Your home defense shotgun - what condition to you keep it in? - Page 4

Your home defense shotgun - what condition to you keep it in?

This is a discussion on Your home defense shotgun - what condition to you keep it in? within the Defensive Rifles & Shotgun Discussion forums, part of the Related Topics category; Mossberg Bull Pup, full mag, empty chamber, safety off. Rack and roll....

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Thread: Your home defense shotgun - what condition to you keep it in?

  1. #46
    Member Array kybandit's Avatar
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    Mossberg Bull Pup, full mag, empty chamber, safety off. Rack and roll.


  2. #47
    VIP Member Array Janq's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by 1911PKR View Post
    I'm confused.... I can't find the hammer on my shotguns.
    It's internal...Like a Glock.

    To drop the hammer requires pulling the trigger on an EMPTY CHAMBER.
    To actually see the hammer pop out the one retainer pin (Mossberg)/two retainer pins (Remington) and pull out from the receiver the trigger group assembly. There within the trigger group housing is the hammer.

    Cycling the action to open resets the hammer to the 'Up/Fire' position.
    When you close the action the gun is then immediately ready to fire.

    - Janq

    P.S. In between eating popcorn and watching Food Inc. I'd decided to grab the Mossy and the Remington along with four snap caps and do some load and gun manipulation drills at the shoulder. Fun!
    Last edited by Janq; April 22nd, 2010 at 02:16 AM.
    "Killers who are not deterred by laws against murder are not going to be deterred by laws against guns. " - Robert A. Levy

    "A license to carry a concealed weapon does not make you a free-lance policeman." - Florida Div. of Licensing

  3. #48
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    Quote Originally Posted by 10thmtn View Post

    Rem 870 pump as last line of defense, in the safe, in the safe room.

    I added a note to the gun with a piece of tape - "remove safety!" - since none of my handguns have safeties, and I don't want to forget while under stress.
    Ok... pin a note to your gun in a SD situation and make sure you read the note!


    Quote Originally Posted by SIXTO View Post
    Don't forget that "cruiser ready" also means the hammer is down as well. You do not want to be fooling with the release should the fan and poo be on a collision course.
    What hammer?
    "Success is how high you bounce when you hit bottom" Gen. George Patton

  4. #49
    VIP Member Array Janq's Avatar
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    Folk who did not know your shotgun had a hammer and/or where it's located (in the trigger group) you really should reference and read your owners manual.

    Remington 870 O/M ~ See page 14 @ Picture 19
    http://www.remington.com/~/media/Fil...ls/om_870.ashx

    Mossberg 500/535/590/835 O/M ~ See page 4 for explanation of how the hammer affects cycling of the action (no pic)
    http://www.mossbergs.com/manuals/500_835_590_535_en.pdf

    What ever type firearm you happen to own you should be functionally aware of it's components and how it works, just for the sake of ongoing maintenance & care alone.
    Almost all mfrs. provide their O/Ms for download from their websites and/or free as mailed upon request.

    - Janq
    "Killers who are not deterred by laws against murder are not going to be deterred by laws against guns. " - Robert A. Levy

    "A license to carry a concealed weapon does not make you a free-lance policeman." - Florida Div. of Licensing

  5. #50
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    Quote Originally Posted by 1911PKR View Post
    Ok... pin a note to your gun in a SD situation and make sure you read the note!




    What hammer?
    Jang has it covered.
    "Just blame Sixto"

  6. #51
    Member Array TapRackBang's Avatar
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    Jang is spot on..cruiser ready is the way to go.
    "Arms in the hands of individual citizens may be used at individual discretion..in private self defense." John Adams

  7. #52
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    Quote Originally Posted by joelg View Post
    Loaded, none in the chamber, want to rack one in so that the predator is fully cognizant of what is about to occur. Experience has shown this to work - entirely non-theoretical...similar to when a .45 is racked...some felons will attest to their first thoughts - "oh, boy...."
    Ummm.... this reveals two things to the determined felon.

    1. It reveals your location, should you be concealed from view

    and

    2. You are intellectually unprepared to kill him.

    Viewing "racking the slide" as a self-defense measure = mind-set is lacking. If you really are going to use a gun, because you fear for your life, use it. Don't show up to a gun fight with an unloaded gun.

    We are talking about bad guys, here, with whom it may take multiple rounds to the boiler room to convince them to stop.

    This is not a game, or some fantasy scenario.

  8. #53
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    Quote Originally Posted by 120mm View Post
    Ummm.... this reveals two things to the determined felon.

    1. It reveals your location, should you be concealed from view

    and

    2. You are intellectually unprepared to kill him.

    Viewing "racking the slide" as a self-defense measure = mind-set is lacking. If you really are going to use a gun, because you fear for your life, use it. Don't show up to a gun fight with an unloaded gun.

    We are talking about bad guys, here, with whom it may take multiple rounds to the boiler room to convince them to stop.

    This is not a game, or some fantasy scenario.
    I don't know if I agree with your position there.

    Point #1, I'll give you. You do risk giving away your position.

    However, in Point #2 "You are intellectually unprepared to kill him."

    I really do not believe many criminals think on that level. What they do know is that someone just loaded a shotgun round into a chamber!

    What they do with that information is their business, but if they mistakenly believe that to mean my mindset is somehow lacking, they are in for a surprise.

    I do not equate "racking the slide" to equal the mindset is lacking.

    Trust me, my mindset has been honed over decades of training and experience, it is not lacking in the least because of how I ready my shotgun.

    I keep my shotgun chamber empty solely for safety considerations and not for intimidation purposes.

    Please read the section from Janq's post #19 below.

    Quote Originally Posted by Janq Post #19
    By Massad Ayoob

    Shotgun Handling and Shooting Tips

    Remember that no shotguns have internal firing pin locks. This means that if a shell is in the chamber and the gun is struck sharply against a hard object at either muzzle or butt end, inertia can cause the firing pin to bounce forward against its spring and unintentionally fire the shotgun.

    This is why shotguns in police cars are ALWAYS kept with loaded magazines but empty firing chambers. For the same reasons, a shotgun stored loaded in the home for family defense should be a magazine-type weapon kept with its firing chamber empty.
    I also reserve the shotgun as a last ditch heavy artillery weapon used from the ensconced position of inside my master bedroom where my wife and I have taken up a safe position.

    For other situations within the home I either use a handgun or my AR-15 carbine loaded with Hornady TAP personal protection rounds.

    The short carbine is much easier to wield in close quarters and easier to maintain possession of in a gun grab situation than the shotgun with 20 inch cylinder bore and non-collapsible buttstock.

    YMMV
    -Bark'n
    Semper Fi


    "The gun is the great equalizer... For it is the gun, that allows the meek to repel the monsters; Whom are bigger, stronger and without conscience, prey on those who without one, would surely perish."

  9. #54
    Senior Member Array Saint77's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Janq View Post

    Personally I am fan of Cruiser Ready for shotgun storage (only!) and would roll that way _IF_ I lived alone and/or had no children in my home.
    As neither apply to me my shotgun is currently stored the same as my other longguns, locked, empty, with action open and the actions locked open as through the receiver and chamber via a cable lock. My go to HD gun is a pair of quick access locked 1911s stored as in Condition 1.

    - Janq
    Cruiser ready is how my 590 is. We have no kids, so this works out well for me. my just in case I need it guns, a Kimber .45 and a Glock G19 are store int he safe on C1

    I dont even think about using my SKS for an HD weapon, though its certainly capable. It just doesn't make sense in an apartment.

    Quote Originally Posted by Janq View Post

    P.S. - Another thing that folks forget or even do not know is that on shotguns and most rifles the safety does not function same as on most handguns.
    Shotgun safeties only block the trigger from being toggled. They do not block the hammer nor disable the firing pin.
    Many if not most rifles are same blocking only the triggers ability to be toggled.
    Where as on most handguns the safety is either toward the firing pin to block the hammer or disable the firing pin completely (1911 Schwartz type safety) or they do this AND disable/block the trigger too.
    So with most modern handguns they are drop safe while very much not the same can be said for shotguns period and many if not most rifles.
    This is not esoterica as it is very important to be aware of this mechanical function fact (check your specific guns owners manual for details) because whether you be at home or on a range or in the field, people do on occasion drop their firearm. It happens. Or bump it or into solid objects. Do that hard enough and with a chambered gun even as the safety might be active/on...And it's BOOM, negligent discharge!
    Why negligent? Because you weren't aware that the gun is not drop/bump safe AND you had it stored/stowed/carried as loaded while not in the immediate actively prepared to use and fire it. Negligence.
    A really good example, my first semi auto long gun, is the SKS. From what ive read they are really infamous for drop firing. , and you can see without disassembly how the Safetly only blocks the trigger when its on. It does not block anything past the trigger. Im kinda glad for it being my first as I learn this lesson sooner rather then later.

  10. #55
    Senior Member Array 1911PKR's Avatar
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    Janq,....

    Thanks for the links!
    "Success is how high you bounce when you hit bottom" Gen. George Patton

  11. #56
    VIP Member Array ron8903's Avatar
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    Cruiser ready.
    "A lie gets halfway around the world before the truth has a chance to get its pants on."
    - Sir Winston Churchill

  12. #57
    Senior Member Array beni's Avatar
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    Based off what i'm hearing regarding cruiser ready, It should not affect the gun if I dry fire it to bring the hammer down? I heard somewhere that you want to avoid dry firing long guns.

  13. #58
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    No, you will not hurt it dry firing.
    "Just blame Sixto"

  14. #59
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    I already knew that shotguns/most rifles have free floating firing pins with no firing pin safety, which is why when I'm moving it around the shotgun is cleared. The way I see it is, (other than transporting, which I do with an empty chamber) I don't mess around with it unless I believe that I'm going to need it, if I think I need it I'll have a round chambered anyhow so if I do drop/jar it I'll be in the same boat regardless.

    The only opportunities for an accident in my situation that would not arise if I had it in cruiser ready would be: A) If I had an ND when I was clearing it for transport/movement, which if you can't safely clear your gun you are wrong and B) Right when I first grab it if I think I'm about to need it. I've weighed the pros and cons and in my situation the advantage of having it ready to go outweighs those two slight risks, which can be mitigated by proper firearm handling. Keep in mind that where I keep my shotgun and my living situation mean that there is no chance of it accidentally getting knocked around, obviously everybody needs to take into account all the variables and decide what is best for them, for me it is a chambered round.

  15. #60
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    Well, my opinion seems to be the same as most of the rest of y'all.

    Mag full, breech closed, safety off. If you have to fire so fast that you need a round already chambered, you are in big trouble anyhow. How long does it take to operate the pump?

    Now a handgun is different. That you should be able to draw and fire. But with the shotgun, if he is so lose you need to fire like that, he may be too clse for the shotgun anyhow.

    I'm not going to say there may be times where you do have ot fire that quickly, but for me, the odds of that do not outweigh the need to keep one "cocked and locked" all the time. Especially with kids running around the house.
    SIG Sauer P229 .40 S&W

    "A free people ought not only to be armed and disciplined, but they should have sufficient arms and ammunition to maintain a status of independence from any who might attempt to abuse them, which would include their own government." - George Washington

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