Highly Deadly Spork & Killer Cub Scouts
This is a discussion on Highly Deadly Spork & Killer Cub Scouts within the Defensive Knives & Other Weapons forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; For some reason this story reminds me of about 5 years ago when I was fixing copy machines for a living. I had a machine ...
October 13th, 2009 12:19 AM
For some reason this story reminds me of about 5 years ago when I was fixing copy machines for a living. I had a machine to fix in the city jail. I handed the front desk guard my bag as I walked through the metal detector. The guard asks "Is there anything in your bag that could be used as a weapon or are you carrying any chemicals?" I said "Yes, just about everything in the bag could be used as a weapon and there are 4 bottles of different chemicals in there" He said "Well, I can't allow you to enter with the bag" I said "Ok, I can't fix your copy machine" I then grabbed my bag and walked out the door.
-It is a seriously scary thought that there are subsets of American society that think being intellectual is a BAD thing...
October 13th, 2009 12:19 AM
October 13th, 2009 02:41 AM
You can't really fairly blame the administration for this sort of thing; frankly, I don't blame them. Sure, your kids might be little angels and you fully trust them with a pocket knife (or multi-tool) at school. Do you trust the other little kids, or their parents?? I sure as hell don't. Not all kids are angels, and I think that bad blood is bred early...
I remember being 6 and 7, and I also remember a kid a few years older than me named Steven that use to chase me home from the bus stop threatening to pound my head in; surely if he could out run me he'd have tried his damnedest. This kid was seriously messed up in the head. I would be terrified of the thought of this guy carrying a pencil, but I'm glad that he wasn't exactly an "A" student. I am terrified by the thought of that guy's children; hopefully he's incapable of reproduction.
It's unfair to one kid who meant well because he's a good kid and he's getting a month and a half out of class, and I think the punishment is a bit extreme for a kid. It's not like he lugged in a freaking Ka-Bar with the word "DEATH" scratched into the blade's tenifer coat.
The school should reconsider their position, but I think that the mother should also consider alternative educational resources, if possible. But this policy is pretty much standard at any school, public or private, in every state.
Last edited by rstickle; October 13th, 2009 at 11:11 AM.
Reason: Language work around
October 13th, 2009 11:29 AM
That's what they want. And it's what they teach.
Originally Posted by jp3276
And they wonder why homeschooling is getting so popular...
October 13th, 2009 11:48 AM
[QUOTE=ccw9mm;1332414] "Weenie-fication" is it, exactly.[QUOTE]
Does anybody have a set of beans to go under the weenie-fication. No Franks, No Beans. No Thoughts, No Freedoms.
Why can't kids be kids. I would understand if the kid was a troubled kid and brought in a dagger,sword,boxcutter. But a spoon,fork and knive that is used for camping thru the Boy scouts. Come on people Where is the malce or intent?
If this was my kid I would be in front of the school board, superintentant of school and if need be in front of a judge in the court house doing what ever was needed to that they would let me kid back in school just to get rid of the father.
October 13th, 2009 01:41 PM
2nd day of kindergarten for my son and we get a call from the vice principal. He informs us that our son said to another kid “I’m going to kill your dad with my dad’s knife.” The kid went home and told their parent who came in to the school and raised a stink. The VP pulled our son out and talked to him etc until he cried and didn’t want to go back to school for a couple weeks. Our son said the kid was pushing him around and that he didn’t say that. I’m sure the truth is somewhere in the middle. Anyway, the teacher now really likes our son and says he’s a great student (he’s a terror at home) even after his rocky start.
The first to report something is always right even if the facts don’t support it. The school never did talk to the other kid and try to find out what really happened.
Not a lot of common sense at the education level.
October 13th, 2009 02:46 PM
On an earlier thread someone told me to get with the times, or something of that sort.
But I will repeat myself.
I was given my first pocked knife when I was about four -- remember who, when, and where but can't pin down which Christmas it was.
I carried one until Paris Island when they made me mail it home and gave me a bayonet.
Yup, all the way through school. Got into a fair share of fights. Never pulled the knife. Could it have been because I knew the other boy had one, too? Never had the other boy pull one on me. Same reason?
Last edited by DaveH; October 13th, 2009 at 05:49 PM.
I'm just one root in a grassroots organization. No one should assume that I speak for the VCDL.
I am neither an attorney-at-law nor I do play one on television or on the internet. No one should assumes my opinion is legal advice.
Veni, Vidi, Velcro
October 13th, 2009 04:03 PM
Zero tolerance... Stupidity.
Back when I was in grade school I sold a bunch of magazines and got a hunting knife with a 5 INCH BLADE, an axe and sheaths for each. Just can't imagine a seventh grader getting a knife and an axe from a nun these days....
October 13th, 2009 08:15 PM
"...an instrument, article or substance which is readily capable of causing
serious physical injury or death." Sounds like my shoe laces and pen fit that definition.
October 13th, 2009 08:25 PM
Belts must be considered a weapon as well. Something has to explain the trend of wearing ones pants 3 inches below the butt
Originally Posted by BentLink
Disclaimer: The posts made by this member are only the members opinion, not a reflection on anyone else, nor the group, and should not be cause for anyone to get their undergarments wedged in an uncomfortable position.
October 13th, 2009 10:18 PM
I think i need to sell all my guns and get me that Spork. It sounds to me like it's up there with a rocket launcher the way they are acting.
34 hand guns and still going.....
EX-NRA lifetime Member
October 13th, 2009 10:50 PM
How about the Eagle Scout that got suspended for 20 days for having a 2 inch pocket knife in a survival kit..Locked Up In His Car!!! Pissed me off so bad I sent al etter to the state superintendent of education and all of the potential candidates for the post.
A 17-year-old Eagle Scout in upstate New York has been barred from stepping foot on school grounds for 20 days — for keeping a 2-inch pocketknife locked in a survival kit in his car.
Matthew Whalen, a senior at Lansingburgh Senior High School, says he follows the Boy Scout motto and is always prepared, stocking his car with a sleeping bag, water, a ready-to-eat meal — and the knife, which was given to him by his grandfather, a police chief in a nearby town.
But Lansingburgh High has a zero-tolerance policy, and when school officials discovered that Whalen kept his knife locked in his car, he says, they suspended him for five days — and then tacked on an additional 15 after a hearing.
Click here for video.
The incident is similar to the case of Zachary Christie, a 6-year-old Cub Scout in Delaware who faces up to 45 days in his district’s reform school for bringing a scout utensil that can be used as a fork, spoon and knife to school. But for Whalen — who has received an award from the Boy Scouts of America for saving a life and completed 10 weeks of basic military training last summer — the stakes are much higher:
He is concerned that the blot on his school record could kill his dream of attending West Point.
In an interview with Foxnews.com, Whalen recalled the incident that led to his suspension.
He said his school's assistant principal, Frank Macri, approached him on Sept. 21 and asked him if he was carrying a knife.
"I was taken down to the office, and they told me that a student told them that I was carrying a knife," Whalen said.
He said he told them "they could search me and everything, and they said, 'There's no need for that.'"
Whalen said he doesn't know who might have said he was carrying a knife, but he was open with school officials.
"And they said, 'Do you own a knife?' I said, 'Yes, I'm a soldier and an Eagle Scout — I own a knife.'
"And they were like, 'Well, is it in your car or anything?' And I told them, 'Yeah, it's in my car right now.'
"And they asked me to show it to them. I didn't realize it was going to be a problem. I knew it wasn't illegal — my police chief grandfather gave the knife to me."
Whalen said he took school administrators to his car because he thought their fears would be allayed when they saw it was just a 2-inch knife.
"They thought I had a dagger in my car or something like that, so I thought yeah, I'd show it to them," Whalen said.
"I showed it to them, and they told me I had a knife on school property and had to be suspended."
But things didn't end there, Whalen said.
"They brought a cop in, who told them 'he's not breaking any laws, so I can't charge him with anything.'"
Whalen said he asked Macri why a 2-inch pocketknife would be considered more dangerous than other everyday items around the school.
"I said to him, 'What about a person who has a bat, on a baseball team? That could be a weapon.' And he said, 'Well, it's not the same thing.'"
The school district's policy lists "Possessing a weapon" under "examples of violent conduct," which "may be subject to disciplinary action, up to and including suspension from school."
School district officials did not reply to requests for comment.
Whalen says Macri gave him the longest suspension possible — five school days.
"They gave me the five-day suspension, because that is all a principal can suspend a student for," he said. "And from there, they had a superintendent hearing to see if the superintendent wanted to suspend me for longer.
"But the superintendent wasn't even at the hearing. It was the principal and the athletic director. The vice principal who originally suspended me wasn't even there, and neither was the superintendent. They basically asked me, 'Did you have the knife in your car?' And I said 'Yes, I did.' The meeting was recorded and they told me they were going to play the tape to the superintendent.
"They asked me if I wanted to say anything, and I told them all my accomplishments and what I've done, and the principal even admitted that I had no intent to use the knife, that I had no accessibility to the knife."
But school officials decided to suspend Whalen for an extra 15 days anyway, he said. And unless the decision is changed, he will not be allowed on school grounds until Oct. 21.
Whalen said he does not know why the 15 days were added, but he said a school district employee told him it was because the school wanted to apply its policies consistently.
"I've been told by someone who works for the district that they had to do it, because if someone else had a knife and they saw that I didn't get a suspension, that it would look bad for the school."
School superintendent George Goodwin and Lansingburg Senior High School Principal Angelina Bergin did not return calls for comment Tuesday morning.
Whalen said he has no record of disciplinary problems.
"I think I have a detention from like 10th grade for being late or something like that," he said.
He said the suspension has put his college dreams in jeopardy by keeping him out of class, while making him still responsible for assignments.
Though he is provided with a tutor for 90 minutes a day, he said, "I've been suspended for something like a ninth of my school year, so I'm falling behind drastically in my classes."
In addition to getting back to school as soon as possible, Whalen wants the school to drop the incident from his transcript.
"My dream college would be West Point, and having a pock mark like this on my record could be detrimental. They're looking for the best of the best, and if someone didn't take the time to look through it and examine the case, they would just say, 'hey, this guy had a weapon on school property, and we don't want him at our college.'"
Whalen said that he has received support from the community during the last few weeks.
"I've received tremendous communal support. Almost everyone I've talked to has said they're behind me 100 percent, that it's ridiculous that [the school has] done this me."
Whalen said he is not considering a lawsuit.
"I don't know what I could do, because technically ... I did break the rules, and I'll accept that punishment," he said.
"Perhaps I should have been more aware of the rules. However, I'm more upset about the additional 15 days.... That was entirely optional, and they decided to go through with that."
October 13th, 2009 11:01 PM
This story has caught a lot of attention around here and I'm glad to say they support the boy. The zero tolerance crap leaves no room for common sense. This boy will be branded for the rest of his life because of the stupid school administration.
It's a great way for the schools to teach the kids that even the innocent pay the price for the guilty people's deeds.
I remember teachers that would punish the whole class if one person did something wrong..... great way to teach personal responsibility huh.
For as the lightning comes from the east and flashes to the west, so also will the coming of the son of man be. Mathew 24:27
October 13th, 2009 11:10 PM
I retired out of a MI school system. I'm still working in a Southern rural school...this crap embarrasses me...no common sense.
"That I cannot do."
"Give this to, uh, Clemenza. I want reliable people, people who aren't going to be carried away. After all we're not murderers in spite of what this undertaker thinks."
Certified Glock Armorer
NRA Life Member
October 14th, 2009 01:47 AM
That's exactly the measure that should be used, IMO.
Originally Posted by HITCH KING
Unless it's clear that the simple tool is being treated and used like a weapon, then a school should, I think, be formally barred from inflicting such damage on the "guilty" parties. Avoiding such administrative stupidities should be a fairly high priority, and it ought to be achievable simply by redefining what constitutes "threat."
A benign, inanimate object just layin' there without any other corroborating factors simply shouldn't be able to be taken as a threat.
Your best weapon is your brain. Don't leave home without it.
How does disarming
the number of victims?
Reason over Force: The Gun is Civilization (Marko Kloos)
NRA, GOA, OFF, ACLDN.
October 14th, 2009 01:58 AM
looks like the suspension will stand but they are dropping the alternative school. Bet those kids could teach him a thing or two about knives. I remember loaning my knife out to teachers. They knew exactly who to ask. I remember being asked to bring, "all the guns and knives you can get your hands on to school tomorrow." And it was my wrestling coach asking! The only stipulation was to make sure they were unloaded. We needed them from props for our conference championship wrestling poster for my high school. Twice! We distributed the posters to our sponsors all over the county. One of the pics was taken on school property. AHHHH, the good old days.
Last edited by chiefjason; October 14th, 2009 at 02:00 AM.
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