Importance of mindset

This is a discussion on Importance of mindset within the Defensive Carry & Tactical Training forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; Another quote of Grossman I think that has merit. If at the moment of truth you cannot pull the trigger, then all your training and ...

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    Distinguished Member Array Bill MO's Avatar
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    Importance of mindset

    Another quote of Grossman I think that has merit.

    If at the moment of truth you cannot pull the trigger, then all your
    training and all your equipment are wasted, and the lives of those you are
    sworn to protect will be wasted, and you will be an abject failure. Lt. Col.
    Dave Grossman,
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    Mindset is everything. I saw many a well trained tough talking man cower, run or freeze in the face of gunfire headed his way. On the other hand I saw frail young men perform like veterans in the face of fire. Probably the most that the military does is build you mindset. This more than anything else I can remember. Singing about fights and my rifle as we marched or ran. Always pushed to be aggressive and attack. Humans are hard wired not to kill each other. That is the reason we are still around. To take a life is no easy thing. Just ask one of the many who return from war with PTSD. I know that when I got back from Vietnam I was a mess for a few years. Most civilian shooters will never know if they have the proper mindset until it happens. Even training is often not enough as the student knows he is safe throughout it. No one is trying to kill him so there is never any fight of flight reflex to deal with.
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    I don't think anyone knows how they'll react until the moment they have to react.

    It's easy to sit here in the safety of our homes, drinking coffee and tapping on the keyboard to say, "oh yes, I'd have no problem pulling the trigger".

    I hope I'd do it, but I know if I killed someone it would stay with me forever.

    A war situation is completely different than a home situation. In war you know the other guy will kill you if given the chance. Your choice has already been made for you. In a civilian situation you have to make a lot of assessments in a split second and then act one way or another. If you make the wrong decision (or a court thinks you made the wrong decision even if others don't) you could be spending a long time in jail.

    It's probably that split second that will be your downfall but that's the reality.
    It may be that your sole purpose in life is simply to serve as a warning to others.

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    VIP Member Array Harryball's Avatar
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    Grossman is right on this one.

    JeanLouise said I don't think anyone knows how they'll react until the moment they have to react.

    It's easy to sit here in the safety of our homes, drinking coffee and tapping on the keyboard to say, "oh yes, I'd have no problem pulling the trigger".

    I hope I'd do it, but I know if I killed someone it would stay with me forever.

    A war situation is completely different than a home situation. In war you know the other guy will kill you if given the chance. Your choice has already been made for you. In a civilian situation you have to make a lot of assessments in a split second and then act one way or another. If you make the wrong decision (or a court thinks you made the wrong decision even if others don't) you could be spending a long time in jail.

    It's probably that split second that will be your downfall but that's the reality.
    Jean, you are part right. Some folks have trained their mind along with their bodies. I am not saying that they will be able to pull the trigger, but they are better prepared than most. The BG is the BG no matter was dynamic you are in.
    Don"t let stupid be your skill set....

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jeanlouise View Post
    I don't think anyone knows how they'll react until the moment they have to react.

    It's easy to sit here in the safety of our homes, drinking coffee and tapping on the keyboard to say, "oh yes, I'd have no problem pulling the trigger".

    I hope I'd do it, but I know if I killed someone it would stay with me forever.

    A war situation is completely different than a home situation. In war you know the other guy will kill you if given the chance. Your choice has already been made for you. In a civilian situation you have to make a lot of assessments in a split second and then act one way or another. If you make the wrong decision (or a court thinks you made the wrong decision even if others don't) you could be spending a long time in jail.

    It's probably that split second that will be your downfall but that's the reality.
    I would strongly encourage you to get some force on force training. It clears up many uncertainties.
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    Distinguished Member Array squid86's Avatar
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    yes proper mindset is very important. with all the training your body will remember what to do by muscle memory but if your mind is not ready then you will not be able to perform the needed action.

    alittle off topic but what i first read the quote my mind automatically went to a quote from Batman Begins, lol:

    "What is the point of all those pushups if you can't even lift a bloody log?" -Alfred Pennyworth.

    random, i know, lol.
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    There is no way to describe that feeling, tightness in your chest, and the way your throat feels like its caving in when you put that front sight on a human being and begin to pull the trigger, knowing full well what you are about to do and what's going to happen.

    Jeanlouise, you knocked it out of the ballpark with your post.
    Ignorance is a long way from stupid, but left unchecked, can get there real fast.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Mike1956 View Post
    I would strongly encourage you to get some force on force training. It clears up many uncertainties.
    Mike, I'm talking about those situations where it's not clear cut. The laws can be convoluted and not necessarily in favor of the victim. If someone breaks down my door and comes at me, yeah, I'd probably be pretty quick to pull the trigger.

    But, if I'm shopping downtown and approached by a guy with a knife...that's the hesitation. Do I pull out my gun and shoot him "just in case..." or do I wait to see what his next move will be?

    Laws are different too. What you might get an EZ pass on in Texas may put you in prison in NY.

    I know training helps and that's always a good thing but until you're there, you don't know how you'll react. It's not as if it's an every day occurrence that we're faced with these decisions.
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    It may be that your sole purpose in life is simply to serve as a warning to others.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jeanlouise View Post
    Mike, I'm talking about those situations where it's not clear cut. The laws can be convoluted and not necessarily in favor of the victim. If someone breaks down my door and comes at me, yeah, I'd probably be pretty quick to pull the trigger.

    But, if I'm shopping downtown and approached by a guy with a knife...that's the hesitation. Do I pull out my gun and shoot him "just in case..." or do I wait to see what his next move will be?

    Laws are different too. What you might get an EZ pass on in Texas may put you in prison in NY.

    I know training helps and that's always a good thing but until you're there, you don't know how you'll react. It's not as if it's an every day occurrence that we're faced with these decisions.
    I have to agree with Mike, FoF training will help. It is the hesitation that can make you an armed victim...
    Don"t let stupid be your skill set....

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    Great post Jeanlouise!

    No one knows how they will react until it happens. There is no guarantee they will react the same in the next emergency. Training helps and mindset is critical. I have seen big tough guys ace their way through military training and fall apart, freeze, and cry in a real world situation. I have seen small frail people who barely made it through training do heroic things in emergencies. You don't know until you are there.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Old_Dog View Post
    Mindset is everything. I saw many a well trained tough talking man cower, run or freeze in the face of gunfire headed his way. On the other hand I saw frail young men perform like veterans in the face of fire. Probably the most that the military does is build you mindset. This more than anything else I can remember. Singing about fights and my rifle as we marched or ran. Always pushed to be aggressive and attack. Humans are hard wired not to kill each other. That is the reason we are still around. To take a life is no easy thing. Just ask one of the many who return from war with PTSD. I know that when I got back from Vietnam I was a mess for a few years. Most civilian shooters will never know if they have the proper mindset until it happens. Even training is often not enough as the student knows he is safe throughout it. No one is trying to kill him so there is never any fight of flight reflex to deal with.
    Couldn't agree with you more!

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jeanlouise View Post
    Mike, I'm talking about those situations where it's not clear cut. The laws can be convoluted and not necessarily in favor of the victim. If someone breaks down my door and comes at me, yeah, I'd probably be pretty quick to pull the trigger.

    But, if I'm shopping downtown and approached by a guy with a knife...that's the hesitation. Do I pull out my gun and shoot him "just in case..." or do I wait to see what his next move will be?

    Laws are different too. What you might get an EZ pass on in Texas may put you in prison in NY.

    I know training helps and that's always a good thing but until you're there, you don't know how you'll react. It's not as if it's an every day occurrence that we're faced with these decisions.
    I'm not disagreeing with you at all, and we are talking about exactly the same things. Force on force work is essential prior to shopping downtown approached with a knife.
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    Quote Originally Posted by SCXDm9 View Post
    Jeanlouise.......... You are such a fool!!! If you have not had at least one Force on Force class (dozens are better) and you don't spend your days drinking the cool aid from pseudo-philosophers you are really just a victim in waiting!!!!!!

    In fact, get rid of your gun and take FOF class and fix you obviously week mindset (become a WORRIOR!!!) and Zen will be fall you!
    We all have a sermon, so go ahead and preach yours.
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    Senior Member Array SCXDm9's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mike1956 View Post
    We all have a sermon, so go ahead and preach yours.
    Sorry I guess I'm feeling a little prickly today... just seems I read this topic just as many times as the "Why I love/hate Glock" threads!

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