Expandable Baton's - Useful?

Expandable Baton's - Useful?

This is a discussion on Expandable Baton's - Useful? within the Defensive Knives & Other Weapons forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; In thinking about the various ways we can defend ourselves against the bad guys I got to thinking about the legal issues and also why ...

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Thread: Expandable Baton's - Useful?

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    Member Array Boomer928's Avatar
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    Expandable Baton's - Useful?

    In thinking about the various ways we can defend ourselves against the bad guys I got to thinking about the legal issues and also why using a firearm is a last resort method for me personally.

    Like many, I carry a knife, which I honestly think of a tool more than a defensive weapon but it does both.

    About a year ago expandable baton's became legal to carry in AZ so I did some research and found a 21" Fury model that looked good and was on sale at the site I ordered it from for under $20 shipped. It came in today and I gotta say I would not want to be on the receiving end of that bad boy. It will be great for keeping a wild dog off of me and my dogs if need be too. If a dog, or a person for that matter, was hit in the head with one of these things I seriously doubt they would be around later to talk about it so the head is definitely off limits.

    This thing can fit in a front pocket and be deployed in a second. For close up defense it might even be better than a firearm.

    Anyone else thought about carrying one these to prevent the need for a firearm or knife or to protect ones self from either of those up close? I have zero training with one so that will be one thing I look at getting soon; even it's simply from videos.
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    Ex Member Array flaguns's Avatar
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    just like anything else, learning how to properly use the tool is crucial. if you could find a trainer to teach you that would be great and at a minimum you should seek out the many how to videos on the net to learn how to properly deploy and strike someone for maximum effect.
    the baton is a very effective non lethal weapon but if used improperly it can become a very lethal weapon.

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    Distinguished Member Array Wunderneun's Avatar
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    Do get some training if you are going to carry one of these. You would be surprised at what you can do with these and how you can do it. Size disparity decreases immensely with the correct and proper use of the collapsible baton.
    Ghost1958 likes this.
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    JD
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    We have a couple (and have received training) the thing I like about them is that I can carry it in a few places that are no gun zones etc. In the case of Lima, she has a 12" baton which is all bout the smallest available but the only thing she can conceal and it extends her reach pretty well to give her some more breathing room against somebody that might need an adjustment without being shot.



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    mkh
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    I have a16 inch one that I sometimes carry but have found little use for. Still is good to have different levels of force at you disposal.

    Like others said get some training. It s really more for soft targets as it could do some serious damage if used against someone's head.

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    Distinguished Member Array squid86's Avatar
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    i carried one while i was working with the MA's in the Navy doing security work. they will definitely get the job done but the person will have to get closer to you for you to be able to defend yourself. for personal use i feel them to be alittle heavy to be comfortable in my pocket. i would opt for good pepper spray. you can get distance and some have markers in it.
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    Member Array JTChance's Avatar
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    I used to be an ASP trainer and carried one as a LEO but only used it twice. I usually opted for OC (pepper spray) so I did not have to get so close to an adversary. Only once did OC fail to immediately stop aggressive behavior, but I will take those results.

    As a civilian, I still prefer pepper spray to impact weapons and carry it to this day for several reasons:

    1. There is no chance of blood borne infections from a cut (yes, a baton can cause a cut).
    2. I can maintain a good distance from the aggressor.
    3. It is much more difficult to pry a little bottle of OC out of my hand than to grab a baton out of my hand.
    4. OC wears off quickly, leaves no lasting marks, and there is no chance of causing permanent damage with a strike to the joint or the head . It is harder to sue when you cannot show a jury pictures of the big bruises and medical bills from an impact weapon.

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    Senior Member Array 19Kvet's Avatar
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    I've been thinking about one to carry while walking the dog- shooting a dog attacking mine is legal problems I don't need and I'm looking for a good solution to address that situation. A woman in the neighborhood carries an old billy club but she's tiny and doesn't look menacing with it- I might.

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    I think that you also have to consider that there is a possibility the baton could be taken
    from you if your not using it correctly.
    As others have said, take time the to get training and/or watch videos.
    A blow to the body above the shoulder could be lethal.
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    New Member Array Lee 1973's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by 19Kvet View Post
    I've been thinking about one to carry while walking the dog- shooting a dog attacking mine is legal problems I don't need and I'm looking for a good solution to address that situation. A woman in the neighborhood carries an old billy club but she's tiny and doesn't look menacing with it- I might.
    Don't underestimate little ladies. They may surprise you.
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    Distinguished Member Array 5lima30ret's Avatar
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    They are a very useful self defense tool! Like some of the others said training in its' use and deployment are critical! I was one of first ASP tactical baton instructors at my agency. It was a big improvement over the straight batons and PR-24's that we used to carry. Bear in mind that strikes to the head/ neck area are considered deadly force in most jurisdictions! Many states like mine expandable batons are illegal to carry concealed even with a CWP. As a side note they are VERY effective at breaking auto glass (much better than the PR-24). I would definitely not reccomend carrying one without some training in its use. Good luck!
    Retired Police Lieutenant, Retired USAF Reserve, Glock Armorer, NC CWP, HR-218 Qualified
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    Distinguished Member Array BadgerJ's Avatar
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    It appears that it's legal in Az. New Arizona CCW Law

    They only prohibit when attacked by a chain or rope (nunchaku).

    I would caution you against using it out of state, or on a person who was unarmed, or on a female, regardless of reason. I would also suggest that if you concealed it you have an Arizona Permit. I believe that in Az they have a CCW law that covers other than firearms if you have a permit. Carrying other than a pocket knife is actionable if you don't disclose.

    Also, agree with use of non-percussive methods. Now, using something like a cane is probably better, it serves as a 'keep away' barrier (push with tip). Don't hit with it, but create distance.

    Good luck! THose are definitely fun to play with at home.
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    Member Array JTChance's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SECGUY View Post
    I think that you also have to consider that there is a possibility the baton could be taken
    from you if your not using it correctly.
    As others have said, take time the to get training and/or watch videos.
    A blow to the body above the shoulder could be lethal.
    Excellent point that it can be taken away from you. Same goes for a gun; it is not yours, you just brought it to the fight.

    Years ago, I felt there a was need to teach weapons retention and takeaway techniques to LEOs. At the time, no one else in our area was teaching such a class and I had to develop my own techniques. To do so, I watched video of inmates in a prison exercise yard practicing how to disarm police officers; they were innovative and took it seriously. I sat down with some other trainers and we developed techniques to counter what we had seen the prisoners practicing.

    The moral of the story is: If the bad guys can disarm a trained LEO, they can disarm you. Learn and practice how to defend any weapon you carry, be it a gun, OC, or impact.
    Secret Spuk and Ghost1958 like this.

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    Senior Member Array 19Kvet's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jmattingly73 View Post
    Don't underestimate little ladies. They may surprise you.
    I don't. An ex-cop I knew in the army explained a legal phenomenon to me- he was 6'1" and went through a civilian oversight board after using his nightstick to subdue a suspect. His size was the primary issue- they felt that a big guy like that should use his inherent size and power instead of a weapon, however, a small guy or woman would have been justified in shooting the subject because of their small stature. He turned in his badge shortly after that and went back to active duty.

    This is a double standard of human bias and should be a concern for all of us when deciding to arm ourselves (with anything ) in civil society.

    She can probably take me but she won't get the cops called on her where as I might.

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    New Member Array Lee 1973's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by 19Kvet View Post
    I don't. An ex-cop I knew in the army explained a legal phenomenon to me- he was 6'1" and went through a civilian oversight board after using his nightstick to subdue a suspect. His size was the primary issue- they felt that a big guy like that should use his inherent size and power instead of a weapon, however, a small guy or woman would have been justified in shooting the subject because of their small stature. He turned in his badge shortly after that and went back to active duty.

    This is a double standard of human bias and should be a concern for all of us when deciding to arm ourselves (with anything ) in civil society.

    She can probably take me but she won't get the cops called on her where as I might.
    I was mostly joking with you but I have seen some firecrackers.

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