Flash lights as a weapon
This is a discussion on Flash lights as a weapon within the Defensive Knives & Other Weapons forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; So, I'm living in Japan right now. I'll probably be here for a bit of time. My Fiance and I are going to Thailand in ...
November 15th, 2008 06:54 AM
Flash lights as a weapon
So, I'm living in Japan right now. I'll probably be here for a bit of time. My Fiance and I are going to Thailand in December. To get to the point, I want some form of advantage in self defence. Guns, Knives over 2" blade, pepper spray, etc are all not allowed. I think the best bet would be a flash light. I'm not talking about buying a huge base ball bat of a flash light. I want intense brightness. It sounds lame, but a bright light in someones eyes will give me a quick advantage... depending on the situation of course.
So, I'm looking for information about this. What is a good brand, what's a good price range, brightest light available, etc.
November 15th, 2008 06:59 AM
I personally have a SureFire E2e. 60 lumens is plenty blinding and it a solid alluminum body. I actually dropped it out of my pocket at 45mph on my bike and then it got run over by a mini van and just got a few scratches. Also if you want to take it one step further you can get the E3d which has a strike bezel, which really hurts by the way. Abnd expect to spend from $70 to $110 estimate.
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When you see the light at the end of the tunnel your life is not over..... it is just about to begin
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November 15th, 2008 07:05 AM
I carry a surefire defender.
SureFire Flashlights & Tactical Lights
A friend of mine just bought a flashlight from LIOTEC. it has a low beam a high beam and a strobe light. the only problem i have is the low beam is first the high beam is 2nd and the strobe is last. if this for selfdefense i would think the strobe would be first. it is a little bigger than the defender and somewhat brighter. you can get a recharceable batterys as well.
WOLF-EYES P7 AND Q5 lights by LIOTEC
November 15th, 2008 07:42 AM
I have two SureFire's...
The E2e, which works well...60 lumens.
Then, there is my L-4 Luma Max...WOW!...100 lumens.
I can almost signal the ISS (International Space Station) with it...well, almost.
Either will work for you!
Stay armed...stay bright...stay safe!
Proverbs 27:12 says: “The prudent see danger and take refuge, but the simple keep going and suffer for it.”
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NRA Life Member
November 15th, 2008 07:47 AM
With the strobe feature, it could actually give you time to skeet on out.
I've tried it, had it done to me and it works.
I was skeptical at first, until one of the guys on shift tried it on me. When its dark out, and you look directly into it when it strobes, it really disorients you and you litteraly cant see for at least a minute.
Yes, they are high priced, but how much is your life worth?
That extra minute could be the difference.
hecks...the next step towards registration and confiscation.
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November 15th, 2008 08:41 AM
November 15th, 2008 09:58 AM
In most instances you would be suitably armed with a quality flashlight and a little training. My preferred EDC light is the Surefire L2 because of its first stage LED and that it is about the same size as a Kubaton.
My professional opinion on the Defender models or adding and impact bezel to a light is that they are not worth the trouble. As far as carrying them goes then tend to tear up clothes. If you were to use one they would find out the purpose of the light during discovery and use it against you especially civilly. It screams intent and turns and innocuous tool into an obvious weapon.
Last year at the NY Custom Knife Show I did a demo every day in front of Ernie Emerson's table where I did a one inch knuckle punch between the eyes of a different person each day. Each time it resulted in their knees buckling and them falling backwards into the arms of a guy behind them. My point is that we are talking concentration of force in a small surface area. A person struck between the eyes with a reg Surefire and a Defender model would be hard pressed to tell you the difference when they wake up.
When striking with the light concentrate on the face, neck and hands which are usually exposed even in cold weather. The collar bone is another good one that will deanimate the entire arm. There is also something I teach called a light n strike, try it with your friends. Take a light and strobe it across the eyes of you buddy, as he instinctively tracks the light, give him a little smack on the side of the head. He will never see it coming.
You have two different options when using the "light" as a "light". First when approached by someone you can blast them in the face with it along with a loud verbal command. This does several things. First of all it will likely make them close their eyes even if there is other ambient light. The second is that if they continue you can better articulate your case for a higher use of force since a reasonable person would likely conclude that usually a person would stop when a light is shined in their face and they are told to do so. The last and my favorite attribute of this technique is that a bright blast of light to the face usually results in the person bringing their hands towards their eyes allowing you to observe the hands.
The part about shining a light in someones that most people here are talking about is valuable because when our eyes slam shut and reopen they automatically focus forward. You can take advantage of this by moving hard left diagonally past your attacker. Since 93%+ of people are right handed this is likely his non reaction side and will allow you to damage him or get out of dodge.
November 15th, 2008 11:05 AM
+1 to mercop's above post. A little training goes a long way.
As far as individual lights, Surefires are nice but output and runtimes are poorer that what is available from other manufacturers. Tiablo A9 is my personal favorite. The light has selectable 256/60 lumens and long throw or wide beam reflectors, been all over North & Central America with me, and never failed despite the roughest abuse of search & rescue tasks. Others to look at include Fenix PD20, Fenix TK10, and Princeton Tec Genesis. Eagle Tac T10C2 is my most recent purchase. With only one month of use I will not strongly recommend it, but have seen only good results with it so far.
Batteries are a topic in itself. I you go with CR123A's or one of their rechargable substitutes make sure to take enough of a supply for where you plan to travel. I am not sure about Thailand, but have been in some countries where AA's/AAA's are hard to find and 123A's are impossible to find.
I generally like light bezel crenalation just incase the flashlight becomes a primary self defense tool. Stay away from the heavy sharp crenalated bezels as potentially difficult to defend in court, tear up clothing/holsters, and painful if you need to quickly/temporarily block the light output against your body.
November 15th, 2008 06:12 PM
Good points. I'll have to look into other options to toss around in my head. So a regular light will serve enough of a self defence tool without having to have a special bezel?
November 15th, 2008 07:14 PM
Agreed HG in regard to the Gladius.
I've had mine four years now and like you was a skeptic at first.
Since acquiring it with a 30 day money back promise I've found it to be worth the coin they charge.
I too have had it applied to myself and exactly as you state is exactly what occurs. Further it works great on dogs in the late evening, night, or early morning dusk. I tried it on a raccoon too and had same results. Frozen WTH is that?! stun effect.
I can only imagine how hateful it would be on a person who has wide open corneas due to alcohol or drug intake.
I plan to purchase a Borealis next for my wife toward HD use as otherwise she won't so much as even look at a 'weapon'.
"Killers who are not deterred by laws against murder are not going to be deterred by laws against guns. " - Robert A. Levy
"A license to carry a concealed weapon does not make you a free-lance policeman." - Florida Div. of Licensing
November 15th, 2008 10:13 PM
I was prowling in a pawn shop and found a nearly new E2E Executive Elite by Surefire for $40.00 out the door, as compared to $75 to $95 elsewere. At first I thought I had lost my mind paying that much for a flashlight after a few days I don't think I could justify buying a cheap light. The E2E is heavy duty enough to use as a weapon as well as being a fine flashlight.
November 15th, 2008 10:21 PM
The Tomahawk ST is a powerful light. In strobe mode, it could be a very useful tool. I keep mine in my turnout gear as a backup/emergency light, but it could easily be an offensive tool against a BG. It puts out 120 lumens I believe.
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November 16th, 2008 12:17 AM
This is a timely topic for me, as I will be flying to CA next month and therefore be unarmed. I think I will have to invest in a good flashlight for wandering around the city.
So what makes a Fenix TK10 $74 and a Gladius $187.49? The differences I see are a deeper waterproof depth and a strobe feature... not much else, to my completely untrained eyes.
How does one go about buying their first "tactical" light? minimum lumens? is strobe necessary? I know a few things, like I want it to be shock resistant, momentary tailcap with continuous on feature, around 5.5-8" in length, water resistant, and bright (how bright?). It seems you can spend any amount of money you want for a flashlight- the question is, how much do you need to spend? what other minimum features?
A thank you to the OP, this is a very helpful topic! I have enjoyed this discussion so far :)
November 16th, 2008 12:23 AM
I knocked more noggins with my 4 cell Maglight than I ever did with a baton. But sadly, those were the old days...
Treat me good, I'll treat you better. Treat me bad, I'll treat you worse.
November 16th, 2008 02:48 AM
When I travel to japan i always carry a tactical flashlite. I've never had any trouble, and walked some of the worst streets late at nite. I love Japan haha. My latest light I'd carry is a fenix pd20. Very bright, very small, and has an amazing strobe. I think I'd be far less likely to be hassled by the tiny popo's over there if I had a palmsize flashlite, as opposed to a minimag size one with a strike bezel on it. I also love my pd20 because I can turn it way down to low, for reading maps and papers in the back of a cab.... half my time in Japan it seems.
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