The posts you guys made this morning, I didn't see until I posted. I had started my post this morning around 7:45 or so, and it took me about an hour to come back and finish it then post it. If I had seen those posts, I wouldn't have posted those questions this morning. Thanks.
Posted at 09:27
Originally Posted by jonconsiglio
THe Hyperlink is THE MYTH: 223 is too light for deer.
I have hog hunted 1 time in Florida, never shot one. Therefore, my only hog hunting knowledge is how many mosquito bites one can get in Tallahassee during the summer while hog hunting.
I just finished reading that. Similar to the way I think about ammo. Makes sense.
Without pinning down an exact bullet to use specifically, I would say that from what I've seen hunting and as a general rule for me is to go heavy with the bullet that doesn't have to be traveling at the speed of light.
I don't have a .308 but have had great luck with it's close ballistic cousin, .30-06, in 220 gr. and 180 gr. (body shots only and no head shots) I've shot one 400+ pounder on the run at approx. 100 yards with the 220 grain bullet and several others with 180 grain and 220 anywhere from 5 yards to 15 yards.
None were throuth-and-through, and they absorbed the entire impact of the bullet. All have been one shot, one kill body shots with the exception of that one that I talked about earlier and they've either dropped on the spot or went no more than 10 yards.
I probably don't have the specific information that you're looking for in it's entirety, but hopefully it can be a piece for you that you can use depending on the type of hunt that you're looking to do. Good luck and hope to hear a report back on how it went and what you used.
You can take this for what it's worth. I've hunted hogs here in Florida for over 40 years. I've taken several charges. The closest call I've had was with a 230 pound boar, I shot in the head with a load of 12ga OO buck from about 15 yards. It blew about 1/4 of his head away and he still charged me. I was able to get out of his way, with the help of a little 10-12 ft pine tree. He fell over dead about 10 yards past me, but I wanted no part of him in the mean time.
I'm sure a .223 will kill a hog, but you won't catch me hunting them without more gun than that.
They don't call them the "poor mans grizzly" for nothing.
I've killed plenty of hogs with my 17 HMR using a 20 grain bullet. The largest was 90 pounds. I dont think a .223 will have a problem with a bigger hog up to 200 pounds. Take out the lungs and they wont run far. When I shoot hogs with the HMR I take both lungs out and they go about 20 yards and they fall over dead. If they are not digging up grubs take the head shot and you wont have walk as far but what's an extra 60 feet.
Federal makes a medium game load in .223
Rifle Ammunition - Search by Caliber & Load - Fusion Ammo
And Corbon I think makes a good DPX load in .223 that's supposed to be good for hunting medium game. Of course these are all loaded to .223 specs, not 5.56. I don't think there is really any hunting 5.56 loads.
I don't hunt so I have zero experience. I keep my AR loaded with Black Hills mk262 or 75gr TAP for angry people with weapons trying to kill me.
Varmint cartridges on deer sized game, etc. A never ending story.
Yeah the .223/5.56mm will do it.
So will a .22 LR for poachers getting away with the smallest thing that will do it at close range.
But something a little bigger would be desirable, like a .243 Winchester.
I know...oh jeez a .243 versus .223...blah blah blah.
Trust me, the difference is a lot bigger than the numbers sound.
A nearby rancher friend uses a Ruger Mini-14 to shoot hogs on control. He just wants to rid himself of as many as possible. He states that the .223 is light for the task but they frequently later become buzzard bait so he's happy. He's taken 40 to 50 per year in recent years. The .223 with 55-grain soft points isn't putting them down for the count for him. He has a Winchester Model 100 .308 which works better but he doesn't want it banged about in the cab of his pickup.
I've taken a few hogs with the .30-06, one on a deer lease using a Sierra 150 grain handload wound tight. The bullet struck low behind the shoulder and stayed inside the 300 lb. hog, wrecking the vitals. He ran 50 yards to a large clump of scrub, holed up momentarily then scrambled on for 50 more yards for the creek. I was coming down out of a tree stand when he made his second scramble for the creek and couldn't make a shot. When I got to the creek I found him floating dead in a pool.
The particular handload tested to a bit over 3000 fps over the chronograph yet still failed to knock the hog off his feet at 40 yards out.
While riding with my rancher friend I once shot a pig that might have gone 125 lbs. with the .30-06 using some Lake City '67 ball ammo (152 grain fmj), striking the pig from 250 yards. It dropped where it stood when hit similarly to the larger hog mentioned above.
On another occasion I was out at his ranch and shot a very large hog with the .257 Roberts and a 117 grain "Light Magnum" factory load. This hog gave every impression of being much larger than the one I had bagged that weighed 304 lbs. field dressed. This hog was running directly away from me and was shot right up the rump, not the best angle. He kicked his hind legs like a bronc but kept going. The rancher found him a few days later beneath the circling buzzards. He was ginger red in color and easy to identify. The rancher was grateful to have him taken out.
Once while jump shooting ducks in a creek my brother-in-law and I jumped 5 hogs of about 125-150 lb size. I had a revolver in a holster but no time to bring it to bear so hit one in the side of the head at no more than 10 yards using a Winchester Model 12 12 gauge and a load of high-brass No. 6 shot. This had no visible effect on the pig which vamoosed with the rest of his brethren.
I wouldn't be interested in seriously pursuing hogs with a .223.
I've seen the .223 used by others on the usual sized Texas whitetail deer around here and it works fine with good hits. The ones I've seen shot were all taken at close range...like under 50 yards and were all body hits. I hear that head shots are popular here with the .223. I don't recall the types of bullets that were used on the deer taken in my presence.
I've taken 5 deer and seen family members take a couple more with the .220 Swift and loads that are still cranking more punch out at 300 yards than the .223 can manage at the muzzle. It works well with good hits but is still a bit of a stunt. It wouldn't be suitable for odd angles or long range in my opinion. My dad got the longest shot on deer with the Swift, landing a perfect heart/lung shot broadside at 204 steps. The deer struggled for 20 yards but expired almost immediately. The 55-grain Sierra boat tail soft point exited. On all deer shot with this bullet at shorter distances that same bullet exploded to dust. Velocity kills but something with a little more weight and penetration makes better sense in the long run.
I agree with bmcgilvray. I also think of a statement Elmer Keith made when referring to the 270 Winchester. He said " it's a damned adequate deer cartridge". Now this was said mainly to piss off Jack O'Conner, who championed the 270 as a great long range sheep rifle.
The 223 pales I comparison to the 270, or even the 257 Roberts.
I am a big fan of the 270, and consider it as low as I want to go for real deer hunting or hogs.
As much as I really like the 5.56, I'd probably use a .308 or bigger. As much as I like Mazda Miata's (they are fun to drive), I wouldn't try to race a 458 Italia with it.
I can't speak for hogs, we don't have em around here. But for Mule or Whitetail, .223 is more than sufficient with a well-placed shot.
Heck, my little sister bags a buck every year with a .222
It was on the move at ~80-90 yards running pretty fast. One shot, with iron sights, killed it instantly using 5.56x45 55gr. The side that is showing is the exit wound. I've killed hogs in Texas, but only with .308 150gr. Typical range was 50-150 yards, got two from exactly 344yds and the other from 346yds. Pretty sure 5.56 is not capable of that. No experience with deer and 5.56.
I have read a number of the messages from the grou, hope I can be of help. Regarding the Pigman show on the 5.56 with the 8 year old and a hundred yard shot. The issue was not the ability of the round at that range, but the boy. He was to young and not able to make the shot with confidence. I think the Pigman showed good wisdom. I have witnessed the 5.56 take them down quickly and humanly at 100 yards with a person who knows how to shoot,That is the main issue. It's good on 200lb hog, deer, varmints etc., 55g would be great.
Regarding a 308 Win. pig, elk, moose, bear etc., it does fine with 180gr.,/ 175gr. Or 168gr, match! Large moose or bear I might go up to a 200gr.
Snipers main guns have been the 308 Win., for years. Now it's moving to the 300 Win Mag for the range. --David--
Hey Jon try this link to the 556 forum. Skypup hunts hogs with his all the time and can give you all the in's and out's.
SIG 556 • View topic - SIG 556 Provides More Bacon
Here's a Big Boar the 556-P Eotech 512 took down a couple of months ago using the Hornady 5.56mm NATO TAP 2 ammo @ 125 yards.
Rifle = SIG 556
Scope = Burris Extreme Tactical 1-4X with Fast Fire
Range = 200 yards
Ammo = Prvi 69 grain .223 BTHP
Time = 5 seconds