Hunting with a 5.56 - Page 2

Hunting with a 5.56

This is a discussion on Hunting with a 5.56 within the Defensive Rifles & Shotgun Discussion forums, part of the Related Topics category; No doubt a 10.5 incher would be a dream to carry. Since you have that, why not just put a 9 or 10" Blackout on ...

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  1. #16
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    No doubt a 10.5 incher would be a dream to carry.
    Since you have that, why not just put a 9 or 10" Blackout on it and shoot the .30 Cal bullet?

    The Blackouts, both sub and super are getting a good rep around here on hogs.
    I would rather stand against the cannons of the wicked than against the prayers of the righteous.


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  2. #17
    VIP Member Array jonconsiglio's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by HotGuns View Post
    No doubt a 10.5 incher would be a dream to carry.
    Since you have that, why not just put a 9 or 10" Blackout on it and shoot the .30 Cal bullet?

    The Blackouts, both sub and super are getting a good rep around here on hogs.
    My local class 3 shop has both a 9" blackout upper coming in as well as some Surefire 7.62 cans. I'm very tempted to invest in one as I need the can anyway. Hopefully a buddy of mine will buy it first so I can borrow it a couple times and be certain it's what I want.

    If I did go for one, I'd like a 12.5" I think and a Surefire 7.62 mini, just not sure when that suppressor will be available. It's pretty nice though having the option of a 16 ounce, 6" 7.62 suppressor.

    See, once I cut the SCAR Heavy to 13" though, I don't really think I'll have a need for the 300. There's always room for something else, but my short list is so darn long, I don't think I'll ever even make it to the end!
    Proven combat techniques may not be flashy and may require a bit more physical effort on the part of the shooter. Further, they may not win competition matches, but they will help ensure your survival in a shooting or gunfight on the street. ~Paul Howe

  3. #18
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    In my part of FL the plain old Winchester 64gr JSP has worked fine. I bought a hundred plus rounds at Wal Mart cheap. It's kind of become my carry ammo in my AR as well as my wife's. I have an old Contender and it won't shoot them well so I use some 55gr JSP, but I only hunt with that thing at what is practically bow range.
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  4. #19
    VIP Member Array glockman10mm's Avatar
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    Jon, without getting into a bunch of ballistics, let me say this is a great example of where energy and velocities cannot make up for caliber. I will probably use the AR this year for deer, but am only doing it for the challenge of head shots only.

    Now for hogs; they have got to be hit in the shoulder with a caliber big enough to bust one or both shoulders. This is the best way to anchor game, and absolutely the only way to anchor dangerous game.
    The 223 will do fine, but headshots are the only sure fire shot to do this with a 223.

    For my 223, I use Barnes X bullets and reload them myself.
    Ignorance is a long way from stupid, but left unchecked, can get there real fast.

  5. #20
    VIP Member Array jonconsiglio's Avatar
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    Want to send me a handful of your reloads? I really need to get into reloading. A friend has all the stuff and set up for most calibers I own, yet neither of us have done any reloading yet.
    Proven combat techniques may not be flashy and may require a bit more physical effort on the part of the shooter. Further, they may not win competition matches, but they will help ensure your survival in a shooting or gunfight on the street. ~Paul Howe

  6. #21
    VIP Member Array mprp's Avatar
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    I hunt hogs quite often and without being influenced by anyone or glued to any one miracle caliber, I must say that from my experience, I wouldn't hunt hogs with anything under a rifle .30 caliber. The reason is simple to me; I hunt to harvest the animal and like to minimize the searching for and suffering of the animal. Especially the searching that ends up with it never being found but you know there's a wounded animal out there somewhere.

    I've seen a buddy shoot a 200 pounder with a .270 that got up and ran away and even another friend shoot what he figured was a 300 lb. + with a 7mm Mag. that we ended up searching for into the evening and well into the early morning hours the next day that we never did find. Shot placement issues in each of these cases, possibly. But we'll never know because we never found them. But I have seen where .30-06 shots haven't been what we would consider to be perfect and the animal didn't go far. (50-100 yards)

    There was only one time that I have shot a hog and it didn't go down with a .30-06. It was only about 7 to 10 yards from me, running by in a stampede that my buddy kicked up. I hit him on the run, broadside and slightly high. I could see that because it was raining and saw the splash of water vapor on impact. He looked at me, (and appeared to be laughing ) and never broke stride. This dude was in the 350-400 lb. range.

    I don't like the fast-frag thing for hogs either due to their plate near the vitals target.
    The 30 cal. rifle bullets just seem to have the heft for the plate and rib bones and still be able to penetrate the heart to minimize the chances of losing the animal.

    Not to say at all that a .223 wouldn't work, but just from my experience, if I were to have to hunt with one I would change my target from the normal vitals shot and try to get a broadside jugular shot. The throat has much thinner skin and a .223 would probably burn right through with no problem.
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  7. #22
    VIP Member Array glockman10mm's Avatar
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    Jon, the Barnes X Bullet is NOT the most reloader friendly. Because of it's entire copper construction, it is as long as a bullet almost twice the weight, ( it's a 50-55 weight) and is as long as bullets in it's caliber made with lead that weigh 75 or more.
    It takes up more powder room.
    This is not a big deal in a bolt gun, but in a mag fed it can be problematic. If you seat it out too far it won't work in the mag.
    It would be my choice for chest cavity shots out to 150 yards max.

    But I still prefer the head shot.

    It does not have enough mass to bust up the shoulder on deer, let alone hogs.
    My hardcast revolver loads that are in the 41,44,45 caliber will break both shoulders on deer easily, as well as hogs. They can't run when both front shoulders don't work.

    The splintering bone fragments are sharp and do double damage in the heart lung area.
    Ignorance is a long way from stupid, but left unchecked, can get there real fast.

  8. #23
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    Hotguns,

    308/ 30-06/ 243/ 270/ archery tackle have all lost their fair share of deer.

    Jon, 223 is fine for deer. That's why major ammo manufactures are now making factory loads specifically for this. I think the argument 223 is a varmint load is week. Hop over to a r15.com outdoors section and you will see many folks have taken deer and very large pigs using only 223. This year I will be hunting with .223. Typically I use 30 cal however I know many folks that are very successful with 223 on deer.
    “Are you a thermometer or a thermostat, do you reflect or become what is happening in the room or do you change the atmosphere, reset the temperature when you come into the room”?--Chuck Swindoll

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  9. #24
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    Sure..the .223 has killed lots of deer and will continue to do so.
    So has the .22 rimfire. Its killed lots of deer and people too.

    When you start to frame a house, are you going to pick up a hammer that wieghts 2 oz's or one that weights 24 oz's?

    You pick up the heavier hammer everytime. Why? Because its the best tool for the job.

    The .223 is not the best tool for the job.
    I would rather stand against the cannons of the wicked than against the prayers of the righteous.


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  10. #25
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    Gotta agree, it's really not the best for the job. That's why I am only taking head shots. I just want to do something different this year.

    Even a heart and double lung hit is a risky shot for losing one in thick terrain. They will run out of sight and the blood trail can be pretty hard to follow. Oh, they will die alright, but be in a coyotes belly instead of your freezer.
    Take the head shot, DRT.
    Ignorance is a long way from stupid, but left unchecked, can get there real fast.

  11. #26
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    By who's standards? I'm going to say that is your opinion. I would sure like to see the facts that back up your opinions.

    I find it interesting that you have gone from stating it's a "varmint" rifle to shifting gears saying " not best tool for the job". This is the typical argument of "do it because I don't think it's not right." I never said it was the best tool for the job but it will definitely do the job.


    Have you ever hunted deer with a 223?

    While typically I value your guys opinions in this case I do not. Dick Metcalf and J. Guthrie hosts of modern rifle tv have both stated they have taken numerous deer with 223 rifles. These two guys have years of experience in the field and in the gun industry.

    223 has little recoil, an out of the box AR rivals many hunting rifles in out of box accuracy. Second shot follow up and acquisition is superior to any other center fire rifle. So how is it not a good tool for the job.
    “Are you a thermometer or a thermostat, do you reflect or become what is happening in the room or do you change the atmosphere, reset the temperature when you come into the room”?--Chuck Swindoll

    Its not about guns...Its about Freedom!

  12. #27
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    I would sure like to see the facts that back up your opinions.
    Are you aware that several states outlaw the .223 for deer hunting? People that are smarter than me that manage game for a living know better than to allow it. Too many deer are lost. Yes, they will kill deer.Yes they will continue to do so. How many have been lost? Whats the ratio?

    Its high enough that several studies have concluded them to be inadequate, but hey...do what you want to do. I dont care what you shoot. Just like if I cant convince you that a .22 that isnt the best self defense round due to experience, I wont waste my time arguing about it...but I do sincerely hope that if you have to use one is self defense that you live to post about it.

    Have you ever hunted deer with a 223?
    No. I am smarter than that.

    And I have several dozen rifles that will do the job more efficently.
    I would rather stand against the cannons of the wicked than against the prayers of the righteous.


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  13. #28
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    Here's an example of how well 223 works on deer.

    .223 hunting results. - YouTube

    Yes I'm aware 223 has been banned in many states for hunting. However, typically it was banned not because people thought 223 was inadequate but rather to keep non traditional hunting rifles out of the woods. This imho Refects the whole Jim zumbo mentality. In my state 223 is banned however 9mm out of a pistol is acceptable white tails. So tell me how this makes sense.

    I would guess more deer suffering and are wounded lost, run away because of bow hunters/ archery tackle than any other form of hunting. But nobody says hunting with archery tackle is in adequate.
    “Are you a thermometer or a thermostat, do you reflect or become what is happening in the room or do you change the atmosphere, reset the temperature when you come into the room”?--Chuck Swindoll

    Its not about guns...Its about Freedom!

  14. #29
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    Actually, they were banned long before the AR15 platform was even popular and few if any people used them due to magazine restrictions.
    I've seen deer killed with them. I've seen people killed with them. I know what they can do and it aint pretty.

    I'm sure that you can justify just about anything you want to in your own mind.Some people argue that a .22 caliber pistol with a 2 inch barrel is a great self defense gun.

    That does not make it so.
    I would rather stand against the cannons of the wicked than against the prayers of the righteous.


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  15. #30
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    Also these "smarter" game management people is almost laughable. These folks are not ballistic experts I would bet some of them think the same way you do and have no facts to or no research to back up their statements. You know whats interesting about this, I used to agree with you but after doing a little research and seeing the results for my self there is no reason to state that 223 is not an affective deer hunting cartridge.
    “Are you a thermometer or a thermostat, do you reflect or become what is happening in the room or do you change the atmosphere, reset the temperature when you come into the room”?--Chuck Swindoll

    Its not about guns...Its about Freedom!

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