Need help with some carry decisions

This is a discussion on Need help with some carry decisions within the Defensive Knives & Other Weapons forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; First off, I would like to give a big howdy from Texas to everyone on the DefensiveCarry forums. But now onto business. Ive been trying ...

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Thread: Need help with some carry decisions

  1. #1
    Member Array Sgt.Rock's Avatar
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    Need help with some carry decisions

    First off, I would like to give a big howdy from Texas to everyone on the DefensiveCarry forums.



    But now onto business. Ive been trying to do research on Pepper Spray and Stun guns, but most of what I come up with is practically propaganda (for better and worse). So I was hoping to get some help from the experienced guys here. Ive got a few questions:

    -How effective is Pepper spray?
    -How effective are Stun guns (900k-1million volt)?

    That about sums up my real concerns, but I need some help with the actual decisions. Ive been looking at pepper sprays, and from what I can make out, the higher the OC concentration the better, but 10% is as high as I've found. Also, Im very unsure about the combination sprays, that have CN or CS tear gas mixed in as well; are they more effective, or do they just dilute the mixture? Also, I've heard Pepper sprays being made with some stuff more potent than OC but in the same chemical category, is it true?

    As for Stun guns, my worries about it increases. Are the mini-stun guns with thos short little prongs enough to get through clothing? Or would it be best to get a more "conventional" looking stun gun with the cm long prongs? Also, Ive heard of some stun guns using a higher wattage to cause greater muscular contractions, is that true? And finally, again, are they effective? Will 900k > take someone down within seconds? or a half-a-second?


    Really I'm looking for the most potent, deabilitating of both products, with money being of no object (within reasonable bounds). I am on a University Campus setting (in Texas though ) so that would be the reason for not just carrying a gun. Also, as for a knife, Ill have a benchmade soon, but I would like to have my non-lethal options open.




    P.S.- as a side note, someone this week just got robbed by a 220 lb black man on campus, and physical contact was involved.

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  3. #2
    Member Array normal's Avatar
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    There are two parts to the OC numbers. There is percentage of SHU's (Scoville Heat Units), example: 10% of 2,500,000 SHU's. The higher of each, the better. When I worked at a state maximum security prison, we used alot of OC. They are definately NOT all created equal. The good ones are definately worth carrying, however. We had really good experience with Punch II. That is what I carry daily now and have complete faith in it. I have heard good things about Fox labs, but have no experience with it.
    "To be prepared for war is one of the most effectual means of preserving peace" George Washington

  4. #3
    VIP Member Array Rob72's Avatar
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    Paul Gomez recommends Fox, IIRC, and has done up a nice review of the better OCs,over at TPI.

    Stun guns basically are good if you want to grab someone unsuspecting, but since I assume you aren't a kidnapper hunting petite women I wouldn't recommend them.

    Seriously, yes, they can have a "bite", but you have to be in agressive contact, and if you're doing that, whapping a BG on the head with a brick or hammering his head with a Maglight is much more effective. You aren't a Security Officer with backup, if it doesn't work, so...

  5. #4
    Member Array Sgt.Rock's Avatar
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    Gotcha, I'll keep away from the stun guns, but could you send me a link to the review? and what does TPI stand for?



    Thanks

  6. #5
    VIP Member Array KenpoTex's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sgt.Rock View Post
    Gotcha, I'll keep away from the stun guns, but could you send me a link to the review? and what does TPI stand for?



    Thanks
    Here ya go...

    TPI stands for Total Protection Interactive (It's another self-defense forum). link to the OC thread: http://www.totalprotectioninteractiv...t=pepper+spray

    and another good article on OC by James Yeager of Tactical Response
    http://www.tacticalresponse.com/medi...les/pepper.php

    also, stay away from stun-guns...they're crap.
    "Being a predator isn't always comfortable but the only other option is to be prey. That is not an acceptable option." ~Phil Messina

    If you carry in Condition 3, you have two empty chambers. One in the weapon...the other between your ears.

    Matt K.

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    I just did some resaerch today on tasers. I saw a thing on them on Fox news this morning. I'm looking into getting one for my daughter, she is 18. It will shoot 15 feet and costs about $350.00 with the laser on it. I believe without the laser it comes with a light that is like a flashlight. They are legal in most states (well except Illinois ).. Anyone know of any down sides to tasers ??
    Heres the link ( I hope )..http://www.taser.com/Pages/default.aspx

  8. #7
    Senior Member Array palmgopher's Avatar
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    my local sheriffs department uses fox labs stuff as does our local jail.....i guess that qualifies as a mark as to its effectiveness. or hell it could be politics....lol

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    Post No Need For You To Do The Research On This One

    It's already been done by nearly every PD in the country.

    FOX LABS or the New one out by J&L (same product) with a slightly greater range.

    Go Here
    http://www.selfdefenseproducts.com/

    J&L Self Defense Products. GREAT On Line Company.
    Their OC is always new stock. Shipping is FAST! They are Polite. Call them up and do your order by phone. My personal guarantee that you can give them your Credit Card #. Mine has been on file with them for years. I have ordered numerous times from them. Never a problem. Smooth Transaction. Your package will be on your doorstep in no time flat.

    They also have a lot of stun guns and there is a lot of helpful information there concerning stun guns.

    They do also have some fun stuff like blow guns and some other weird junk most importantly they sell a LOT of OC so it never sits on the shelf.
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    Ex Member Array something's Avatar
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    I went to the J&L site to get my fiance some fox spray.

    two questions:

    should i get fog or stream?

    should i get 2 oz or 4?

    thanks

  11. #10
    Member Array Sgt.Rock's Avatar
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    I called up fox labs themselves and ordered two 2oz. duty belt medium fog sprays with the safety latch.

    I went with the 2oz and safety plate because thats what would best fit in my pockets and the latch keeps pencils and other items in my pocket from shooting it off by accident.

    I also went with fog, since its a good medium for inhalation, distance and cross-contamination.

  12. #11
    Member Array bobernet's Avatar
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    I realize that LEOs are in a different situation than the rest of us (more specific rules of escalation, access to backup, etc), but nearly every department I'm aware of now issues tasers as part of a patrol officers normal equipment. If they flat out didn't work, I can't imagine they would go to the time and trouble of dealing with them.

    I don't know anything about specific brands/models so can't comment on that intelligently.

  13. #12
    Senior Member Array bzdog's Avatar
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    Taser is a brand and AFAIK, uses a much different technology from must of the advertised "stun guns". From the sounds of it, it is highly effective. Personally, I wouldn't even consider any other "stun" technology. There is a reason police use them.

    I've heard that OC sprays are hit and miss. Fox sounds to be one of the better ones, but some people are just less affected than others.

    The thing to remember about both OC spray and the Taser is that it is only going to give you a few seconds to either take control of the situation, or beat feet. As a result, neither are probably good for older or infirm people, who just can't get away fast enough or physically control someone.

    -john

  14. #13
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    Fox Labs. I would get the STREAM.
    Either 2 or 4 OZ. whatever you think is better for you.

    Helpful Hint.

    Do not spray test your Fox Labs when you get it.
    They are slightly over~filled and the each unit is tested before it goes out.
    That is part of what you pay for.
    It will work when you need it so do not test it when you get it.
    You are just wasting contents by doing that.
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  15. #14
    Ex Member Array something's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by QKShooter View Post
    Fox Labs. I would get the STREAM.
    Either 2 or 4 OZ. whatever you think is better for you.

    Helpful Hint.

    Do not spray test your Fox Labs when you get it.
    They are slightly over~filled and the each unit is tested before it goes out.
    That is part of what you pay for.
    It will work when you need it so do not test it when you get it.
    You are just wasting contents by doing that.

    thank you!

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