Sentry position - Page 2

Sentry position

This is a discussion on Sentry position within the Defensive Carry & Tactical Training forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; Ok, so it is after a threat has been verified, such as shots have been fired or confirmation of a person who has a weapon. ...

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  1. #16
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    Ok, so it is after a threat has been verified, such as shots have been fired or confirmation of a person who has a weapon.

    It was late and I got stuck on thinking "executive security" and was picturing moving a VIP through a crowd when no threat has been presented, other than maybe a heavy crowd surge. Makes sense to be drawn and close to body once a threat is verified.
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  2. #17
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    You got it...
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  3. #18
    Senior Member Array Weeg's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DRM View Post
    That and the lack of a proven gun handling technique like the Sentry Position.

    With the Sentry you have trigger finger awareness at all times as well as muzzle awareness.

    I'm sure it will work for some (who need training), and others it isn't worhtwhile trying to re-wire your skill set.



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  4. #19
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    Lightbulb

    Sorry, but her booger-hook was on the trigger...
    As my late, great, Special Operator friend Robert "Zig" Hensley used to say:

    "KEEP YOUR BOOGER HOOK OFF THE BANG SWITCH!"

    But is telling people to keep their finger off the trigger really enough? :
    Last edited by DRM; November 3rd, 2012 at 09:14 AM.
    "...with liberty and justice for all..."
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  5. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by Weeg View Post
    Sorry, but her booger-hook was on the trigger, and gun pointed close to BG..."gun went 'boom..."


    The term is ND, not AD...


    The firearm discharging is from Negligence and ignorance.


    R
    Semantics. AD vs. ND = not a whole hell of a lot of difference. We all know it wasn't good.
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  6. #21
    Senior Member Array Weeg's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bark'n View Post
    Semantics. AD vs. ND = not a whole hell of a lot of difference. We all know it wasn't good.

    Actually, there is a difference...


    Look up the definitions of the words 'accident' and negligent'


    Then go from there.




    R

  7. #22
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    AD? ND? it matters not to those endangered by it. Let's call it UD, "Unintended Discharge."
    Even the best trained,coldest human being can be effected by unexpected outside influences. When your adrenalin is up and your pucker valve is trying to nurse on your tonsils' anyone can be affected by forces beyond their control or expectation. "Sympathetic Response".
    Frightened dog running between your legs, Team member watching your "6" or first responder stumbling into you and knocking you off balance, Sonic Boom or earthquake. It just doesn't matter where your finger was before contact was made,the end result is still bad.
    I take issue with this:

    "I'm sure it will work for some (who need training), and others it isn't worhtwhile trying to re-wire your skill set"

    It will work for anyone and while it takes very little to "re-wire your skill set", isn't it worthwhile to add one more level of insurance with little to no effect on your ability to respond to action if needed? One more tool in the box.
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  8. #23
    Senior Member Array Weeg's Avatar
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    There are other methods that are just as effective.


    Goodness, touchy are we?



    R

  9. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by Weeg View Post
    Actually, there is a difference...


    Look up the definitions of the words 'accident' and negligent'


    Then go from there.




    R
    Holy cow... I never knew there was such a thing called a dictionary. I'm sure glad you pointed that out, because for the last gazillion years, people have had a tendency to use the terms interchangeably, yet most people seem to know what they mean when they say it.

    Hence the reason I referred to your post as being semantics. We can look that word up together. Let's see....

    se·man·tics (s-mntks)
    n. (used with a sing. or pl. verb)
    1. Linguistics The study or science of meaning in language.
    2. Linguistics The study of relationships between signs and symbols and what they represent. Also called semasiology.
    3. The meaning or the interpretation of a word, sentence, or other language form: We're basically agreed; let's not quibble over semantics.


    But let's not quibble over it. I concede your wise insight into the nuances between an accidental discharge and a negligent discharge.
    -Bark'n
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    "The gun is the great equalizer... For it is the gun, that allows the meek to repel the monsters; Whom are bigger, stronger and without conscience, prey on those who without one, would surely perish."

  10. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by Weeg View Post
    There are other methods that are just as effective.


    Goodness, touchy are we?



    R
    Sorry if I came across that way-imperfect medium this. Also sorry I mistook your post as dismissive of a usefull[to some] concept.
    Oh yeh? Well this was sent from the scary black electrical box under my desk, so there!
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  11. #26
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    Hey Guys, I was looking at the video again. Looks like a Beretta. Do you think she may have been trying to decock and screwed up?

    Thoughts, anyone?
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  12. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by DRM View Post
    Hey Guys, I was looking at the video again. Looks like a Beretta. Do you think she may have been trying to decock and screwed up?

    Thoughts, anyone?
    I couldn't tell what kind of gun she had but if it was a Beretta I'd wonder why the hammer would be cocked unless she had already fired a shot or shots not shown in the video.
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  13. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by DRM View Post
    Hey Guys, I was looking at the video again. Looks like a Beretta. Do you think she may have been trying to decock and screwed up?

    Thoughts, anyone?
    Hard to tell with the video quality, but in the frames @ 7 seconds it has a very squared and flat bottomed trigger guard.
    Beretta has a curved underside.
    Oh yeh? Well this was sent from the scary black electrical box under my desk, so there!
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  14. #29
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    That video gave me the chills..................... I agree. Excellent Discussion.
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  15. #30
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    I am sure the officer in question knows the 4 safety rules and said rules were probably hammered home in training...however minimal training. Your assumption is that a poorly trained officer will use this technique properly with finger off the trigger...something he/she could not do with the same amount of training prior to this technique. With lack of training, the officer in question could easily execute this technique with her finger on the trigger.

    Quote Originally Posted by DRM View Post
    Here's the problem:

    This is a video clip filmed in a major city of a felony stop. I watched in horror as a female officer discharged her weapon while her partner was attempting to handcuff a suspect he had on the ground. The bullet struck the ground only inches away from the head of the suspect and the ricochet hit her partner. I knew that if the bullet had struck the suspect in the head would have been deemed an assassination by the press. Can you imagine the media impact??



    While this accident was due in part to the high stress of the situation, the main reason for the A.D. was a lack of proper training, specifically, a lack of MUZZLE AWARENESS and a severe lack of TRIGGER FINGER AWARENSS.

    When I was working in Law Enforcement, I always felt very uncomfortable hand cuffing a suspect I had on the ground while my partner was covering me, mainly because he was pointing his weapon at my head or hands most of the time.

    To combat this problem, the “Sentry Position” was created. This unique method of holding the weapon was specifically developed for safety by allowing the officer to have both TRIGGER FINGER AWARENESS as well as MUZZLE AWARENESS. Weapons retention and fast deployment of the firearm was also incorporated into the design (Photos courtesy FIST-FIRE Book © 2002):

    Attachment 64043

    By having the pistol covered with the off hand the gun is held securely by the strong hand while the trigger finger remains “trapped” on the side of the dust cover. Both thumb pads are touching and the off hand is clasped around the forward half of the slide. Again, this affords the officer both muzzle and trigger finger awareness.

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