speed of presentation

This is a discussion on speed of presentation within the Defensive Carry & Tactical Training forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; How fast is your first shot? I ask that question because I've hit a wall in my speed. I know I can go faster but ...

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Thread: speed of presentation

  1. #1
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    speed of presentation

    How fast is your first shot?

    I ask that question because I've hit a wall in my speed. I know I can go faster but my consistency fall way off, which is certainly no good.

    My test is as follows:

    Man - sized target at 10 yards.
    Presenting from concealment - what I normally wear just going about a normal day, open front shirt over t-shirt, strong side OWB.
    Goal is three shots in under 3 seconds from a random start on shot timer.
    Good hits on COM (thoracic area) only.

    Now, I can usually get my shots off under the time. It the first shot that drives me nuts. I am stuck in a rut of 2.3-2.4 to break that first shot with .3-.38 splits on the follow up shots.

    Where I feel I slow down is in clearing the cover garment. Either I take too long doing a thorough job of it or doing it too fast and not getting it completely clear and fumbling my initial grip.

    I already dry-practice considerably but my times are still not as good I would like. Any suggestions on practice routines to up the speed of that first shot?
    "Mind own business"
    "Always cut cards"

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    This may just be me, but when I know I want to go fast, my muscles tense up and it feels as if I am moving through jello. Clearing the cover garment when I go slow is fine, but when I am tensed up, I fumble.
    Unfortunately, the stress of a real life confrontation will cause this also (I assume)
    Maybe less thinking about it and more letting your muscle memory?

    good luck.
    Nehemiah 4:14: “Don’t be afraid of them. Remember the Lord who is great and awesome, and draw your Beretta PX4 and fight for your brothers, your sons and your daughters, your wives and your homes.” highlighted added by LMP

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    Here is a video of my presentation. It gives me a first shot of around a second faster than the one you are describing.
    "When you have to shoot, shoot, don't talk."
    Tuco

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    Not near as fast as this:

    Vietnam Veteran - 1966-1970 USASA
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    Give me a minute before I post again.

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    Quote Originally Posted by BurgerBoy View Post
    Not near as fast as this:
    Is that you? Very impressive.
    "When you have to shoot, shoot, don't talk."
    Tuco

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    For first shot I practice hitting half man silhouettes at ten feet. First shot is just as I clear holster close retention keep comming up followups are two handed when comfortable with hits practice moving to cover while shooting than reload.
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    Both videos are impressive, and bring up an idea. Why doesn't the OP put up a video so the guru's here (definitely not me) can give some advice.
    Nehemiah 4:14: “Don’t be afraid of them. Remember the Lord who is great and awesome, and draw your Beretta PX4 and fight for your brothers, your sons and your daughters, your wives and your homes.” highlighted added by LMP

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    Quote Originally Posted by LuvMyPX4 View Post
    Both videos are impressive, and bring up an idea. Why doesn't the OP put up a video so the guru's here (definitely not me) can give some advice.
    Because the OP doesn't have any video.

    "Mind own business"
    "Always cut cards"

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    Quote Originally Posted by RoadRunner71 View Post
    Because the OP doesn't have any video.

    Perhaps a more definitive description of the mechanics of your draw method, then?
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    "When you have to shoot, shoot, don't talk."
    Tuco

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    Quote Originally Posted by RoadRunner71 View Post
    Because the OP doesn't have any video.

    That would be a good reason.
    RoadRunner71 likes this.
    Nehemiah 4:14: “Don’t be afraid of them. Remember the Lord who is great and awesome, and draw your Beretta PX4 and fight for your brothers, your sons and your daughters, your wives and your homes.” highlighted added by LMP

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    Road Runner..I have some ideas, I call you later.....
    Don"t let stupid be your skill set....

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    Quote Originally Posted by Mike1956 View Post
    Perhaps a more definitive description of the mechanics of your draw method, then?
    -Standing facing target (as if standing in line or waiting to cross a street, something like that), relaxed hands at sides.
    -At the "go", lateral movement (although in reality I can't move on my range, I still think "MOVE!!!").
    -While moving, support hand moves to either a guard position or high on the chest. At the same time my strong hand move to clear cover garment. Technique is a thumb sweep from center line to just behind gun.
    -Strong hand assumes master-grip on gun.
    -Draw is straight up out of the holster, dropping the shoulder to pivot the muzzle down range as soon as it clears.
    -Strong and support hands come together on frame at about low chest height.
    -Push out toward target.
    -Break shot as soon as requisite sight picture is achieved. (This last is distance dependent as a 5 yard shot is quicker than a 25 yard shot.)
    "Mind own business"
    "Always cut cards"

  14. #13
    JD
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    If you're having issues reliably moving the cover garment you might try doing a whole hand grab&sweep instead of just the thumb.

    Sent via Tapatalk and still using real words.

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    Quote Originally Posted by RoadRunner71 View Post
    -Standing facing target (as if standing in line or waiting to cross a street, something like that), relaxed hands at sides.
    -At the "go", lateral movement (although in reality I can't move on my range, I still think "MOVE!!!").
    -While moving, support hand moves to either a guard position or high on the chest. At the same time my strong hand move to clear cover garment. Technique is a thumb sweep from center line to just behind gun.
    -Strong hand assumes master-grip on gun.
    -Draw is straight up out of the holster, dropping the shoulder to pivot the muzzle down range as soon as it clears.
    -Strong and support hands come together on frame at about low chest height.
    -Push out toward target.
    -Break shot as soon as requisite sight picture is achieved. (This last is distance dependent as a 5 yard shot is quicker than a 25 yard shot.)
    A couple suggestions:
    Take your support hand to the same place every time. Mine goes flat against my high chest. Automatic muscle memory saves time and eliminates uncertainty and awkwardness.

    Instead of beginning the garment sweep from the center line, start it slightly in front of the plane of of the gun. Extend your thumb outward, and keep it tight against the body as you bring your hand up above the gun, pushing the cover garment up as well, and then moving your hand back and down in a somewhat circular motion, grasping the grip. As you said, you are losing time on the cover garment.

    Pivoting the muzzle downrange as soon as it clears is likely costing you time, and gaining you nothing as well. Try to bring your hands together at the high chest ready and push straight out toward the target.
    "When you have to shoot, shoot, don't talk."
    Tuco

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    Sounds like the standard 4 point draw. Magpul instructors sometimes suggest your first shot from the 2nd position (gun level just clear of holster), then any followup needed from the 4th position.
    When I try this method I am a good second or two slower than Magill's suggestion of holster to shot one handed, eliminating the third step of bringing hands together.
    Plus, My first one handed shot is normally more accurate that two handed. My follow up shots are longer to bring on target, so I try to get my second hand to support while first shot is in process.
    Nehemiah 4:14: “Don’t be afraid of them. Remember the Lord who is great and awesome, and draw your Beretta PX4 and fight for your brothers, your sons and your daughters, your wives and your homes.” highlighted added by LMP

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