What would be your ideal firearms training class?

This is a discussion on What would be your ideal firearms training class? within the Defensive Carry & Tactical Training forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; Fellow Shooters, Thank you for ALL the valuable input on, what you are looking for in a Firearms Instructor? The response was fantastic and gave ...

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Thread: What would be your ideal firearms training class?

  1. #1
    Sponsor Array DCJS Instructor's Avatar
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    What would be your ideal firearms training class?

    Fellow Shooters,

    Thank you for ALL the valuable input on, what you are looking for in a Firearms Instructor? The response was fantastic and gave me some valuable insight. My hope is that it was beneficial to other Instructors as well.

    Now that I have a better idea of what you are looking for in a Firearms Instructor. What type of training are you looking for?

    In an attempt to bring my students the most Recent, Reverent and Realistic training I need your help!

    What would be the ideal firearms training class?

    How many hours?
    How many days?
    What classroom topics would you like to discuss?
    What range drills would you like to do?

    What do you want to learn?

    How much do you want to shoot (200,300,400,500,600,700 rounds per day?)

    In a (1) one day class 8 hours how would you like it split up 4 hours classroom and 4 hours on the range. 2-3 hours in the classroom 5-6 hours on the range? Or 1 hour in the class room 7 on the range?

    What about (2) day courses for example (1) day Glock Armorer and (1) day on how to shoot the Glock.

    Who is looking for Live fire FATS training where you are in a situation where someone is coming at you with a gun or a knife or baseball bat any you have to decide to shoot, move or communicate or you may get shot with air-soft ?

    Should we combine Handgun & Shotgun together?

    Should we combine Handgun & Patrol Rifle (M-4/AR-15) together?

    Should we combine Hand to Hand fighting skills with a Handgun Course?

    How about Weapons Retention training? ( It amazes me that when I teach this to my advanced concealed carry class they love it but have NEVER practiced it unless they were Law Enforcement.)

    So please let me know what you want to learn. FYI it can also be classes you want to take at another school!
    I will be sure to pass the info on to Instructors I know:

    Tom Perroni
    Perroni's Tactical Training Academy - Virginia Firearms Training
    Golden Seal Enterprises
    Last edited by DCJS Instructor; March 23rd, 2008 at 12:41 PM.

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  3. #2
    Ex Member Array Ram Rod's Avatar
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    I'd like to take the certified Glock armorer's course. I guess they don't have room for regular folks though.

  4. #3
    Sponsor Array DCJS Instructor's Avatar
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    Ram Rod,

    Shoot me a PM and I will give you details.

    Glock Advanced Operator's Diagnostics and Repair Course

    Instructor: Tom Perroni
    Date:April 5th, 2008
    Location: 1320 Central Park Blvd Suite #202 Fredericksburg, VA 22401

    Glock Factory Armorer and PTTA, Blackwater and Golden Seal Enterprises Inc. Staff Instructor Tom Perroni will be teaching a 1-day Advanced Glock Operator's Diagnostics and Repair Course at our classroom in Fredericksburg, Va. This course is not just an Armorer's Course which by definition focuses on parts replacement. Instead, Tom will cover advanced troubleshooting techniques that will identify, correct, and prevent problems and keep your Glock weapon system running trouble free.

    This course will not spend wasted time discussing non Operator issues. Tom will cover topics not normally discussed in the Factory Armorer's Course, such as issues with aftermarket parts installs and trigger jobs, ammunition and magazine issues, tools everyone should have (and others you don't need), etc.,

    You obviously need to bring a Glock! Feel free to bring working guns, non-working guns, problem guns, and any parts you would like to install. DO NOT bring parts that will require machining or major fitting to install. With the successful completion of the course you will be awarded: Perroni’s Tactical Training Academy Armorer Certification.

    WHO: Tom Perroni & PTTA Instructor Staff

    WHAT: 1-day Glock Advanced Operator's Diagnostics and Repair Course

    WHERE: 1320 Central Park Blvd Suite #202 Fredericksburg, VA 22401

    WHEN: Sat, April 5th, 2008

    COST: $200 (Includes Armorers Manual and Glock Armorer Tools)

    TO REGISTER or for more Information: Contact Tom Perroni @

    Perroni’s Tactical Training Academy
    http:// Perroni's Tactical Training Academy - Virginia Firearms Training
    tom@perronitactical.com
    (540) 786-3627

  5. #4
    VIP Member Array matiki's Avatar
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    You asked several questions to which I think I could write pages, instead I'll answer briefly:

    When I (rather than my employer) am paying for training, it is always for evening classes, of the 2 to 3 hour variety, spread out over three to six weeks.

    I don't care what the skill being taught is, or the skill level of the target audience. I don't believe that anything past two hours will be retained, and may in fact reduce retention of skills learned in the first two hours. Take it for what it's worth.

    I think training like FATS is invaluable.

  6. #5
    Restricted Member Array SelfDefense's Avatar
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    I will admit a bias as I have only attended one training class and I thought the material, the instructor, and methods used were conducive to learning and applicable to real world scenarios.

    Quote Originally Posted by DCJS Instructor View Post
    What would be the ideal firearms training class?

    How many hours?
    How many days?
    I think two full days is a good compromise between completeness of satisfying course material with the necessity of conforming to the time and financial ability of the students.

    What classroom topics would you like to discuss?
    I think most classroom topics are a waste of time. Specific questions can be addressed at the range. I can't imagine any student wants to sit in a classroom.

    What range drills would you like to do?
    I would prefer any drill that would help in saving my life in a real world scenario.

    What do you want to learn?
    I want to learn skills that help me deal with potential threats to best defned myself and my loved ones.

    How much do you want to shoot (200,300,400,500,600,700 rounds per day?)
    The more practical experience the better. The more rounds the better. More rounds equates to more practice of the material learned and provides immediate feedback as to how well the student can execute the newly learned skills.

    In a (1) one day class 8 hours how would you like it split up 4 hours classroom and 4 hours on the range. 2-3 hours in the classroom 5-6 hours on the range? Or 1 hour in the class room 7 on the range?
    Zero hours in class room. Eight hours on the range.

    What about (2) day courses for example (1) day Glock Armorer and (1) day on how to shoot the Glock.
    What's a Glock?

    Who is looking for Live fire FATS training where you are in a situation where someone is coming at you with a gun or a knife or baseball bat any you have to decide to shoot, move or communicate or you may get shot with air-soft ?
    I think that type of training is important as it allows the student to understand there is much more to a fight than shooting at targets.

    Should we combine Handgun & Shotgun together?
    Too much material at once.

    Should we combine Handgun & Patrol Rifle (M-4/AR-15) together?
    Too much material.

    Should we combine Hand to Hand fighting skills with a Handgun Course?
    Yes. I think the two go hand in hand (pun inended.)

    How about Weapons Retention training?
    I think that is part of the hand to hand training. At close range it is imperative to have skills to prevent the BG from taking your weapon.

  7. #6
    VIP Member Array Cupcake's Avatar
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    I think one day classes are easier to get to, and more affordable than multi-day options for us working stiffs. We can still get all the training, just over a longer period. (incremental progress is far better than perfection delayed and delayed). 200 - 400 rounds a day is cool for me (affordability).

    It might be great to include some FATS time with every day-long class? For my money a class that incorporated some hand to hand alongside the firearms training would be ideal. I'd rather keep pistol and long-gun classes separate, as most of us that don't train for making a living at combat won't likely need to be switching from short to long gun to hand to hand in a single engagement. Not saying don't offer a class, but it'd be way down on my list.

    As for format, If logistically possible I say to heck with "classroom." Let me clarify that, showing a video or giving classroom is great, but rather than learning a bunch in the classroom then going to the range to drill, how about show me a technique, then we drill it, learn, drill, repeat. At the end start throwing them together for combinations. Maybe that'd cost to much (to have the range for the whole day), just saying what I'd like.

    Classes I'd like:

    -pistol with H2H for the street
    -pistol with H2H for Home defense
    -Long gun for the home with H2H
    (the above to include fighting WITH a gun in hand, and lots of hand on H2H with airsoft or simunitons.)
    -Advanced combat shooting, to include clearing malfunctions
    -team tactics for home and street.
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  8. #7
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    What's a Glock?




    Thanks for the valuable input! All very good points.

    Tom

  9. #8
    Ex Member Array jmsstnr's Avatar
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    No light/dim light shooting.
    Second for H2H

    How to's for parents with young kids. Clearing rooms with no shoots through other walls,etc.

  10. #9
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    A husband-wife training class on how to cover each other and what to expect in a 'WalMart parking lot scenario'...a sort of backup team approach for non LEO types...

    I've taken several multi-day self-defense pistol courses...one can never take enough of them...but something with the wife could prove to be very rewarding.

    Stay armed...know your mate...stay safe!
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  11. #10
    VIP Member Array BigEFan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by retsupt99 View Post
    A husband-wife training class on how to cover each other and what to expect in a 'WalMart parking lot scenario'...a sort of backup team approach for non LEO types...

    I've taken several multi-day self-defense pistol courses...one can never take enough of them...but something with the wife could prove to be very rewarding.

    Stay armed...know your mate...stay safe!
    +1 I have been looking for a class like this around here.
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  12. #11
    VIP Member Array AZ Husker's Avatar
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    Retention, absolutely.
    Many of the well known classes are just too much for the average guy. I was looking at an intensive close-quarters self defense course that was two days and required 2000 rounds. I can't even LOAD that many rounds in mags in two days. The prices of many classes are prohibitive for younger guys, but often require too much physical activity for us middle-agers who can more easily afford them. Keep the scenarios real. Most of us aren't going to be doing hostage situations at 25 yards like one class I did.
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  13. #12
    Member Array Cruel Hand Luke's Avatar
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    Problem is THE ideal class would either have to be a bunch of ideal classes or one REALLY long ideal class.
    Randy Harris
    Suarez International Tier 1 Staff Instructor
    NRA Certified Instructor
    Master Class IDPA SSP

    TRAIN with me....http://www.suarezinternationalstore....px?find=harris

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