Reality check, please, on related gear.

Reality check, please, on related gear.

This is a discussion on Reality check, please, on related gear. within the Defensive Knives & Other Weapons forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; I'm interested in the wisdom of the group here with respect to my non-firearm self-defense options (I work in a no-weapons building, and wish to ...

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Thread: Reality check, please, on related gear.

  1. #1
    Distinguished Member Array Paymeister's Avatar
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    Reality check, please, on related gear.

    I'm interested in the wisdom of the group here with respect to my non-firearm self-defense options (I work in a no-weapons building, and wish to keep my job).

    Personal Characteristics:
    • 53 years old, way out of shape, and have occasional back and knee problems;
    • 6' 3" or so, 420 lbs, with gorilla-like shoulders and arms (and physiognomy);
    • I was last in a fight in 7th grade and decided that I didn't like them (though I used to break up fights when I taught);
    • I avoid questionable parts of town and lead a retiring lifestyle;
    • Twenty years ago I almost maced a guy, but that's it for any real excitement;
    • I have my own office with a solid door and no windows, and I'm 30 feet from a fire exit (straight shot across cubicle-land) and 35 feet from the main employee entrance (through two doors);
    • I can shoot on my own property and expect to burn a lot of ammo this year;
    • I have never had any knife training;
    • My wife carries and our daughter is usually off at college.

    Current Equipment:
    • Where legal I carry a 9mm 15-round sidearm (and certainly not at work);
    • I ALWAYS carry a very bright metal 2AA flashlight and a cell phone;
    • I just ordered a "900 lumen" flashlight - no, I don't believe it either, but it's likely to be really, really bright and it has a strobe function;
    • I used to carry pepper spray, but lost it somewhere amid all of my junk.
    • VA law says 3" or more folding knives are illegal at schools; by extension, I could probably carry a <3" pocket knife at work, but certainly not a Gecko45 model (maybe that 'cute' little Boker Subcom?);
    • I really could use a knife for farm-related tasks, at least occasionally.

    Sounds to me like I should probably:
    • Continue to carry where I can (and train);
    • Rely on pepper spray and a powerful flashlight where I can't carry (and have those on me all the time).
    • If I want more options in the workplace I should consider a cane (especially given my weight and bad knees).
    • Consider buying the Boker just because I need a good knife and it's tiny enough to pass inspection;
    • But give up on any thoughts of using a knife in a self-defense situation and rather plan on strobe-or-spray-and-run: better to recognize my lack of training and my physical limitations than to walk any further down the fantasy path.

    Thoughts?
    Recently updated website: http://www.damagedphotorepair.com


  2. #2
    Ex Member Array Ram Rod's Avatar
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    Have you ever practiced with throwing stars? You know...the martial arts places sell these. They are sharp enough to stick in plywood! I got very good with these in my younger years...along with a lot of other martial arts weapons. On a more serious note...what about extending batons? The mace or pepper spray might be a good alternative, but I'd get the strongest available. I'd still carry a legal length pocket knife for sure. I figure a non-lethal bean-bag shotgun under your desk would be out of the question. You know...I'm thinking some other not so user friendly or easy to operate take down a BG scenarios.......like a can of charcoal lighter fluid and a butane lighter.....you know, you can squirt a stream of fluid over ten feet with those plastic or metal cans! Would setting a BG on fire be against the terms of warfare here? Cruel and unusual punishment? I can't honestly answer that myself.

  3. #3
    Distinguished Member Array Chooie's Avatar
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    American Cane

    They were recommended by Mas Ayoob on PDTV. Having an offset T handle (90 degree) on a proper hardwood cane, along with maybe a day's worth of training, would serve you well.

  4. #4
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    Are you'all going to continue to joke around in this thread? - just let me know VIA Private Mail and I'll gladly move it over to Off Topic & Humor.

    If you're looking for serious answers then please try to keep it serious.

  5. #5
    Distinguished Member Array Paymeister's Avatar
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    Serious answers wanted; joking is awfully hard to stop (please accept my apologies: I deleted mine).

    I already have a nice blackthorn stick (though with rounded head); where would one go for training? I suppose my daughter's Krav Maga teacher would be a good start. Any other ideas?

    I'm not keen on carrying the stick as it occupies a hand at all times. On the flip side, that means it's at the ready at all times, too. And I would prefer to stay a couple of feet farther away in a 'situation', too.
    Recently updated website: http://www.damagedphotorepair.com

  6. #6
    Member Array carver's Avatar
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    Ask your daughters teacher for help. If her teacher is not qualified to teach you what you need to know, then maybe they know someone who is. There are also books on the art of stick fighting, you can find them at your local library, or neighborhood book store. You can also find some short instructions on line. A stick is a great choice for when you can not carry a gun. I have been using one for many years. In the hands of a trained person, they win hands down in any fight, one on one, except those that have guns involved. You might find some one who can teach you what you need to know, and once you start taking classes; well, you just might get hooked, and find a new past time!
    Y'all be safe now, ya hear!

    The democracy will cease to exist when you take away from those who are willing to work and give to those who would not.
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  7. #7
    Member Array Mxyzptlk's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Paymeister View Post
    Sounds to me like I should probably:
    Continue to carry where I can (and train);
    Rely on pepper spray and a powerful flashlight where I can't carry (and have those on me all the time).
    If I want more options in the workplace I should consider a cane (especially given my weight and bad knees).
    Consider buying the Boker just because I need a good knife and it's tiny enough to pass inspection;
    But give up on any thoughts of using a knife in a self-defense situation and rather plan on strobe-or-spray-and-run: better to recognize my lack of training and my physical limitations than to walk any further down the fantasy path.
    Thoughts?
    Think, think, think.
    Realistically, as you apparently are doing.

    The pepper spray is a fine idea. Really a very wise choice in a lot of situations.

    Consider a Taser. The new C2 is about $300 and capable of a) saving your life, and b) being legal in a lot of places a gun is not. Check your local laws and workplace rules.

    ALWAYS carry your cell phone. It can save your life in so many ways and, obviously, too, can get the cavalry on the way.

    Always try to look for an out. The very best strategy for self-preservation is to not be where some anti-social attack is taking place. Often, as such an attack is developing, there is a small window to escape. But the window may be open only a short time--like 1 second. If you know where the exits are and your position in relation to them, you can take to immediate flight. Even when hindered by physical limitations, decisive flight can be accomplished--especially when the adrenaline is pumping.

    Think, think, think. Realistically.

  8. #8
    Distinguished Member Array Chooie's Avatar
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    The thing about a cane with a 90 degree handle vs. a walking stick is that you can use police baton techniques with the cane, including strikes, disarm, and control techniques. With a walking stick all you get are strikes.

  9. #9
    Member Array Ship A'Hoy's Avatar
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    I second the TASER C2, it gives you 30 seconds to get out of Dodge.
    "Success is not Final, Failure is not Fatal, it is the Courage to Continue that Counts"
    Sir Winston Churchill

  10. #10
    Member Array carver's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chooie View Post
    The thing about a cane with a 90 degree handle vs. a walking stick is that you can use police baton techniques with the cane, including strikes, disarm, and control techniques. With a walking stick all you get are strikes.
    Sir, I think I might be in disagreement with you on this one. Could you clairfy your use of the term "With a walking stick all you get are strikes". I am not an expert stick fighter, but have had some training. A stick is a stick. It doesn't matter what it's shapped like, they are all used in just about the same manner, and for the same reasons, depending on length.
    Y'all be safe now, ya hear!

    The democracy will cease to exist when you take away from those who are willing to work and give to those who would not.
    Thomas Jefferson

  11. #11
    Senior Member Array ronwill's Avatar
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    Member NRA, SAF and Georgiacarry.org
    “America will never be destroyed from the outside. If we falter and lose our freedoms, it will be because we destroyed ourselves.” Abraham Lincoln

  12. #12
    Distinguished Member Array MinistrMalic's Avatar
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    I have a motto: Springfield from 12' out; Kenpo from 12' in. Even if you are carrying in bed and in the shower you must realize that there may arise a situation that requires you to defend yourself before you can draw a firearm. Those are the instances for martial arts training, IMAO.

    I study Ed Parker American Kenpo; I have done so for about 2 1/2 years and I find it helps my health and is a great stress reliever. Find a good, fun martial arts instructor who takes self defense seriously but not him- or herself and study awhile. We study stick fighting, knife fighting, and even gun control in addition to unarmed combat.

    If you're well-rounded in your ability to defend yourself you will run less risk of being overwhelmed in a conflict.
    "...whoever has no sword is to sell his coat and buy one." (Luke 22:36)
    Christianity and Self Defense from a Biblical Perspective

  13. #13
    Distinguished Member Array Paymeister's Avatar
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    Yeah, but...

    Yeah, but... (I'm sure many expected that, so here it is):
    • Financially, I could afford a few hours with my daughter's Krav Maga teacher but not much more. I might be able to spring for a stick-fighting video;
    • Physically, I can't imagine much more than upper body stuff - certainly not the jogging around the mat or [shudder] calisthenics. I do have arm and shoulder strength, so stick work is sounding reasonable.

    I am trying to be realistic here, and I really do recognize that I'm asking for something for nothing (hey, I want to fly, too, OK?). I don't expect to be properly trained - ever. I just want to be a good steward within my constraints of time, cash, work rules, and physical limitations.

    And, yes, losing a couple of hundred pounds would be a good idea: I will be starting a push-away regimen soon. But I wanted some self-defense results this century.

    OK, I've given up on the knife idea ($ toward training instead), and will probably start carrying the nice blackthorn stick my dad gave me 30 years ago. I will contact the Krav Maga teacher to see what he can offer, and will investigate stick-fighting DVDs and see what I can find on Ebay once I get some titles.

    Further advice welcomed (thanks, all!) and stick-training DVD recommendations desired.
    Recently updated website: http://www.damagedphotorepair.com

  14. #14
    VIP Member Array LongRider's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chooie View Post
    American Cane

    They were recommended by Mas Ayoob on PDTV. Having an offset T handle (90 degree) on a proper hardwood cane, along with maybe a day's worth of training, would serve you well.
    Best suggestion by far Jeff Cooper god father of modern gun fighting was a big advocate of canes. They make you appear unarmed disabled and defenseless they are deployed anytime you have it easy to learn. PM me for links.

    Contrary to what I said before the Boker Subcom looks like it may work great for you. It has such great ergonomics it locks into your hand regardless of your hands size. Slashing is a natural intuitive action with a knife. Spend hours a day any time you are watching TV reading talking opening it and closing it one handed. Don't open it to lock. They are so small the BG may not ever see it until after he starts bleeding if he does see it, it's so cute he may to laugh until he starts bleeding. Get training when you can.

    A good light is a good idea carry it on your weak side use your weak hand to deploy it. Get a good quality light be sure it has a long battery life. I like Novatac but there are lots of good lights over 85 lumens available for alot less. Walmart carries a few good lights for under $25. Good does not have to be expensive

    I think pepper spray sucks. Even good ones fail and you risk spraying yourself. I have seen FOX labs spray fail and it is the best I know of. You could be using your cane, drawing your knife, or drawing your gun instead of spray. You will not have time to go from spray to cane to knife to gun. If the scenario does not warrant a gun whack em with your cane.

    IMO Tasers suck they a expensive bulky and are a one shot deal. Miss and you are screwed. Repeat above reasons

    Get a good gun I would recommend an XD in the largest caliber you can handle. At your size .45 should be easily manageable. Consider adding TFO sights and a laser. Practice with it often. Load it or whatever gun you carry with Federal HST. Use the search feature to learn why I think it is the XD is the best gun and HST are the best SD round made bar none. Get a good quality holster

    Get your permit. Carry anytime you have pants on. Practice with your carry gun

    For home defense a nothing beats a 18 inch barrel 12 gauge shotgun. Put a red dot sight on it consider a Knoxx recoil reducing stock. Pick up a good AR when you can afford it.

    Keep on hanging out at Defensive Carry keep asking questions
    Abort the Obamanation not the Constitution

    Those who would, deny, require permit, license, certification, or authorization for me to bear arms are as vile, dangerous & evil as those who would molest, abuse, assault, rape or murder my family

  15. #15
    jfl
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    Distinguished Member Array jfl's Avatar
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    Check Krav-Maga; basics are easy to learn.
    In 1977, in Albuquerque, NM, I saw my wife mace a huge drunk guy who was trying to choke while I was debating in which of his eyes I was going to poke my finger ... he went down like hit by a train !!! Very impressive; we always have one (changed every year) on our key-chain; it can be a step in the force continuum.
    Actually it is not mace anymore but tear gas, pepper spray - I like Fox Labs.
    The first rule of a gunfight: "Don't be there !"
    The second rule: "Bring enough gun"

    jfl
    (NRA Life Member/Instructor - GOA - IDPA - GSSF - ex-IHMSA)

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