For it is the gun, that allows the meek to repel the monsters; Whom are bigger, stronger and without conscience, prey on those who without one, would surely perish."

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    Often in the news, a bad shoot that misses is still a bad shoot answerable to the law. Really applies to any use of lethal force - not necessarily firearms. A good, ethical, rule of thumb.
    Americans understood the right of self-preservation as permitting a citizen to repel force by force
    when the intervention of society... may be too late to prevent an injury.
    -Blackstone’s Commentaries 145–146, n. 42 (1803) in District of Columbia v. Heller, 554 U.S. 570 (2008)

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    VIP Member Array ccw9mm's Avatar
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    broken link -- Farnam quote

    Quote Originally Posted by tacman605 View Post
    “Any intentional discharge of a firearm in the direction of another person is considered an exercise in lethal force ...
    FYI: the link is broken, in that post.

    I think this is the full link for the citation: John Farnam's Quips - 12June12.html - Shooting to "Wound".
    Your best weapon is your brain. Don't leave home without it.
    Thoughts: Justifiable self defense (A.O.J.).
    Explain: How does disarming victims reduce the number of victims?
    Reason over Force: The Gun is Civilization (Marko Kloos).
    NRA, SAF, GOA, OFF, ACLDN.

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    No sugar coating in that statement.....
    Don"t let stupid be your skill set....

    Never be ashamed of a scar. It simply means, that you were stronger than whatever tried to hurt you......

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    When I went through firearms instructor school as a cop, they had this posted in the front of the course handbook...(Paraphrased)..."Lethal force maybe employed when the actions of an assailant are such a threat to your life or the lives of others, that it does not matter if the assailant lives or dies, only that they stop the actions that caused you to use such force." Thought it was worth posting here.
    BlueHawk76 and akav8er like this.

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    VIP Member Array ccw9mm's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by GhostMaker View Post
    When I went through firearms instructor school as a cop, they had this posted in the front of the course handbook...(Paraphrased)..."Lethal force maybe employed when the actions of an assailant are such a threat to your life or the lives of others, that it does not matter if the assailant lives or dies, only that they stop the actions that caused you to use such force." Thought it was worth posting here.
    Simple, plain, clear language. That's the way it should be.

    During a deadly force course with Ayoob, he summarized the A.O.J. standard like this: Justified use of lethal force requires that the innocent be in immediate and otherwise unavoidable danger of death or grave bodily harm.
    Your best weapon is your brain. Don't leave home without it.
    Thoughts: Justifiable self defense (A.O.J.).
    Explain: How does disarming victims reduce the number of victims?
    Reason over Force: The Gun is Civilization (Marko Kloos).
    NRA, SAF, GOA, OFF, ACLDN.

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    VIP Member Array Hiram25's Avatar
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    Good advice!
    Hiram25
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    I agree completely. Only on TV does the good guy shoot the gun out of the bad guy's hand at 100 yards using a snub nose .38. I teach COM shooting to stop the threat. You should not have tne intention of killing anyone. In fact, it is hoped that everyone survives. Having said that, the BG has certain occupational hazards that come with his profession, one of which may be death. Again, the key I stress is to stop the threat. Any other thoughts at the time can get you hurt.
    Best way to win a gun fight? "That's easy, don't show up."
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