Whats your best folding fighter? - Page 3

Whats your best folding fighter?

This is a discussion on Whats your best folding fighter? within the Defensive Knives & Other Weapons forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; I have a Commander from Emerson with the wave. It works very well, but it is hard on your pockets. I use mine in a ...

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Thread: Whats your best folding fighter?

  1. #31
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    I have a Commander from Emerson with the wave. It works very well, but it is hard on your pockets. I use mine in a kydex belt holster that can be worn & deployed quickly, without tearing your pockets up.

    In the last picture you can see where the wave catches in the slot & opens the knife as you pull it out, pretty slick idea.
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  2. #32
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    The best folding fighter?

    Hard question, everyone has their own idea of what that might require.

    Here's my thoughts on a fighting folder though:

    No linerlocks, even high end folders by reputable sources have been known to collapse under stabbing or lateral torgue. By the nature of the design itself, the lock may be fine today and not be tomorrow due to wear of the liners angle.

    Someone mentioned the civilian, nice knife but limited in it's stabbing ability and the tip is very prone to break with hard use or if it catches a zipper or other hard target.

    paknheat mentioned the voyagers. For the money they are sturdy reliable folders and would serve well IMO. One of the reasons is due to the locking system being a lockback design.

    My own preference to folders runs to lockbacks for defensive purposes. They are not prone to releasing under hard stresses/pressure applied on the blades. It takes years for them to wear to the point of failure if they are quality to begin with.

    My own choice for a folder would be a lockback like the Chinook or Chinook2 designed by Jim Keating. I used to test folders and you can see some of those tests here if you want to take a look:

    http://www.folders-r-us.org/full_tests.htm

    Another mentioned a Kerambit. There are two tests of that type of blade on the link as well. Kerambit designed folders would make very good defensive folders, but not without some specific training in that type of blades use, perhaps by Steve Tarani or another who is less well known by most but as well versed in the art of all defenses including blades named Ray Dionaldo out of Fla.

    If blade length was not an issue, and weight of the folder was not a concern, you could look at the Extrema Ratio folders. I've had two of them and they are as heavy duty as you'll find anywhere.

    The other would be this one: http://knifeoutlet.com/shop/10expand...ductcode=dosfc

    I have this knife, and tested it for strength hard here:

    http://www.darkopsknives.com/docs/Da...ter_Review.pdf

    You'll see me standing on the knife handle while the blade is wedged into cinder blocks in my back yard. It's a lockback design, of course.

    http://www.darkopsknives.com/docs/St...ength_test.pdf

    That link above is the lock strength test of the Stratofighter as well. The knife still sits in my collection of folders and suffered no damage during the testing.

    Brownie
    Last edited by AzQkr; July 22nd, 2006 at 03:51 PM.
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  3. #33
    Member Array Cole's Avatar
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    Hello Folks

    Just gonna have to throw my two cents in here. I ran across a knife that I am really impressed with that would meet the criteria of being a folding fighter.

    It's called the Emerson Comrade MF.



    Here are it's specifications.

    Overall Length (inches): 8.85
    Blade Length (inches): 3.90
    Blade Material: 154CM, Satin
    Blade Detail: ComboEdge
    Handle Material: Titanium/G10
    Lock Style: Liner Lock
    Carry System: Pocket Clip

    I'm not gonna tell you that I've had any actual experience with this particular Emerson knife because I haven't. I've held it in my hand and toyed with it a bit is about it. I hate to give an opinion with that little bit of information.

    However, I've had some friends that picked up a slew of these for their unit and they love them. This knife is extremely sturdy and holds a great edge. I guess what lures me is the grip. If you've had any knid of experience with combat knife training you will love the way this thing balances in your hand.

    There are several models of this knife out there and are known as the CQC 12. I believe some folks have already mentioned the CQCs earlier. Just add my vot to theirs.

    Anyway, I will own one of these pretty soon if I've got to skip the truck payment. There actually not priced too terribly bad. They are usually priced in the high 200s to the low 300s. Well worth it though.

    Take care,
    Cole

  4. #34
    Distinguished Member Array fed_wif_a_sig's Avatar
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    Man I love this forum. Honest opinions and a great resource.

    Brownie your comments are very well taken. Training with the krambit when they first came out was fantastic (a instructor in NJ who is now making contract money) but I never did fall in love with them. However I will take a real close look at the Dark Ops knives. Havent run into their stuff before and your insite is great.

    Cole...your two cents are just what I was asking for. As you read in my origional post, I love Emmerson. I own several and my CQC-7 in on me at this time and travels with me always. It has seen its share of work and is time to be retired with honor. You will never find another knife better than an Emmerson (maybe as good as but never better....Ernest knows knives and works with real world folks to use them).

    Thanks again all and please take time to tell me about your choice in the Auto field in the other post, as I'm torn between an auto or manual opening.

    Till then......Check 6
    Steve
    "Respect all ... Fear none!!!

  5. #35
    VIP Member Array ccw9mm's Avatar
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    My best folder is a Combat Elite RRF. The ergonomics of this knife are incredible. It really fits the hand (well it's a Darrel Ralph design, which speaks for itself). This is the smallest knife that, to me, would feel secure enough in the hand for self-defense.

    http://www.combatelite.com/1_mainfra...ail.shtml~main
    I've got a Spyderco C41BBK Native. It's similar to the Combat Elite RRF, in SV30 steel, roughly the same dimensions, about 40% lighter. Hard to compare ergonomics, but with my smaller hands it fits well. Extremely easy to open and bring to bear. About the smallest I'd want to have, if it came down to it. Inexpensive. Extremely sharp.
    Last edited by ccw9mm; July 23rd, 2006 at 04:52 PM.
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  6. #36
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    fed_wif_a_sig;

    Lots of controversy on the Dark Ops products comes up due to their hyped advertising, many not preferring to buy due to that issue. That and they are loosely designed around the Extrema Ratio products which the owner of Dark Ops used to run here in the US for them.

    The feature upgrades over the Extrema Ratio products were necessary IMO. The ER's having a handle that was too smooth and slippery even when not wet for mine and others tastes. ER would not listen to their buying audience so Frank Miller went out on his own with Dark Ops.

    I ordered my Stratofighter long before they went into production and received one of the first 10 off the production line, mine being serialized with my initials and old investigaive number for me.

    If it had failed the testing I put that through, I would have reported as that as well. There were some initial bugs in some of the folders that got worked out. One thing you can count on with DOK is that if there is a problem Frank will take care of it for you and make it right.

    The steel holds a fantastic edge, it is not a slicing thin edge but very stout and more like a small axe edge, being made for hard use. As such, a lot of people do not like it.

    It has a small flat on the spine with which you can pound on to drive the edge into something like a wedge if you had to with no damage to the blade.

    Did you see the damage that Kerambit did to my wrist before I actually knew how to move one of those in my hands properly?

    I like those two K's because they are lockback designs and the lock has to be fuly depressed or the blade will not release itself by design.

    Brownie
    The mind is the limiting factor

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  7. #37
    VIP Member Array artz's Avatar
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    My only folder fighter is the Benchmade Griptillian w/o serrated edges.
    I have had this knife about 4 years and at under $60, it was a heck of a deal.....
    My question is why do you figure Benchmade moved away from the hole opener in the blade to the small attachment that can snag,etc. while in-carry ?

  8. #38
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    My question is why do you figure Benchmade moved away from the hole opener in the blade to the small attachment that can snag,etc. while in-carry ?

    Licensing fees with Spyderco?

    Brownie
    The mind is the limiting factor

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  9. #39
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    Quote Originally Posted by absit
    While you own better knives already, I have to vote for the CRKT M16-13. It's cheap, sturdy, good steel, and a workhorse. If something goes horribly wrong, buy a new one without crying about it. It's my EDC.

    +1 on the CRKT M16-13 Ihave carried a M16 series for a while.
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  10. #40
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    http://www.folders-r-us.org/full_tests.htm see the sept 2002 test under "knife tests" to the left of the main page.

    The crkt's are not designed to be used very hard without bending or snapping the tips off. The tanto blades are a little better but their heat treat is wanting for serious work IMO.

    The link above shows what happens when the tip meets any hard resistance like rib, skull or other bone. As a fighting folder, it leaves much to be desired from the testing.

    Brownie
    The mind is the limiting factor

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  11. #41
    VIP Member Array Redneck Repairs's Avatar
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    Personaly i carry the m16 , it aint pretty or sexy but it works , and if i accidentlly leave it somewhere i am not out much . ( i am not speaking crime scene or social work i speak to ranch work ) I have a fiew pretty knives but really only enjoy looking at them , not useing them lol .
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  12. #42
    Distinguished Member Array fed_wif_a_sig's Avatar
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    After reading the link provided to folders-r-us my impressions are interesting. He really has bad luck with Emmersons and I presonally swear by them. Just today I went again and looked at the M-16 by CRKT and walked away with a Ka-Bar Law Enforcement knife. Wow there neat. Dosent stop the search but its still kewl. I leave tomorrow for a few days but when I'm back I might do a review if anyones interested.

    Still searching and thanks for your suggestions guys.
    Steve
    "Respect all ... Fear none!!!

  13. #43
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    fed_wif_a_sig;

    The site admin/owner lives in Greece. He initially had a problem with his Emerson, at a time when Ernie was having some QC issues.

    I talked with Ernie and he soved Johns problem by sending him another knife in the same model. Thats how I got involved with that site initially as the person who tested the folders until this last 18 months when I moved to the free state of Az.

    I think Emersons are a good bang for the buck for the most part myself, but I dont own any presently, though have in the past. I'm not partial to linerlocks for serious work [ SD or around the barn ] due to their being linerlocks and the tendency for them to wear quickly to the point they fail while in use.

    If the lock fails, fingers get cut or cut off. Not a good thing.

    I now carry a straight blade, preferring them to folders which are broken when you buy them I know some are restricted from carrying their choice of straights and blade length, when I was in that situation, I carried the stoutest locking folders I could find.

    Brownie
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  14. #44
    Distinguished Member Array fed_wif_a_sig's Avatar
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    Ok we're down to a few choices. First due to my love of Emerson's I am looking at the Mini-Commander BTS Wave. Its blade is the same as what I'm use to and its an Emerson. The next is a Benchmade 4200 Auto Resistor, heard good things about it but havent done much as far as Benchmade goes and I only own two. The final is the Benchmade Auto OTF Infidel which is very expensive and hard to find but man now thats an operators dream. If you've had any experience with any of these I'd appriciate the input. Thanks.

    Steve
    Steve
    "Respect all ... Fear none!!!

  15. #45
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    Better folding fighters will have the following attributes IMO, in no specific order.

    1. Sturdy point/tip that will not break or bend when stabbed into hard targets.

    2. Steel that can take a good edge and hold it which means you need to start with a steel that can take a heat treated properly, and is heat treated to the steels optimum performnce [ each steel will be different in this regard ].

    3. A lock that can withstand lateral/side forces when pressure is applied to laterally to the blade.

    4. A lock that can withstand the forces of hard stabbing and not collapse or release itself under those stresses.

    5. A lock that has to be fully disengaged before it releases the blade [ like the Chinook and Stratofighter ] by design.

    6. A blade edge geometry that is not to thin [ to chip out on bone ], nor too thick [ to not cut effectively with mimimal force applied to flesh/meat ] and has an optimum grind based on it's length and use parameters.

    7. A handle shape that does not create wrist fatigue with use.

    8. Handle materials used that are of sufficent structure to not warp, be affected by solvents and other fluids, is not slippery when wet, and yet is not so abrasive as to be rough on the hands when in use.

    If you can find a folder that fits most of these criteria, you are going to be okay.

    You'll have to prioritize the above to fit your own ideas of what you are not willing to compromise on and others that you can live with if not met.

    Myself, lock strength is number one in any folder I'll use. It's a folder, and as such without the lock of sufficent strength and safety begs disaster when Mr. Murphy comes calling just when you need it most.

    Brownie
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