Question for the IDPA guys

This is a discussion on Question for the IDPA guys within the Defensive Carry & Tactical Training forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; I do on average a couple of IPSC matches a year. I thought about increasing until the Steel Challenge came along with the USPSA this ...

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Thread: Question for the IDPA guys

  1. #1
    Ex Member Array Ram Rod's Avatar
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    Question for the IDPA guys

    I do on average a couple of IPSC matches a year. I thought about increasing until the Steel Challenge came along with the USPSA this past year, and the wife and I got really involved where we make every monthly match. My question is about the round count on the IDPA scene compared to my IPSC matches which normally run anywhere from 150-189 rounds minimum. In these times and conditions, I would think the minimum round count might be reduced, but I'm guessing it was set in time for any USPSA sanctioned event. Our club schedules most of the matches on weekends which pretty much coincides with our work schedules one way or another. But....there is an indoor range relatively close that does IDPA matches on a weekly basis on weekday evenings. What do you all shoot on average per match? It's a feasibility issue with me mainly, and I'd like continuing practice for me and my wife in the action shooting sports since I've got her hooked. We'll continue to do the Steel Challenge monthly for the year, but I want to get her into the action, and at twice the rounds fired, at least there could be some trade off as to at least not traveling as far or less rounds fired to get the same effect. Follow me?
    I'm not looking for pros and cons, one over the other, or what's best for what reason. Just what meets our current criteria. Thanks

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  3. #2
    VIP Member Array Blackeagle's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ram Rod View Post
    What do you all shoot on average per match?
    At our local matches, generally 50-100 rounds.

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    Member Array ghawk249's Avatar
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    The round count on any particular stage is no more than 18.

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    Distinguished Member Array Anubis's Avatar
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    About 100 per match.

  6. #5
    Ex Member Array Ram Rod's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ghawk249 View Post
    The round count on any particular stage is no more than 18.
    So how many stages in a match?

    Thanks. Looks like this would cut down on our round count by almost 50%.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ram Rod View Post
    So how many stages in a match?
    That is up to the club probably depending on time and space. We run 4-5 stages a match. Don't let the 18 round per stage fool you, if the stage is Vickers count, you are allowed (and probably will need) to shoot extra to make up for bad shot placement. Our rule of thumb is 120 rounds per 5 stage match.
    You have to make the shot when fire is smoking, people are screaming, dogs are barking, kids are crying and sirens are coming.
    Randy Cain.

    Ego will kill you. Leave it at home.
    Signed: Me!

  8. #7
    Senior Member Array HK Dan's Avatar
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    Ram,

    I normally run 7 stages and go for 60-75 rounds for IDPA. We try to keep USPSA under 100 rounds due to time considerations, but we've been known to exceed that.

    IDPA would be good for her. It's more relaxed than USPSA, for one thing. I advise beginners to start with IDPA to get used to the process and get into USPSA when they want to improve their gun handling skills...<g> Let's face it, of the two, USPSA is vastly superior with respect to identifying weaknesses in your style or technique.

    Now the caveat; Most USPSA shooters, especially the L10, Limited, or Open guys--HATE IDPA. It's too limiting. It's too scripted (and it is). They don't like retaining partial mags, using cover, or engaging targets in a specific order. It's one heck of a hurdle to jump at first.

    Next--not all IDPA clubs are created equal. Some run "USPSA Lite", which is a real disservice. We run solid defensive oriented stages with oddball start positions, short round counts (not every stage requires a mag change, ******), and try to test one skill that they can take home and practice (like retention draws). Some clubs just run USPSA stages--"How can we make it harder?" instead of "Could this really happen?". Nice, fun, but not IDPA.

    What do I mean? We've run stages where the shooter has 2 targets, 2 shots each, while being jostled by the score keeper to simulate bing in a crowd running from the threat. We did one where the shooter starts 6 feet from the target. At the beep he has 2 seconds to draw, clear a line 10 feet away and put two rounds in the target. We run it each way (L and R). 4 rounds. It's called "Get off the X"

    So, look for a solid, defensively oriented IDPA club who plays by the rule book (they don't all do that). PM your location and I'll help ya dig one up close by!

    Dan
    "What does Marcellus Wallace LOOK like?"

  9. #8
    Senior Member Array HK Dan's Avatar
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    Sorry--just noticed (duh) your location on your signature line.

    Here ya go!

    Benton Gun Club
    Benton, AR
    USA
    Club Match 4th Sat. of every month
    Ryan Reed
    Mobile: 501-952-9897
    Patrick Holsted
    Mobile: 501-766-4942

    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    Arkansas Combat Pistol League
    Berryville, AR
    USA
    2nd Sat.
    Carroll Lawrence
    Home: 870-423-2338
    Gary Dunlap

    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    Mountain Valley Sportsman's Association
    Hot Springs, AR
    USA
    1st Sun. after the 1st Sat.@ 1 pm and 3rd Sat. at 9 am.
    Larry Powell
    Home: 501-939-2788
    Work: 501-922-1045
    Fax: 501-922-6217
    Steve Freeman
    Home: 501-620-4374
    Work: 501-545-9939
    Fax: 501-318-6919

    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    Central A R Shooters Association
    Little Rock, AR
    USA
    3rd Saturday of every month
    Matt Mc Arthur
    Home: 501-333-2699 (range)
    Mobile: 501-920-5732

    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    Twin Lakes Gun Club
    Mountain Home, AR
    USA
    4th Sat. of each month
    Rick Watkins
    Home: 870-405-7256
    Work: 870-405-7256

    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    Pine Bluff Gun Club
    Pine Bluff, AR
    USA
    2nd Sat. of month
    Kyle Wood
    Home: 870-879-3834
    Mobile: 870-540-7388
    Michael Walls

    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    Sturm's I D P A
    Springdale, AR
    USA
    every other Tues.
    Steve Sturm
    Work: 479-927-2244

    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    Ozark Tactical Shooters
    Tonitown (Ozark Sportsman Supply), AR
    USA
    3rd Mon. of every month
    Jon Hodoway
    Mobile: 479-430-0103
    "What does Marcellus Wallace LOOK like?"

  10. #9
    Senior Member Array Chevyguy85's Avatar
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    the most stages i've seen @ my range is 7 stages and thats only on the july 4th type match where they make a "red white and blue" stage that is just for fun and not a sanctioned stage. With my terrible shooting and paranoia about having a poor shot i usually shoot between 100-120 per normal match of 6 stages. regardless i don't recall going over 150 yet. hopefully i'll make it to the match this sunday

  11. #10
    VR4
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    My local club we run 8 stages and shoot about 100-150 rounds. At another club they run 5-6 stages and shoot 100 rounds because of the time limit on the range.

  12. #11
    VIP Member Array edr9x23super's Avatar
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    When IDPA was formed, it was agreed upon that the match directors and stage designers would keep the round counts under 100 rounds when and where possible; this was done for 2 reasons:

    1) To attract the average shooter, who could compete by purchasing 2 boxes of ammo at wal-mart, etc.
    2) To neutralize the equipment race (and the money race) as much as possible.

    I was a founding member of IDPA and still shoot with them as much as I can. I was there during the good years in USPSA (1987-91) when the gear to win with was a single stack 1911 and 4 spare mags, as well as the bad years (1996-2003) in USPSA when membership was dropping and lots of folks (me included) had become very disillusioned with the equipment race and all of the problems with sand bagging (and grand bagging) during big matches, etc. The matches in USPSA got way away from Jeff Cooper's intended purpose for the competitions and became 200 round shoot-a-thons. Your minimum investment to be competitive was around $3000 for limited, $4000 for open.

    In contrast, Bill Wilson and the gang that founded IDPA came up with the idea that a person could spend less than $600 for guns and gear, buy a couple boxes of ammo and have no problem competing; I remember shooting the Area 4, 5 & 7 championships back in 1995 and participating in some of those discussions with Bill, Ken Hackathorn and others who had become fed up with all of the crybabies and prima donnas and gamesters that took over USPSA in the 1990s....

    Now it is my understanding that IDPA is about as big as USPSA, which I think is a great thing. Especially since USPSA has had to put in a production division for normal people with normal equipment.
    "Guard with jealous attention the public liberty. Suspect everyone who approaches that jewel. Unfortunately, nothing will preserve it but downright force. Whenever you give up that force, you are inevitably ruined". - Patrick Henry

  13. #12
    Ex Member Array Ram Rod's Avatar
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    Thanks HK Dan for some very informative posts. We go to Sturm's range once in a while, and we've shot at the Ozark Tactical Shooters (Ozark Sportsman) place before. I used to work down the road from Sturm's Range and their IDPA matches started at 6pm weekday evenings, and I got off work at 7pm. Steve and I (the owner) have known each other for quite some time. He was my instructor for my state certified CCW class, and I knew him before then and used the indoor range. I was one of the early yearly dues paying members there. Very nice setup, and even tried out his 100yd rifle range. It was my work schedule that messed things up.
    CASA (the club in Little Rock) is sort of linked to my current affiliation with the Old Fort Gun Club in Ft Smith. But the distance and my wife's work schedule dictate we stay closer to home on the weekends, or it won't happen at all. We do the 130 mile round trip once a month now with no problem other than lack of sleep for her. Right now, the wife and I are pretty much dedicated to the steel challenge matches through Nov, and at least we can dedicate the time and effort to do that. My wife needs to get comfortable and improve in this first, and she's telling me, and I know. I do think we would be best off doing the IDPA matches in the future although outside the club. The trade off with time and miles driven alone would be worth it. We've pretty much dedicated our time off or our work schedule changes, and our allotment of ammo per month for these Steel Challenge matches.
    Y'all have been most helpful. I appreciate it.

  14. #13
    Senior Member Array HK Dan's Avatar
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    Heck, Ram, it's all part of the service...<g>

    Remember the "not all created equal" part, my friend. Don't judge the sport on a single bad club (assuming that you find one of those). The hallmark of IDPA will be solid, defensive oriented stages with low round counts.

    I LOVE stages with oddball start positions. By that I mean, something that might happen to you but you never think to practice. In one, they started on top of Harry, our 110 pound dummy. They had to keep the weak arm across his neck and maintain sternum to sternum contact while engaging 3 targets at different angles. It's harder than ya think--the gun was upside down for 2 of 'em...<g>

    We had 1 where they start by NAILING a 100 pound heavy bag. That swung out and tipped a popper over--then they could draw and engage 2 targets. A lot of 'em forgot that the bag was coming back...<g> Yes, we were perfectly safe doing it, and it opened a few eyes. "HELLO? GET OFF THE X"...LOL

    Dan
    "What does Marcellus Wallace LOOK like?"

  15. #14
    Distinguished Member Array Agave's Avatar
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    We usually shoot about 60.
    The preceding post may contain sarcasm; it's just better that way. However, it is still intended with construction and with the Love of my L-rd Y'shua.

    NRA Certified Pistol Instructor, Tennessee Certified Instructor

  16. #15
    Member Array Scouse's Avatar
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    IDPA has (IMHO) brought reality into the practical shooting sports.

    Not to confuse an IDPA match with a training program, but it can not be bad to draw from your carry holster, a carry pistol, and shoot from different positions, differing amounts of rounds, under stress, concealed!

    And it's fun, 6 stages, 100 rounds, make for a good mornings shooting, but as the word gets out, more competitors, longer days.

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