No misses allowed! Need motivation while training, try this!

No misses allowed! Need motivation while training, try this!

This is a discussion on No misses allowed! Need motivation while training, try this! within the Defensive Carry & Tactical Training forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; A couple of days ago I was teaching a basic marksmanship class to Officers. During the live fire portion of the training one of the ...

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Thread: No misses allowed! Need motivation while training, try this!

  1. #1
    Member Array JudoJake's Avatar
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    No misses allowed! Need motivation while training, try this!

    A couple of days ago I was teaching a basic marksmanship class to Officers. During the live fire portion of the training one of the officers(who has been on the force for about four years) was not shooting as well as the others. I noticed that he was becoming frustrated and even though we had just worked on the basics, he was being lazy with his reloads and just looked like he didn't care.

    When the training was done, we conducted our quarterly department qualification. He shot 80%. I spoke with him, and told him that 80% was good, and assured him that if he kept working at it, that he would see improvements. He told me that he didn't care any more and that he thought 80% was good enough!

    Oh, I wanted to lay into him. I hate sheep in this business. But I kept it in, gave him a dirty look and just walked away. But it bothered me. Why do you do this job if you don't care! His attitude showed that he didn't care about himself, the public or getting home to his family. He lost all credibility in my book.

    In SWAT if we miss we do push ups. I couldn't make him do push ups, because he wasn't SWAT. Be even that isn't enough, some people(like me) like doing push ups.

    We need to take misses seriously. So I started thinking. How am I going to deal with this problem. Then it hit me. Next time I have him on the range I decided to step things up and call his bluff on the fact that he thinks he shot "good enough".

    Next time I'm drawing an outline of two extra people, one on each side of his target. One adult size and one child size. Then I'm going to make him write in the name of his wife on the adult size one and the name of his child on the child size outline.

    Then I'm going to run him through the qualification again. When he's done shooting we are going to look at his target and see all the bullet holes he put into his child and his wife. Then I'm going to ask him if 80% is good enough.

    Guys take this seriously. It may not be your wife or child that gets hit if you miss, but it could easily be somebodies. Sorry for the long post, but I'm venting.

    P.S. I decided to do the same thing to my target next time I shoot. I don't mind doing push ups, but seeing a bullet hole in a human outline that has my son's name on it, due to the fact that I suck at shooting, would really ruin my day and motivate me to work harder. This would be a lot more motivation for me than cranking out a few push ups. Although I'll probably crank out a few push ups anyway.


  2. #2
    Senior Member Array XD in SC's Avatar
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    Great idea. Run it past your C.O. though. You don't want him to complain that he is being picked on.

    OR

    Better yet!!!

    Do it for all shooters! Drive the point home for everyone. Standard training exercise.
    Sean
    XD 9SC | XD 45ACP Service | XD 45ACP Compact |Borealis
    "You may know where you are. God may know where you are. If you don't tell your dispatcher where you are, you'd better be on speaking terms with God!"

  3. #3
    Member Array JudoJake's Avatar
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    Yea, I know. At some point reality will set in and I'll realize that I might get in trouble for it, but I'm not their yet. And I think at best I'll get chewed out for it. It might be worth it.

    I just thought about a good way to introduce the drill for the first time. Draw the outlines, but don't have them fill in the names until after they shoot.

    Thanks for the idea about doing it for everyone. Sounds basic enough, but I'm not thinking clearly on this issue. Thanks for leveling me out.

  4. #4
    Senior Member Array XD in SC's Avatar
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    It may work in your favor, but remember that when they are facing a REAL perp, with a human sheld, they are trained NOT to shoot.

    What are your dept. standards for:
    target size
    shots considered "on target"


    I have shot for fun against some local LEO, and they are taught to shoot COM, and that is all. They don't shoot for bullseye, so they aren't concerned with a tight grouping. I happen to practice more for a group, that way I am sure I can hit COM.

    If we shoot for group, I usually beat them.
    Sean
    XD 9SC | XD 45ACP Service | XD 45ACP Compact |Borealis
    "You may know where you are. God may know where you are. If you don't tell your dispatcher where you are, you'd better be on speaking terms with God!"

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    Distinguished Member Array sniper58's Avatar
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    I think XD's advice is great! Doing it for everyone will reinforce the need to make every shot count. We've all been told (I hope) from Day 1 that once you pull the trigger, there are no pause buttons, there are no do-overs - it's real time the first time and each shot has consequences. This exercise might save a life and someone's psychological fitness some day!
    Tim
    BE PREPARED - Noah didn't build the Ark when it was raining!
    Si vis pacem, para bellum
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    VIP Member Array AZ Husker's Avatar
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    Do it for all or none to avoid being in the hot seat after he files a grievance!
    Treat me good, I'll treat you better. Treat me bad, I'll treat you worse.

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    Member Array JudoJake's Avatar
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    XD, your advice on not training them to make hostage shots is "to an extent" received and understood. However It's not going to be set up as a hostage target. I'm just going to have them close by. Which is realistic when you think about officers exchanging rounds with somebody in a vehicle, where their is a passenger present, for instance.

    It is something to consider though, from a liability stand point(I can't believe I'm saying this). They might come back and say that they were trained to cut it close and shoot even when other people were close by. Maybe I will eliminate this as a problem by setting it up as a situational drill. For instance call it the "active shooter drill". If their was an on going loss of life, then shooting would be necessary, even if you had to cut it close.

    Thanks for the feed back.

  8. #8
    Senior Member Array XD in SC's Avatar
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    Just trying to keep your 'training' program on track, and law suit free.

    We JUST tonight had a class on Civil Liability.
    Sean
    XD 9SC | XD 45ACP Service | XD 45ACP Compact |Borealis
    "You may know where you are. God may know where you are. If you don't tell your dispatcher where you are, you'd better be on speaking terms with God!"

  9. #9
    Member Array JudoJake's Avatar
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    I have thought of another variation to this drill. This I would probably use while training SWAT operators, due to the fact that it is more of a Team building drill.

    I thought about having the operators draw a human outline and then write in their kids name or somebody else that they are close to and then switching targets with other operators. Now I'm responsible for not killing my buddies kid. We take and look after each other. It would underline the fact that you are only as strong as your weakest shooter.

    A variation on this and a tamer version would be to draw the outline and write your name on the target and then switch it up. That would be more mission specific and realistic. You would have to let everyone know that shooting at the target with your buddies name on it, instead of the real target, as a joke, would not be a taken as one. This would be a lot safer than standing in front of the target and trusting your buddy not to miss, but would underline the same principle of trust and accountability.

  10. #10
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    Array SIXTO's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JudoJake View Post
    This would be a lot safer than standing in front of the target and trusting your buddy not to miss, but would underline the same principle of trust and accountability.
    I've actually done this for SWAT... it builds confidence real quick, and I'll never do it again.

    I like your idea, and I don't think anybody would have a legit gripe if you did it for everybody on the range.
    "Just blame Sixto"

  11. #11
    Senior Member Array A1C Lickey's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JudoJake View Post
    A variation on this and a tamer version would be to draw the outline and write your name on the target and then switch it up. That would be more mission specific and realistic. You would have to let everyone know that shooting at the target with your buddies name on it, instead of the real target, as a joke, would not be a taken as one. This would be a lot safer than standing in front of the target and trusting your buddy not to miss, but would underline the same principle of trust and accountability.
    I like that. I think I might have to start doing that when we shoot in groups.
    TSgt. Lickey

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    and a high school education to fix'em!

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    I also would keep the "Innocents" Generic and without the name of his Wife and Kid on there.

    Great basic idea but, for sure I personally would opt for the photo hostage targets.

    Liberty Over Tyranny Μολὼν λαβέ

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    Member Array svinfinity45's Avatar
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    Generic targets might be a good idea for the guy you described, you never know what he might do after shooting his "wife" and "kid" with those other 20% of shots.
    "I'd rather have one and not need it, than need one and not have it!"

  14. #14
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    I think it'd be a great training method!
    I'm too young to be this old!
    Getting old isn't good for you!

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    VIP Member Array Supertac45's Avatar
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    Sounds like a positive idea.
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