"making good hits at ---- yards"

So just wandering, do some people realize the difference between feet and yards?

I've read a good few posts here and there where people have posted about shooting xxx gun (usually a compact/subcompact) at xxx yards and saying accuracy was good/great or whatever.

Are you people really setting up at a true 25 yards??? Or 50 yards???
You know 25 yards is 75 FEET! Thats a LOOONNNGGG way for pistols, and pretty tough to get decent shots at that range.

I'm not saying it can't be done, I know there are folks here who can probably make some very impressive and consistant shots at these ranges. But those aren't the people that post about shooting at those ranges, and I'd bet they're not making those shots with a 3-4" barrel in a subcompact.

Just as someone who goes to the range pretty frequently and sets up at marked out yardage, I think alot of people making some comments are probably thinking feet not yards and/or fibbing a good bit about the distance at which they're shooting.

Lot's of people say lot's of things over the internet. Just as every FFL employee with a flat top haircut has served with Seal Team 6 and can hit 12" steel plates @ 1,000 meters plus with a sup par AR rifle and cheap ammo. With BUIS's. Ummm Hmmm.

I'm still wondering if any of those people, at the FFL, know that most of their customers have the internet also ? :rolleyes:

I watched a video somewhere here on this forum of a man with a 1911 with no sights on it hit a steel target from 100 yards each time he pulled the trigger. Can't remember his name.

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Originally Posted by miller_man

So just wandering, do some people realize the difference between feet and yards?

I've read a good few posts here and there where people have posted about shooting xxx gun (usually a compact/subcompact) at xxx yards and saying accuracy was good/great or whatever.

Are you people really setting up at a true 25 yards??? Or 50 yards???
You know 25 yards is 75 FEET! Thats a LOOONNNGGG way for pistols, and pretty tough to get decent shots at that range.

I'm not saying it can't be done, I know there are folks here who can probably make some very impressive and consistant shots at these ranges. But those aren't the people that post about shooting at those ranges, and I'd bet they're not making those shots with a 3-4" barrel in a subcompact.

Just as someone who goes to the range pretty frequently and sets up at marked out yardage, I think alot of people making some comments are probably thinking feet not yards and/or fibbing a good bit about the distance at which they're shooting.

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Its not magic, and its not internet fantasy. Its the reality of training to a higher standard. If you do not appreciate that, its ok. Some take it very serious. Some dont.

I'm surprised someone finds 25-50 yard shots to be doubtful. Most people I have shot with in training are capable of making 30-yard COM shots well over 50% of the time, and some much more reliably, and further.

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Originally Posted by Harryball

Its not magic, and its not internet fantasy. Its the reality of training to a higher standard. If you do not appreciate that, its ok. Some take it very serious. Some dont.

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Yup.

Attend any training classes, miller man, or seek any kind of professional coaching, and you'll see that the 25-yard line is a very common range to practice honing the fundamentals.

That's not to say that it's somehow the magic of "professional training" - many serious hobbyist pistol shooters also practice at that range. Again, it's a good acid-test of the fundamentals. :smile:

This isn't with any kind of special guns: sights, trigger, etc. Nor is it with match-grade ammo. It's with carry guns, using nothing better than range-fodder ammo. And in many cases, even at such distances, shooters will train to the clock or shoot from various positions.

Just as a quick example, Mr. Kyle Defoor is a highly regarded instructor. Here's his "Performance Pistol Test 1" demo ->

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sJtczDAUul0

Read some of the AARs of Vickers' classes, too - or, for that matter, that of any of the top-tier trainers like Costa, Haley, Harrington, etc., and you'll see what's demanded of students at that range: and not experienced students, either...these drills are often started at the beginner level (after proper instruction and build-up, of-course, so that students are not discouraged). Give it a try, yourself, :smile: You'll like the challenge. :smile:

Hey...I can hit a 12" steel plate at 1000 yards with several guns. I do practice at 600 and 1000 yards with various calibers.
I do shoot at 100 yards silhouettes with everything from a snub nose .38 to the .45 and every thing in between.
I have hit steel plates at 400 yards with several handguns.
Its not hard to do and there is nothing magic about doing any of it other than practice,practice and more practice.

It does amuse me when others tell me that it cant be done, because I have lots of friends that do it on a regular basis.

We just smile and look at each other when the conversation comes up. We know that we can do it and thats good enough for us.

Ah, and a very timely thread I found on another Forum:

I need help. I can't shoot at 25 yards. - M4Carbine.net Forums

:smile:

For some 25 or 50 yard shots are long for a handgun and to some that may be an impossible shot but in reality all it takes is practice.

I have fired both a 25 and 50 yard qualification course with a J frame just so see how the gun would do and had no problem with either. Myself and other officers would shoot everything from baby Glocks to the full size SWAT Glocks at 75 yards hitting bowling pins that we placed on top of the target stands. It is all about knowing the gun and using the fundamentals every time.

When I read the OP I thought of this video. Whether you like Yeager or not he can shoot.

XS Sight Demo - YouTube

I guess I am close enough to Missouri that someone is going to have to "show me" a 400 yard shot with a hand gun.

I've seen surveillance videos that show the robber & clerk shooting many rounds at each other at point blank range & missing! Adrenalin has a lot to do with that I'm sure. I've seen Soldiers that could hit anything out to any distance with their M16 or M4 but when rounds were coming their way they couldn't hit a thing. Practice is different than the real thing.

After years of practicing at 50' I've lately settled at 21'. All done with barrels in the 4" range. Have I shot at further distances in the past & did quite good with lots of practice. A handgun is not designed for the long shot & self defense is usually at close distances. Can it be done? Sure. My philosophy is to use a rifle for long shots.

I've shot 100 meter dingers with a couple of handguns, namely the Mk23 suppressed. It's a hold over of about 20"

It's not hard to do but I'd be hard pressed to actually take those shots with a handgun. I'd get back too my rifle.

Anyone who shoots NRA bullseye matches for their Distinguished Pistol Shot Badge shoots at 25 and 50 yards. This is the normal distance. I have shot my match grade 1911 at 100 yards with satisfactory results. It's training sir. Practice at 3 yards and that will be as good as you get. Want to get better? Move it back to 25 yards and practice. Snubnose and compacts? Maybe.....with the right weapon.

Well I guess I tend to think of accurate shots as groups of 3 to 5 inches. I watched some of those videos and while they're hitting the target at 25 + yards, I don't think they're great shots. I do shoot at 25 yards at the range sometimes, and have an occasional bulls eye but it's not very accurate or consistent. I usually shoot 7 - 10 yards and try to shoot for 3 inch groups.

but yes I do need lots more practice, training and more experience. I would love to 1 day be able to shoot good at 25 to 50 yards with the handgun. Hopefully one day.

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Originally Posted by miller_man

So just wandering, do some people realize the difference between feet and yards?...You know 25 yards is 75 FEET!

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:haha: Yes & yes. And I think you're "wondering" and not "wandering"...but I could be wrong. As for accuracy pistol shooting at 25 yards, most published (Gun Magazine) accuracy tests (for full & mid-sized handguns) are from a rest at 25 yards. IMHO, off-hand combat pistol shooting at 25 yards by a proficient pistolero should be at least minute-of-paper-plate. And I have a couple of US Air Marshal friends who simply amaze even good shooters with their accuracy. It's all & always a matter of technique & practice (practice, practice...). :yup: