How do we stop all this mass shooting

This is a discussion on How do we stop all this mass shooting within the Defensive Carry & Tactical Training forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; Don't know that this is the place to post this...but here goes since it has to do with ones mindset and wiliness to engage. With ...

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Thread: How do we stop all this mass shooting

  1. #1
    Distinguished Member Array Bill MO's Avatar
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    How do we stop all this mass shooting

    Don't know that this is the place to post this...but here goes since it has to do with ones mindset and wiliness to engage.

    With the shooting we've had the last few days one has to wonder how and what would be the best way to prevent them from being so bad or happening in the first place.

    Well here is a prayer by Gabe Suarez that I think if more people could say with a truthful heart we would moving in the right direction.

    Originally Posted by Gabe Suarez
    Blessed be Our Lord in Heaven...who has made us both fierce and cold...who has strengthened our hands as well as our hearts...who has given us what we need to destroy the sons of evil that walk this earth.

    Bring us to the right time and the right place Lord...make our vision clear that we may know the reality of what we see...make our hands quick, our aim true, our hearts cold, that by our decisive acts your softer children may be spared..
    Oh Lord may this come to pass!

    Guys get and become trained to become the Lord's Army of Angels.
    tcox4freedom likes this.
    It's gotta be who you are, not a hobby. reinman45

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  3. #2
    Member Array gooseman1991's Avatar
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    All the BG's going in their know no one is legally allowed to be armed inside. I feel if legal carry were permitted it would AT LEAST slow them down.

    Just my $0.02,
    Goose
    shadowwalker likes this.
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  4. #3
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    Want to stop mass shootings?

    Do away with gun free zones.

    Gun Free Zones are dangerous places. Only the law abiding disarms themselves while thugs go armed and ignore such illogical and stupid laws.

    This Liberalism/touchy/feely crap will be and is the undoing of this great country. When we "man up" and start eliminating shooters on the spot, then and only then will "mass" shootings cease to be.

    Lets stop giving the bad guys the advantage.
    Mike1956, OD*, wmhawth and 21 others like this.
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    Member Array bm303's Avatar
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    My uneducated opinion used to be that nobody should be able to buy guns. I grew up in a very anti-gun family.

    My opinion now is that you cannot stop these shootings. The guns are out there and whether they steal them or not people willing to kill innocent people can get them. The only way to stop this sort of thing it to have trained, armed civilians that can fight back. I guarantee you if someone who had a CCW was in that building less than 26 people would have died. Even if 20 died that is still 6 lives saved. You NEED guns to stop crazy people with guns. There is no other option. Eliminate gun free zones or allow for advanced carry permits allowing carry into anywhere but federal buildings.

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    Why would a Federal building be any different? If they were exempt, eventually the only place that mass shootings took place would be Federal buildings.

    The Federal Government isnt any different than anywhere else, in spite of what the employees there may beleive.

    You've come a long way bm303, but you aren't quite shed of that anti mentality yet.
    The further a society drifts from the truth, the more it will hate those that speak it...- George Orwell

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    The last group of shootings involved guns that the shooter did not own but stole from their rightful owners. Yes, get rid of "Gun Free Zones" and all of the idiot places that post the signs. When I pick up my granddaughter from school I have a gun in the car and will not hesitate to use it if the need arises. I CCW everywhere except the school and church, but it is not far away. Remember that Citizens on the street kill more BG's than the police do every year and there are stats that back that up. The police are there to record what happened before they arrived and not to prevent anything unless they accidentally run into something which sometimes they are not equipped to handle and then have to call for back-up which is more minutes away. You can restrict guns all you want to but it will not stop the mentally derrainged person from stepping into the situation. You will never know who will step into the next mess and what that will be. Guns don't kill people, people kill people. Simple math.
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    The hardest part in putting a stop to school shootings is to get the schools to get their heads out of the clouds and stop being politically correct about dealing with violence.

    The next effective tool is to turn all schools into a hard target. You do this by requiring all schools to have controlled access during the school hours. All exterior doors need to be locked on the outside with only one main access for visitors during the day. No one should be allowed access through any other door except the primary main access point. That access point needs to be monitored by a live person to screen all people entering to ascertain what business they have at the school. If workers, vendors or delivery personnel need access in and out through repeated trips through one of the other doors located in another part of the school, they need to have an escort or at least be monitored by a designated person to ensure those doors are not left unattended so no unauthorized person can slip in as someone leaves the building.

    Next there needs to be a training program set up and students as well as faculty and other staff be trained on how to respond if an active shooter is on premises so they can effectively intervene before law enforcement first responders arrive. Historically, by the time law enforcement first arrives on scene, somewhere between 80% and 90% of casualties has already happened by the time they arrive. Everyone should be trained as an "on site responder."

    Schools should adopt a professional security based training program such as the one offered by Alon Stivi called
    ACT (Attack Countermeasures Training).



    Beans, umpguns and Spirit51 like this.
    -Bark'n
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    VIP Member Array ccw9mm's Avatar
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    How to truly stop "mass" crimes? In a word: can't be done. At best, the risks can only be mitigated.

    Not being an expert on such things by any means, but having survived a number of violent attacks in my prior life ...

    It seems clear to me that there are a number of factors that can affect an assailant's effectiveness during violent crimes:

    • Access to, skill with and effectiveness/efficiency of weaponry and training, on the part of the assailant(s).
    • Access to, skill with and effectiveness/efficiency of weaponry and training, on the part of the defender(s).
    • Access to the facility, degree to which it's impeded or hindered.
    • Layout of the facility, whether its layout promotes easy access or whether it is "hardened" (and to what degree).
    • Active Defense of the facility, with the "walls of the castle" manned by at least one capable/motivated defender, or whether the defender is caught off-guard or sleeping.
    • Number of assailants.
    • Number of defenders.
    • Whether the defender has other loved ones to deal with at the time of the attack.
    • Whether the defender is injured at the time of (or immediately prior to) entry.
    • The time between identification of entry and success of that entry.
    • And probably at least a handful of other material factors that can strongly influence the outcome.


    While each situation may be different, to my way of thinking the most likely key factors will tend to be (a) the facility and to what degree it impedes/halts entry (thereby buying time to prepare to thwart the violence), and (b) the defender's weaponry, skills and training in terms of the degree to which it impedes/halts entry.

    I'm all for having just myself to rely upon, being fully awake when he/they come, have a perfect defensive layout to the area of the facility where I'm at when the entry beings, etc. But it's altogether too much wishful thinking to believe the average violent entry's going to be that neat in the average situation.

    And so, how to prevent them from being so bad, or from even happening in the first place? Toughened/hardened perimeter, a more-defensible layout, sufficiently violent and effective weaponry/skills/tactics on the part of the defender(s). And, beyond all of that, extremely tough sentencing of violent offenders such that they get erased from our society for at least a very long while (if not permanently), particularly in the case of repeat offenders.

    Fail to do those things, and we'll continue to have a fair incidence of such crimes occurring.

    Despite whatever we do, we'll STILL continue to have such things occur from time to time. It's simply a matter of probabilities in a free/open society, and nothing short of full lock-down of our society will thwart the last percentage of such crimes. No way around that, no matter how much political foosball and spin-meistering is attempted.
    Last edited by ccw9mm; December 16th, 2012 at 12:02 PM. Reason: spelling
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    Quote Originally Posted by HotGuns View Post
    Why would a Federal building be any different? If they were exempt, eventually the only place that mass shootings took place would be Federal buildings.

    The Federal Government isnt any different than anywhere else, in spite of what the employees there may beleive.

    You've come a long way bm303, but you aren't quite shed of that anti mentality yet.
    Maybe bm303 is all for smaller gov't and figures the quickest way to a smaller gov't is to make it the only gun-free zone left. Just a thought.
    BlueHawk76 and Eyescream like this.
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    RT
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    Quote Originally Posted by ksholder View Post
    Maybe bm303 is all for smaller gov't and figures the quickest way to a smaller gov't is to make it the only gun-free zone left. Just a thought.
    I see what you did there.

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    Distinguished Member Array bigmacque's Avatar
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    I do have to say though, one of the common denominators in most -- not all of them, I know, but most -- of these shootings is they were carried out in gun-free zones.
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    I'm in favor of gun control -- I think every citizen should have control of a gun.
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    I can't think of one incident that when met with like force or even threat of like force, these cowards did not stop and shoot themselves. That tells me all I need to know right there about what the immediate answer is.
    "Just blame Sixto"

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    Quote Originally Posted by SIXTO View Post
    I can't think of one incident that when met with like force or even threat of like force, these cowards did not stop and shoot themselves. That tells me all I need to know right there about what the immediate answer is.
    Yup
    It's the Land of Opportunity, not the Land of Entitlements - Vote America!!!

    "When governments fear the people there is liberty. When the people fear the government there is tyranny." Thomas Jefferson

    You are only paranoid until you are right - then you are a visionary.

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    Quote Originally Posted by RT View Post
    I see what you did there.
    Me??? I just postulated a cogent argument of what bm303 may have actually been thinking if (s)he has actually shed his/her anti mindset. I am not promoting anything.
    It's the Land of Opportunity, not the Land of Entitlements - Vote America!!!

    "When governments fear the people there is liberty. When the people fear the government there is tyranny." Thomas Jefferson

    You are only paranoid until you are right - then you are a visionary.

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    Distinguished Member Array Bill MO's Avatar
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    Bark'n, I heard he was buzzed through locked doors to enter with no problems. Most likely because he was know and his mom worked there.

    The problem we face to me is the no-gun zones but to each his own.
    It's gotta be who you are, not a hobby. reinman45

    "Is this persons bad behavior worth me having to kill them over?" Guantes

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