Question for some of you Texans... well and non Texans too I reckon

This is a discussion on Question for some of you Texans... well and non Texans too I reckon within the Defensive Carry & Tactical Training forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; I'm terribly curious about something... how does a CCW class instructor "grade" your proficiency test? Now in Texas I know it's 20 close range shots ...

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Thread: Question for some of you Texans... well and non Texans too I reckon

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    VIP Member Array Euclidean's Avatar
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    Question for some of you Texans... well and non Texans too I reckon

    I'm terribly curious about something... how does a CCW class instructor "grade" your proficiency test?

    Now in Texas I know it's 20 close range shots (7 yards I think) then 20 more at 15 yards then 10 more at 25 yards and you have to shoot 175/250.

    Well being the math wiz I am I figured out that each shot is worth a maximum of 5 points.

    I'm curious though.... how exactly does one "grade" this test? I can look at a target I've just put 40 rounds through and clearly see what's in the white, but from the center and then up and to the right a little bit is always one large hole about .75 or so inches in diameter (roughly). Now of course I have Swiss Cheese all throughout the rest of black area (I'm working on that... I realize there should only be one hole in the exact center of the target no matter how many I fire) and the aforementioned few that land in the white.

    Do they go on a shot by shot basis, or do they just take the thing, go "Yep they're all in the black good enough" or what? It seems like it would be very subjective to me.

    How do you objectively rate such a thing?

    I wonder what the standard is in other states as well. The Texas requirements seem to be pretty darn stringent. It's my understanding some states don't even require a range test, and some require one but not so stringent. Don't get me wrong the better you shoot the better your chances are, but this seems more like subversive gun control rather than enabling the populace to be armed.

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    Member Array Jacob Lee's Avatar
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    Minimum requirements in NM are pretty easy. I think a total of 25 rounds at 3 and 7 yards, at 4 pts each. Target no larger than 12 x 18 inches. 72% or better to pass. I think there are variations with different instructors as far as requiring more standards.

    My instructor had us do 25 rds each at 3 and 7 yards, 1 and 2 handed and from kneeling positions. He added some tactical and cover drills as well. Pretty simple still, but fun.;)

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    Virginia does not require a shooting test, so they also don\'t require a minimum score. So we are left with evaluating people\'s gun handling from a safety standpoint. We have them shoot 50 total rounds, strong and weak hand, two and one handed, doubles and triples at 7 and 15 yards. We ask that they keep all shots on a target about the size of a standard grocery bag.

    I know of one trainer who has implemented his own minimum required score. That trainer requires you shoot a standard PPC course of fire with a 225/300 to pass.

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    Member Array Jaltered's Avatar
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    In Texas:

    - 20 at 3 yards.
    - 20 at 7 yards.
    - 10 at 15 yards.

    They score you according to the numbered rings on the big blue silhouette target. However, they will never write down or tell you your actual numerical score. You receve a PASS or FAIL scoring only.

    This is to prevent your shooting score from being used against you in court either way.

    A 70% score of 175 or higher is required to pass.

    As for me...\"I met the standards required by the state.\" :D

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    VIP Member Array Euclidean's Avatar
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    Really? Wow I need to check my facts better Jaltered. I was told it was 7, 15, and 25 yards not 3, 7, and 15. I suddenly don\'t feel so incompetent that I have such large groups at 15 yards.

    I also make use of a pretty small target, about 6 inches across... and they use a silhoette style target for the test? This may be a piece of cake...

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    Member Array Pyrolyzer's Avatar
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    There was a woman in my class who had never fired a pistol before in here life. I gave her a two-minute class on marksmanship before the practical test and she did fine. I think it\'s pretty rare for someone to fail the marksmanship test for the Texas CHL unless they are too scared/nervous to even roughly point the gun.

    I think most people could pass the test if you cut the sights off of their guns and just told them to stand square to the target and extend their hands toward the middle of it whenever they need to shoot. It\'s a big target and for most of the shots, it\'s not very far away.

    Chuck

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    VIP Member Array Euclidean's Avatar
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    Yeah my confidence level is now much higher. Seeing as how I can accomplish 3, sometimes 4, inch groups at 7 yards now without trying very hard, I think I could pass the test.

    I suppose it\'s a well intentioned effort to weed out the truly inept. Good thing the state is always there to think for us and make our personal decisions for us too.:(

    Unfortunately I don\'t have it in the budget to pay for the class and the application fee until March or so. Sending off for the packet itself though I think is free so I may go ahead and do that so I can start the process moving.

    It\'s okay though. I\'m going to keep practicing regardless. I\'ll get better. I think the next time I go out I\'ll try to work on getting decent groups at 15 yards.

    Funny story... went out yesterday and shot about 50 rounds off at 15 yards. I wasn\'t too pleased with my performance. The targets I normally use are 12 by 12, and the black region is a circle with a 3 inch radius in the center. Well every round hit the target but a lot of them weren\'t in the black. I felt sorry for myself when I saw that my neighbor had a nice tight group almost all the in black.

    Anyway we had a ceasefire and when I went to retrieve my target I noticed this guy was firing a Ruger 9mm carbine! Ha! That\'s what self pity will get you: lots of faulty comparisons.

    I had another affirming moment the other day too... I had thought I\'d just shot a fairly mediocre grouping when I noticed my neighbor\'s was a lot sloppier than mine. His police department T shirt, beefy frame, haircut, demeanor, and Glock 19 told me he was quite possibly a cop. I guess even if a real world operator can have a little trouble every once in a while I can too!

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    Euclidean, you will do fine. Just remember the basics and you will shoot superbly.

    ~A

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    VIP Member Array Euclidean's Avatar
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    Thanks. I\'ve always figured I shoot well enough to defend myself even if I\'ll never win any medals. I figure if I can hit that little 3\" radius circle at 21 feet, a human torso should be trivial.

    I\'d really like to learn how to shoot a rifle better. I can nail it pretty decently at 50 yards, but I\'d like to do better than that. But that will be for another time. This year I\'m all about the handguns. I do want an AK-47 to go with my SKS though well before the 2008 elections go down though. I think that will be my 2006 project. Yes, I do plan that far ahead.

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    it is good to plan to far in advance. Problem is when pretty things rear their head and temp you. Such a thing happened to me with a particlular 1911.

    ~A

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    VIP Member Array Euclidean's Avatar
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    I\'m looking at lots of toys right now because I am broke and it\'s easy to resist temptation.

    I handled a Taurus Model 85 today. Now I\'ve had considerable experience with Rossis as a boy and believe me I could see the resemblance. It was like a Rossi but with a more solid feel to it.

    The problem was this particular model was well used, in great shape mind you, and they wanted 250. Also, the sights had been filed down to almost nothing.

    Considering for another 100 I can get one of those Smiths I\'ve been reccommended on this forum brand new, and for that same 250 I can get a brand new Rossi just like the Taurus I handled, and I don\'t have any of that cash to spend right now anyway, it was easy to pass.

    It was still a nice little gun with a real smooth trigger. I can tell they had some work done on it. If they go down to a reasonable price it will be a temptation. Of course they\'d have to go pretty cheap. Getting something done about those sites would cost me.

    But they\'ll sell it in the mean time, just not to me. I did tell them if someone offers them 150 they should take it.

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    Euclidean, I just picked up a Performance Center S&W 629. I got bit by the wheel bug real hard.

    ~A


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    VIP Member Array Euclidean's Avatar
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    Yeah I saw that. Favoring revolvers myself, I am insanely jealous. Very nice piece.

    And it\'s unique. It\'s yours. I\'ve always loved a firearm with its own character. The only gun I own that\'s definitely mine is my SKS, because I really am hesitant to change it in any way. I tend to leave things box stock. I am boring.

    I think one day I will go insane and buy a huge caliber revolver, .44 or bigger. I\'ve always wanted one for no reason I can understand.

    I drool over the latest autos too but a wheelgun in the hand just feels right.

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    I have a nice bruise from the back strap. The trigger breaks at a hair under 1.5 lbs in SA.

    ~A

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