Marlin Guide-Gun 45-70

This is a discussion on Marlin Guide-Gun 45-70 within the Defensive Rifles & Shotgun Discussion forums, part of the Related Topics category; Zombie buffalo are dangerous I hear.... :-) stainless 45-70 with a synthetic stock is on my short list of must haves....

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Thread: Marlin Guide-Gun 45-70

  1. #16
    Senior Member Array usmc3169's Avatar
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    Zombie buffalo are dangerous I hear.... :-)

    stainless 45-70 with a synthetic stock is on my short list of must haves.
    "All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is that good men do nothing."

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  3. #17
    Distinguished Member Array Chaplain Scott's Avatar
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    I have the guide gun in .450 Marlin--I use it as a saddle gun when we ride here in the Mountains when the bear are out.

    Although with the recoil, I don't think I'd want to shoot it while actually IN the saddle--I might look a little funny sitting in the saddle with the saddle knocked half-way around the side of my horse

    I do NOT like the small lever on my guide gun--when I'm wearing cold-weather gloves, I can only get a couple of fingers in the lever---while I like the gun, that part is, in my mind, a very significant design flaw.
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  4. #18
    Member Array Vladimirx01's Avatar
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    WONDERFUL GUN!

    I've got the 18" Ported Stainless finish model... the model number eludes me right now.

    I love this gun! It is a blast to shoot (although the kick is pretty serious, and as I'm about 120# soaking wet, well, you get the idea).

    I got it for when I was up in AK hiking in the woods (I Like to Hike for Pike!)... No problems at all!
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  5. #19
    JT
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    I've wanted a .45-70 Guide Gun for a long time, but the ammo prices are keeping me from it. When it was around $1 a round I was tempted. Not that it's in the $1.50-$2.00 + range, I'm having a real hard time taking the plunge.

    I know, I know...I need to hand load. One of these days I'll get into that. I've been saving brass for years, so I've got a good supply in the calibers I currently own.
    Blessed be the Lord my rock who trains my hands for war and my fingers for battle. Psalm 144:1

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  6. #20
    New Member Array dodge's Avatar
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    I own one and I think that it's a lot of fun to shoot. Mine is blued with a non-ported barrel. I have shot several 3 shot groups where all three rounds are touching each other. Last fall before deer season I was at the local range and a few guys wanted to try it and they was warned before that it will kick like a 12 gauge. They hunt in NY where at that time all they could use was shotgun for hunting deer. After shooting mine a couple of them went out and bought one. They couldn't believe how accurate they are for the caliber and how light the gun is. I've taken one deer with mine so far and it was bang flop right there. The deer went down so fast I thought that I had missed it as it dropped into a dip in the land that was deep enough that it hid the deer until I walked over to check to see if I hit it.

  7. #21
    Distinguished Member Array old grunt's Avatar
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    Thanks guys..sounds like a great weapon. It would be nice for the collection,in that it's practical for "out west" and Alaska as an easy to carry "just in case" rifle.
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  8. #22
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    Looks like a lot of wallop in a small package.
    Trust in God and keep your powder dry

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  9. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by Janq View Post
    I have one in my possession.

    A stupid fun gun...great stopping power by it's round as within a 200 yd. functional accuracy range.
    It'll of course go further and still have terminal velocity but the bullet drop on the flying brick is severe.

    Felt recoil to me firing off hand standing with no shooters vest is stout but not bad at all if you know how to properly shoulder a big caliber/high energy gun. It's just like shooting a shotgun with slugs. I tested this literally side to side shooting this and a 16 GA slug gun I used last year for winter deer season. Felt recoil is just about same.

    I love shooting it...It's my favorite rifle thus far!

    The unit I've had on loan to me is a ported GS version.
    Blued with walnut stocks. I trained with it and used it for black bear hunting here in MA.
    Here there are lots of brush and trees which the round reportedly will sail right through.
    Also the Guide Gun packs very well for carry in hand into and through the woods among thick brush...Much easier than say a long barreled rifle or shotgun which is IMHO is a PITA, and even at times a danger.

    I this year have my eye on the Marlin SBL version of same.
    I don't care for the sratight/english style stock of the GS while the SBL comes with a pistol grip style laminate wood. A double win there.
    Also the magazine capacity is increased to 7+1 while the lever on the SBL is oversized. Again a double win as I can't get my hand to well fit the standard rectangular lever hoop. With gloves on, forget about it. I just use my thumb in a modified lever action rather than hand/fingers.
    Also the SBL is completely stainless minus two screws done in nickel plate. This is a huge win as related to maintenance and all weather capability.

    There is for 2010 a new model called the LGB iirc that has all the new upgrades of the SBL minus the stainless steel and staying as blued steel with walnut rather than laminate wood. It is beautiful...But to my mind the SBL is most utilitarian.

    Ammo varies widely from 325 gr. to 500 gr.
    My favorite for accuracy in this specific guns barrel as well as WHOOOOMP powa is the 405 gr. Remington.
    Again firing off hand standing (I train only how I'll shoot...And I don't use benches nor sandbags & rests in a tree stand) and firing at 50 yds. using just iron sights firing rapid fire I can hit inside of a 6 inch circle five for five shots at a dead hold.
    This gun shoots.

    This is last November at 50 yds. on what was a blustery day with approx. 18 mph. wind pushing left to right.


    This is an IDPA training target from Warren Tactical with a plastic childrens halloween pumpkin hung behind it.
    The target is 'skin' and the pumpkin is an approximation of the boiler room (hearts, lungs, and liver) which I often use toward hunting related training.
    All six rounds within the circle are 405 gr. Remington. My hold point was just below the lower edge of the black square which is an inch square.

    The six holes off to the outer edge of the paper are all Hornady 325 gr. FTX bullets which in this wind and with this rifles barrel just would not shoot well enough for me. High velocity with a light weight and high ballistic profile projectile.
    Again my aiming point was same on the square and note the resulting consistency with that. Not something I personally would have any sense of comfort to hunt with, as with this specific gun and barrel. They are though said to shoot accurate in other folks guns. This is why it's key to test, train and try different ammo rather than assuming ehh it worked for Joe it'll work fine for me too.

    I spent two hours shooting this particular day running through approx. 3 boxes of ammo. I had zero physical issues or soreness and went out to hunt the next morning having no swelling or nothing like any other day.
    Again it comes to down to good and proper form. I could shoot this gun all day long and have nothing but a huge smile on my face.

    Same target as above though with two slower fire 'head' shots made toward the big square...While firing on purpose into a peak wind gust (approx. 25+ mph). The bottom of the paper was blow right so my only shot available was the head. Point of aim/hold was again the small square.



    The gun shoulders and points very quickly.
    Recoil though is stout so be sure to work on your mounting skills before hand as in dry fire practice. I did this for a week prior to shooting it and to dust off my lever manipulation skills too.
    Doing this paid real dividends on the range, which of course extend to being functional in the field.

    Did I mention I love this gun?! : )

    - Janq
    You mention a 200 yd functional accuracy range but from looking at the pics you posted the accuracy at only 50 yards is not very good, even if it is off hand. In the right hands most pistols will do better than that at 50 yards. My shotgun with slugs does better than that. Just saying...

  10. #24
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    There is nothing alive in Georgia that is large enough or tough enough to justify the extra cost, both in rifle price and ammunition price. If you lived in big sky country I'd say go for it but in the Southeast you could just get a 30-30. A 30-30 will kill anything this side of the Mississippi, cost less, be cheaper to shoot and won't hurt your shoulder.
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  11. #25
    VIP Member Array Janq's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by harrydog View Post
    You mention a 200 yd functional accuracy range but from looking at the pics you posted the accuracy at only 50 yards is not very good, even if it is off hand. In the right hands most pistols will do better than that at 50 yards. My shotgun with slugs does better than that. Just saying...
    Read the post, in full, as you have quoted.

    The round has a 200 yd. functional accuracy.
    The pics as shown were testing of five different loadings on a blustery day and it was the first day I'd shot this particular gun and loadings...Again as all off hand using iron sights.

    And yes it was at 50 yds. for purpose of sight in and testing against a target circle that was just 7" across.
    Further you can't hunt black bear with slugs, here.

    All things considered this was in fact very good and quite functional for hunting purposed accuracy, as against a much larger real world target.

    BTW way, why quote the entirety of my post to just say two sentences?

    - Janq

    P.S. - As well this day I'd started at 25 yds. to function test and get a feel for recoil alone. Then I dropped back to 50, 75 and my own local use max range of 100 yds. The majority of the session being videotaped with the above pics being stills I too using my cellphone. In my area from a tree stand 50 yds. is most common for being able to see game never mind take a shot, thus the reason why I sighted in at that range...Which I found the gun as untouched to be already POA/POI ranged to that.
    Sadly this past Tuesday I had to return the gun as on loan to me. I plan to pickup and SBL model for my birthday though in August. This gun is sweet.
    And yes, a shotgun slug can be fired at same range and even out to 200 yds., as I myself have posted multiple times here, and make hits. So can .50 BMG too....Neither of which I'd be hunting black bear in MA with (!).
    Last edited by Janq; May 22nd, 2010 at 02:49 PM.
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  12. #26
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  13. #27
    Senior Member Array RemMod597's Avatar
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    Reminds me of a trip out shooting in the mountains with a buddy of mine.
    He brought along his Winchester 25-35. Definitely has a nice respectable amount of recoil.
    It paper-punched holes through brake disks.


    The maximum effective range of an excuse is zero meters.

  14. #28
    VIP Member Array Janq's Avatar
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    Yep! ^^

    With enough angulation even a .22 can be effective at <fill in the blank distance>.

    As for hunting purposes, per context of the OPs query, functional max distance is just about 200 yds. although myself I would not go beyond 75 yds. with irons and seriously consider optics at that point and forward to ~ 175 yds (see MFR ballistics tables!)...With this specific round.

    The lightweight but high velocity and higher than typical ballistic coefficient Hornady 'Leverlution' rounds @325 gr. were pushed laterally by the wind big time, but at the same time were consistent (see hits to the 'shoulder' of the target). Point of aim was always the 1" black square at center mass. This guns specific rifling did not like the Hornady ammo in specific..
    It was only the heavier but much slower 405 gr. Remingtons that were dead on accurate, and those are the hits within the 7" circle as well as the two head shots within the 5" square.

    Again off hand (no rest or bags), standing (not seated), using Marlin stock factory irons (adjustable rear w/'Wide Scan' hooded fixed front) and using a squared up stance rather than traditional rifle hold...As I would be most likely using real world shooting from a ladder type stand.

    More on the .45-70 as featured #1 ahead of .22LR (#2) and .30-30 (#4)...

    The 10 Greatest Cartridges Of All Time
    Guns Magazine, July, 1999 by Jon R. Sundra

    .45-70 Gov't

    How can any discussion of self-contained metallic cartridges not include the one that started it all? The .45-70 was introduced in 1873 in conjunction with the single-shot "trapdoor" Springfield rifle. What distinguished the .45-70 from its contemporaries was that it was the first cartridge to incorporate a centrally-primed case capable of withstanding higher pressures than previous rimfire designs and it was reloadable to boot.

    Even in its original loading of 70 grs. of blackpowder behind a 405 gr. lead bullet at about 1,300 fps, it was a formidable deer and black bear killer inside 125 yards. The fact that this 131-yearold cartridge is still being loaded by all three of our major ammo manufacturers is mind-boggling in itself, to say nothing of the fact that Ruger, Marlin and Browning still chamber rifles for it!

    In deference to the few original '73 Springfields and Winchester Model 1886 rifles still floating around out there, commercial .45-70 ammo is loaded to pressure levels approximating the original BP loads -- about 25,000 psi.

    In the Marlin Model 1885 handloaders can safely achieve performance levels well beyond factory loadings, and in modern rifles like the Ruger No. 1 and Browning 1885, handloaders can come fairly close to matching the .458 Win. Magnum. All that from a cartridge that first saw the light of day long before electricity, automobiles, telephones and flight. Amazing!

    Source - The 10 Greatest Cartridges Of All Time | Guns Magazine
    - Janq
    Last edited by Janq; May 23rd, 2010 at 02:36 PM.
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  15. #29
    Member Array JustInCase's Avatar
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    ...

    had it for about 10 years. a buddy of mine tried to buy a 22lr lever gun so i had to up him and got a 45-70. turns out he couldn't pass a background check and never got his...

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  16. #30
    OD*
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    Quote Originally Posted by Janq View Post
    Yep! ^^

    With enough angulations even a .22 can be effective at <fill in the blank distance>.

    - Janq
    First, I wasn't challenging anyone's posts, I posted the link for informational & entertainment purposes.
    As for hunting purposes, per context of the Opts query, functional max distance is just about 200 yes. although myself I would not go beyond 75 yes. with irons and seriously consider optics at that point and forward to ~ 175 yes (see MFR ballistics tables!)...With this specific round.
    True, and that is pretty much dependent on the ability of the rifleman and specific loads, the cartridge is quite capable of more in the right hands with the right loads.

    The 10 Greatest Cartridges Of All Time
    Guns Magazine, July, 1999 by Jon R. Sundra

    .45-70 Gov't

    In the Marlin Model 1885 handloaders can safely achieve performance levels well beyond factory loadings, and in modern rifles like the Urge No. 1 and Browning 1885, hand can come fairly close to matching the .458 Win. Magnum. All that from a cartridge that first saw the light of day long before electricity, automobiles, telephones and flight. Amazing!
    I'm assuming Mr. Sundra actually means the Marlin 1895 (the 1881 was Marlins first 45/70, in fact it was the first lever-action chambered for the 45/70 Government cartridge), the Model 1885 was Winchester's Hi-Wall, which was the Browning Model 1878, before T.G. Bennett (Oliver F. Winchester's son-in-law) bought the rights to produce the rifle and rechristen it the Model 1885. I do wonder why he didn't mention the more modern copies of the Model 1886 riles & carbines offered by Browning and Winchester.
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