When to say police

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Thread: When to say police

  1. #31
    Senior Member Array mano3's Avatar
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    "I'm a concealed weapons permit holder! Here is my giant badge!"
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    US Air Force, 1986 - 2007

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  3. #32
    VIP Member Array Smitty901's Avatar
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    Another scam taking peoples money .
    Forget what they told you. your going to end up dead or in jail.

  4. #33
    Distinguished Member Array ArkhmAsylm's Avatar
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    The only thing I'm going to be shouting when coming upon an armed BG is the old cop show standard, FREEZE!! DROP THE WEAPON! That and the fact that I'll likely be pointing my pistol at them will be all the warning they get.
    "Historical examination of the right to bear arms, from English antecedents to the drafting of the Second Amendment, bears proof that the right to bear arms has consistently been, and should still be, construed as an individual right." -- U.S. District Judge Sam Cummings, Re: U.S. vs Emerson (1999)

  5. #34
    Member Array _Hawkeye_'s Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Matthew Temkin View Post
    Now that I am retired I would probably ask very nicely---"Please!!! Don't Move!!"'
    Say it very fast with a New York accent and the bad guy may think you are saying, "Police!!!"
    This is a good one
    English is my second language, I have been told my use of it is harsh, apologies if this is the matter.

    You know what stops a bad guy with a gun? A good guy with a gun

  6. #35
    Senior Member Array dV8r's Avatar
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    You need to learn how to say, with your best Klingon accent: "Hey suckrrrr, today is a good day to die!" As you pull the trigger about 80% into the sentience.
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  7. #36
    VIP Member Array Eagleks's Avatar
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    The only comment I can think of saying to a BG is...... afterwards ...... "that was stupid" .

    I won't be yelling out I'm the police, by any means. In fact, I wouldn't be wasting my time yelling anything really.....

    I'm actually amazed that so many people think they are going to have all of this time prior to shooting , to do all of this "stuff" .
    You more than likely, will be just glad you survived it.
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    Chief Justice John Roberts : "I don't see how you can read Heller and not take away from it the notion that the Second Amendment...was extremely important to the framers in their view of what liberty meant."

  8. #37
    Distinguished Member Array Arborigine's Avatar
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    In spite of my previous joking comments, Instructors have told me to be yelling "drop the weapon, show me your hands" repeatedly, not so much to scare a BG but so witnesses will see that you really didn't want to drop the BG but were forced to do so. Doing an Eastwood impression is a definate mistake, as that could be interpreted as a pre-meditated attitude towards acting like a Marine and simply killing everything that moves.
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  9. #38
    Senior Member Array Bubbiesdad's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mike1956 View Post
    Where did you take this training?
    Don't you mean alleged training?
    Always remember that others may hate you but those who hate you don't win unless you hate them. And then you destroy yourself.
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  10. #39
    VIP Member Array ccw9mm's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by GeorgiaDawg View Post
    WRegardless of when the book was written, the situation being discussed is exactly the same as what was being described in the book. It was just as illegal for a civilian to impersonate a LEO then as it is now, regardless of whether or not your city or state allowed you to carry a gun concealed.
    And calling out for police to be called is just as legal now as at any other time.

    Still, simple phrasing can go a long way toward avoiding the poor assumptions by witnesses. Calling for police to be called is one thing; while howling "Police!" is entirely likely to be inferred wrongly by witnesses. Whether in practice that'll matter at all will likely come down to the totality of circumstances, as in a truly defensive situation it's hardly as though a person's daring to impersonate anyone for any gain.

    I agree with those who suggest there's likely to be little time, in many scenarios. If time exists, however, I'm all for being seen as the intended victim, being seen as not desiring the attack, being seen to be calling for assistance, caring for bystanders/wounded in the aftermath, etc. So long as time/conditions allow, I'm certainly going to be calling out for assistance, though it won't surprise me in the least if that turns out to be a strictly post-attack step. Haven't been fired upon, previously; and haven't been attacked violently in a spot where witnesses were plentiful, and even then there was zero time to do anything other than survive it.
    Your best weapon is your brain. Don't leave home without it.
    Thoughts: Justifiable self defense (A.O.J.).
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  11. #40
    VIP Member Array Smitty901's Avatar
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    1. Use the word Police no madder how you use it a few witness are going to claim they heard you claim to be Police fact. And you can bet the DA is going to hang you.
    2. BG's do not care if your police they know you aint going to shoot .
    3. Better off the think your just a scared old man or women with a gun that going to worry them.
    4. If the gun is out pretty good chance the time for talking has passed.

  12. #41
    VIP Member Array ccw9mm's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Smitty901 View Post
    1. Use the word Police no ma[tt]er how you use it a few witness are going to claim they heard you claim to be Police fact. And you can bet the DA is going to hang you.
    Disagree. Calling for someone to call police (speaking to a bystander/witness) is a far cry from howling "Police!" and praying it's not misunderstood. Different situations, timing, wording. Mere use of the word "police" shouldn't be misconstrued at all in the first case, while I agree with you that it's entirely likely to be misunderstood by many in the latter case.
    Your best weapon is your brain. Don't leave home without it.
    Thoughts: Justifiable self defense (A.O.J.).
    Explain: How does disarming victims reduce the number of victims?
    Reason over Force: The Gun is Civilization (Marko Kloos).
    NRA, GOA, OFF, ACLDN.

  13. #42
    Distinguished Member Array Rexster's Avatar
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    It is so very difficult to verbalize and shoot at the same time. I do not plan to waste words. My standard verbalization is to yell "BACK OFF" right quickly, so the words blend together, like a combination of a martial artist's "ki-yah," or whatever it is they say, and a rebel yell. "Back off" can mean back away from me, or back away from someone else, but should be difficult to misunderstand, if the bad guy understands English.

    If I perceive a Spanish speaker, I will yell "ALTO!" (translation: stop)

    FWIW, I actually am a police officer, and have yelled "BACK OFF" more than once, for real. This is not an academic exercise.

    As for badges, I usually do not bother carrying a badge off the clock. My agency issues a badge that looks just too darn generic, and without the uniform to go with it, appears like something bought at a gun show. Our ID cards are quite distinctive and authoritative, so I wear the ID on a ball chain round my neck.

  14. #43
    Distinguished Member Array Arborigine's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rexster View Post
    If I perceive a Spanish speaker, I will yell "ALTO!" (translation: stop)

    I speak spanish fairly well, but refuse to do so this side of the border. Kind of surprises people when they find out i understood what they said between them. One more instance of the benefits of surprise.
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  15. #44
    Member Array Glhadiator's Avatar
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    I would like to add an observation. If the BG has the drop on me and/or I feel my life is threatened then I will use that precious brief moment to defend my life or my family. In other words I am going to draw and pull the trigger.. I am not going to fire warning shots, shout warnings or brandish my gun to scare the BG.

    I train and study constantly to understand and identify the ability, opportunity, jeopardy and preclusion for the use of lethal force in a self defense situation. I do this because I will need to prove all of this in court as I am only allowed to use lethal force for self defense.

    Preclusion
    Your use of force must stop when the threat ceases.

    If the BG is leaving the scene I cannot use lethal force to stop him. Imminent threat to my life no longer exist. Why would I be yelling, "Police! Halt?" If he then turns, raises his weapon and I shoot him, the prosecutor will slap a criminal indictment on me for murder, contending that the BG was leaving the scene.

    LE are required to disarm the BG if possible and apprehend. I am not LE. My circumstances involving the use of lethal force are very different than those of a LEO. I am not going to negotiate, warn or scare the BG.

    The use of lethal force that can end in homicide is justified in the situation of immediate, otherwise unavoidable danger of death or grave bodily harm to the innocent. Massad Ayoob

    I don't pretend to tell anyone how to defend thenselves in a threat. Yell anything you want. My goals are:
    1. Neutralize the threat.
    2. Survive the encounter.
    3. Not go to prison for murder or impersonating a LEO.
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  16. #45
    Member Array Nebraska12's Avatar
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    I am not a lawyer by any means. But, it's my understanding that to impersonate a police officer, you must satisfy two things:

    1. Identify yourself as one.

    and

    2. Perform an act as though you were an authority or an action other reasonable individuals might construe as an act common to Law Enforcement.

    In these scenarios, it would seem to me that you are doing both. This is what I was taught in my class. They made clear that carrying a weapon does not make you law enforcement, and you do not want to ever give the impression that you are an Officer of the Law if you are not.

    I would say, stop or control the threat, ask someone to call 911.
    Glhadiator likes this.
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