Adequate suburban-defense scoped rifle?

This is a discussion on Adequate suburban-defense scoped rifle? within the Defensive Rifles & Shotgun Discussion forums, part of the Related Topics category; I'm a 30-30 fan because it will get the job done and be very jury friendly if you ever need to defend yourself with it ...

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Thread: Adequate suburban-defense scoped rifle?

  1. #61
    New Member Array TxParamedic's Avatar
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    I'm a 30-30 fan because it will get the job done and be very jury friendly if you ever need to defend yourself with it most folks will look at a lever gun and see grandads deer rifle not an evil man killer.

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  3. #62
    Member Array 120mm's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cuda66 View Post
    Well, maybe some of those folks realize that different tools work for different jobs; a handgun is a last-ditch, close in weapon; what the OP asked is not that.

    The OP wanted a rifle that would work at range, in an urban environment, out to 100 yards. There's a post floating around here that shows the effectiveness of the .22LR round--out of a rifle--out to 300 yards; within 100, I think it would work just fine.
    If I were put into an "Enemy at the Gates" defensive situation, where I was defending my neighborhood and home from a large group of "weapons-free" non-zombie bad guys, from 100 yards or closer, and I could work from concealment, I would choose .22 lr.

    It is "good enough" to kill someone at that distance, and has a small sound and flash signature, that can be further attenuated by using proper technique.

    Having them guessing where the shots are coming from has a certain utility to me, that more than makes up for the relative lack of terminal ballistics by the humble .22 lr.

  4. #63
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    Quote Originally Posted by 120mm View Post
    If I were put into an "Enemy at the Gates" defensive situation, where I was defending my neighborhood and home from a large group of "weapons-free" non-zombie bad guys, from 100 yards or closer, and I could work from concealment, I would choose .22 lr.

    It is "good enough" to kill someone at that distance, and has a small sound and flash signature, that can be further attenuated by using proper technique.

    Having them guessing where the shots are coming from has a certain utility to me, that more than makes up for the relative lack of terminal ballistics by the humble .22 lr.
    Also, suppressors for 22lr are relatively affordable, and very quiet!

  5. #64
    Senior Member Array Rigrat's Avatar
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    Not enough in a 22lr for me used to shoot about 3-4k rounds a month and know exactly what it is capable of doing.

    Would not trust it to take down attackers even within 100 yards. Just wouldn't bet my life on it. Thats why I don't carry a concealed 22lr handgun.

    I would rather have something a little stronger than that. 5.56 or 5.45 would be about ideal IMO.

  6. #65
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    Quote Originally Posted by pirate View Post
    If you are looking to scope a rifle and use it in an "urban" environment, I would use an EER (extended eye relief) scope with a scout scope setup. That way you can keep more of a heads up, both eyes open position and since its for relatively close distances inside 100 yards for the most part a 2X or 2.5X scope is all you need.

    An inexpensive option like an SKS (7.62x39) with a scout setup is perfect. Setup on a parapet wall on a rooftop I could make head shots all day out to 125 yards with this setup and if I had to relocate quickly and leave it behind I have not left $1000 on the roof.
    That fine sir, is by far the most "stuff" I have ever seen stuck on an SKS I'm sure most of it wouldnt fit on your AR any more would it?

  7. #66
    Ex Member Array Cold Warrior's Avatar
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    Today, my gun buddy and I took a drive and looked at the Savages and Remingtons and better Winchesters, at Vandalia Tactical, Old English Outfitters, and Vandalia Range and Armory. Next week, we'll drive to Columbus and Vance, to have fun looking at guns. Savage is smart for adding scopes to rifles, for us who are trying to buy our first-ever such guns. But, I also see those bigger rifle magazines that can hold a lot more shots than four or five.

  8. #67
    Member Array booyah's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cold Warrior View Post
    Today, my gun buddy and I took a drive and looked at the Savages and Remingtons and better Winchesters, at Vandalia Tactical, Old English Outfitters, and Vandalia Range and Armory. Next week, we'll drive to Columbus and Vance, to have fun looking at guns. Savage is smart for adding scopes to rifles, for us who are trying to buy our first-ever such guns. But, I also see those bigger rifle magazines that can hold a lot more shots than four or five.
    Its all about what you want to use the firearm for. First question to answer is
    "what are you planning on using this weapon to shoot?" Seacond is
    "What setting are you planning on using it in most likely?"

  9. #68
    Distinguished Member Array pirate's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by booyah View Post
    That fine sir, is by far the most "stuff" I have ever seen stuck on an SKS I'm sure most of it wouldnt fit on your AR any more would it?
    Come on now, everything can't be like Elmer Fudd wearing Filson duds. I have the all-original milsurp SKS's covered in my collection too! The Norinco was an acquisition from a friend that owed me some cash and I use it as a truck (disposable if needed) gun. It functions and handles really well in the tacticool getup.



    When I leave the home port:
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  10. #69
    kpw
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cold Warrior View Post
    Today, my gun buddy and I took a drive and looked at the Savages and Remingtons and better Winchesters, at Vandalia Tactical, Old English Outfitters, and Vandalia Range and Armory. Next week, we'll drive to Columbus and Vance, to have fun looking at guns. Savage is smart for adding scopes to rifles, for us who are trying to buy our first-ever such guns. But, I also see those bigger rifle magazines that can hold a lot more shots than four or five.
    Don't let the scope make the deal for you. The scopes they put on package deal rifles are bottom tier scopes and usually in cheap mounts. They work, usually, but they tend to have poor eye relief, poor optics and not very rugged.
    "In a republic this rule ought to be observed: that the majority should not have the predominant power." -
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  11. #70
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    [QUOTE=kpw;1635828]You need more practice using scopes.

    - No, I don't need the scope. Guess I am fortunate enough to have good eyes at distance. Not saying they don't make it easier as you get farther out but at 100 yards I don't need it, and it does change the balance of the gun which is otherwise light and quick on target.

    Farther out I would choose 5.56 and some magnification which for me is Trijicon or 3x9 Nikon.
    There's something happening here
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    Telling me I got to beware

  12. #71
    Ex Member Array Cold Warrior's Avatar
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    Yes, something to be considered: ONE really good long-range rifle...scope or scopes to be added later or at anytime, suburban scenarios making 1,000-meter desert shots improbable and rare out there in Ohio. Rate of fire not mattering until it comes to close range and quick passionate action, when four-round magazines and bolt actions might be too slow.

  13. #72
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    You could look at a PTR-91 or a Cetme (classic arms has Cetme's at a good price) cheap mags and you can get scope mounts easily enough. It is a .308 battle rifle and not what I would call light, but for quick passionate action it will do the job.
    “You can sway a thousand men by appealing to their prejudices quicker than you can convince one man by logic.”

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  14. #73
    kpw
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    Quote Originally Posted by docdozer View Post
    - No, I don't need the scope. Guess I am fortunate enough to have good eyes at distance. Not saying they don't make it easier as you get farther out but at 100 yards I don't need it, and it does change the balance of the gun which is otherwise light and quick on target.

    Farther out I would choose 5.56 and some magnification which for me is Trijicon or 3x9 Nikon.
    I can see fine at distance. It's real close that is starting to go a bit.
    Mount a 2.5x Leupie on a lever gun and try some close up drills (10-15 yds.) with it. Do the same with irons. Unless your cross-eye dominant or a squinter, you'll probably be just as fast or faster in no time at all. At 100, you'll be faster and more accurate in no time at all. The Leupold & lightweight mounts will add about 10 oz. to the top but isn't nearly as ungainly as a full size scope.
    Like you said, a scope isn't needed at 100 or less but if the right one is chosen, it won't slow you down a bit.
    "In a republic this rule ought to be observed: that the majority should not have the predominant power." -
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  15. #74
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cold Warrior View Post
    Yes, something to be considered: ONE really good long-range rifle...scope or scopes to be added later or at anytime, suburban scenarios making 1,000-meter desert shots improbable and rare out there in Ohio. Rate of fire not mattering until it comes to close range and quick passionate action, when four-round magazines and bolt actions might be too slow.
    Well, since you mentioned long range; how about one of those pretty Savage 12 VLP rifles in .308? They run about $800-$850 and they're very accurate. It's on my wish list.
    Then get yourself an AK or an AR for the up close and personal stuff.

  16. #75
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    With the mountains and the trees, "long" around here is usually more like 150-200M...but I suppose I really should get something that will reach out a little farther than a 5.56 and that I trust just in case the need does arise.

    EDIT: Oops...just realized it was the "suburban" thread...and that isn't here...
    Gun Control: The theory that a woman found dead in an alley, raped and strangled with her panty hose, is somehow morally superior to a woman explaining to police how her attacker got that fatal bullet wound.

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