AR-15: For Home Defense?
I acquired an AR-15 with a Spike's lower and Rock River Arms upper on a trade. I have a Quad Rail floating hand guard, and I bought an Eotech 552. It has a removable handle and a retractable stock.
I have Magpul Pmag 30 round magazines.
I considered using this as a home defense gun. Would this be impractical?
It sounds ok to me. I like short rifles for home defense.
Unless it is a 24" bull barreled target AR, it's probably not impractical.
If it is an M-4gery, then it is close to ideal for an HD carbine.
Thats the direction I'm heading. I live in a very rural area where I think it is more than practical for home defense, and whatever else I hope I don't have to defend, like my or my parents property.
Sure it'll work fine... BUT, it's hard to beat a 12 gauge shotty with an 18" barrel and buckshot for HD... Be careful going around corners with either one of those though...
I think of mine as a back home defense weapon, more suited to outside use. Even with the 16" barrel, it is unwieldy inside without a lot of training, which I do not have. Mine stays in the safe but I can have it in my hands in a minute or have it out if there is the probability of a natural disaster (tornado warning, etc.). Think of it as part of a home defense system working with your handgun. Seconds on the shotty, if you pull the trigger on an 18" with BS, You are going to hit something, especially if it has a light. Lots of drywall work afterwords tho...
I've said it before and I'll say it again. Clearing a house with a long gun by one's self is a tragedy waiting to happen. I have personally seen a shoot house demo of how quickly one can be disarmed. I am big man and have some martial arts experience with a staff, so I can probably handle a tussle for the rifle/shotgun, but I won't take that chance! I will ALWAYS clear or investigate a "bump" in the night with a pistol and flashlight.
My shotgun is for hunkering down in one room and training it on a closed/locked door waiting for the dumb BG to come to me, (i.e. ambush), or for 100yrds or less,... I love my 12 gauge!! The AR is strictly for reaching out to "touch" someone on my property, long range. I am just not a big fan of the 5.56/.223 for CQB.
Just my 2 cents.
Those are great points. Thank you!
How about ammo choice? 5.56 or .223?
Clearing a structure by yourself regardless of your weapon system is always asking for trouble. Can you do it, maybe, but generally speaking, its not something I would want to do, and I have a decent amount of training/experience on clearing structures.
Originally Posted by Fastball
As far as retention of a long gun, proper training, as well as a "proper" sling (one point or three point, or the newer two points) help with that. And that should be backed up be either a pistol and a blade, with training on transitioning, as well as proper usage.
Really from my experience CQB type stuff is one of the places where the 5.56 rounds does best. You can get multiple well placed rounds on target very quickly. It is at distance where it is losing some of it power that I have seen it have more issues. Maybe your experience tells you otherwise though.
That being said, if I knew the fight was going to stay indoors (which you never really can know because Mr. Murphy likes to muck things up) I would grab a 12 gauge backed by a .45. If it was going to move to an area where I couldn't be sure the range would be that close in, it would be an M-4gery backed up by the .45. And if it was too long for the M-4, then its not SD shooting.
We recently had a crew doing home invasions here in Corpus. There were 4 guys, at least two armed and wearing vests. I can't think of a better choice over the AR for defeating the vest, rapid fire and target transitions…. Also, less deadly after penetrating numerous walls, for those that are concerned about over penetration.
Get some good 75 grain Hornady TAP (5.56 if you can find it - and have a 5.56 chamber - .223 will still be just as effective at any defensive range and well past 100 yards. 5.56 has about a 200 fps advantage, but that means nothing until you hit the fragmentation threshold. 5.56 also has the T2 bullet that has enhanced fragmentation, but that really won't matter much until you are at the velocity threshold for fragmentation). I have an 8" gun, a 12" and numerous sub guns, but choose to use a 16" for home defense. That will soon be an 11.5" that takes that role, but that's at least a few months away. 5.56 is a 300 yard round and in for most effective use. I've always trained to put three or four rounds center mass as fast as possible. I can do this from a low ready in roughly 1 to 1.5 seconds.
As for clearing a house, that comes down to tactics and experience, not leading with the muzzle, staying back from the corner unless it's tight and done;t permit, etc.. There are also a number of drills on how to deal with someone grabbing your rifle, they just need to be practice. If someone goes for mine while I'm clearing my house, at the slightly-low ready, they're going to lose their knees. I've seen and done this before in force on force and it's quite effective. But, it can always go the other way. I should mention, I never leave the master bedroom without my handgun on my belt as well.
*Edit to add - I use Magpul MS2 slings with ASAP plates on all but one of my AR's.. The other gets a Vickers two point. The main advantage to the single point for this use is seamless transitions to support side, which I think is an absolute must when clearing a home or building, especially by yourself. As little exposure as needed is always a plus. A good light is also a must.
Recently picked up two KAC SR15's. H1 replaced with a T1 in LaRue QD (like my other one) with a KAC mount on the way, just had to wait since my guns try not to share optics, added a KAC Triple Tap (replaced Gemtech suppressor mount) and a BattleComp to the other, plus a FDE Surefire 300a with the SR07 pad behind the integrated flip up front sight instead of the E1B and E2D I had mounted on both. Ordering a Schmidt and Bender 1-8 but won't see that for about 9 months probably due to release dates.
Sorry for the crummy iPhone 4 pics.
I like the ASAP plate too, very versatile. I think for indoor use with a pistol back up, single point is the way to go.
Originally Posted by jonconsiglio
An low/no magnification illuminated optic (EOtech, Aimpoint, Primary arms, other red dot) is a good addition for a HD gun too, along with a light.
Jon, some of use would consider those iphone pics decent for ourselves and our photography skills, they can't all be works of art...
I'd use it as a "hole up in the bedroom" gun, but not to clear a house with. That takes more than one person to do it with what I would consider acceptable risk anyway. Better to cover one entrance with a powerful weapon capable of putting many rounds on target in just a few seconds while calling the police. If they don't enter the room you and the family are hiding out in then hopefully they don't break or steal much, but that's what insurance is for. If they enter your room before the cops arrive, light them up.
60gr TAP in a house... outside, 69/75gr
Originally Posted by CDRGlock
Here's a good link for all of you 5.56/.223 questions. I like 75 grain TAP for indoor and outdoor use. Their 60 grain offering is very good as well.