SBR/NFA Questions

SBR/NFA Questions

This is a discussion on SBR/NFA Questions within the Defensive Rifles & Shotgun Discussion forums, part of the Related Topics category; Ok, seeing as how my daughter was born last week, and my wife now has her new handbag, it's time for my new toy - ...

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Thread: SBR/NFA Questions

  1. #1
    Member Array OperatorJ's Avatar
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    SBR/NFA Questions

    Ok, seeing as how my daughter was born last week, and my wife now has her new handbag, it's time for my new toy - and I'm considering building an SBR. I don't know a lot about the NFA process yet, but I'll be checking out the ATF website for that. The only caveat may be that I want to build this as an upper-only and utilize my current RRA lower receiver. Is that doable? I'd like to do that primarily as a cost-savings measure (for now). So here's what I'm looking at:

    8-10" barrel length
    Possibly suppressed
    Uses include: home defense, close range hunting, general plinking

    So far, I'm considering either 5.56 or 300BLK. A few big draws to 300BLK are subsonic ammo for suppressed shooting, requires only a barrel change from a standard 5.56 upper, and I've heard rumors that you can use a 9mm suppressor - which has me considering getting a threaded barrel for my M&P - but back to the rifle... What do you guys think? Which caliber? Any recommendations on the best way to go about this project? I'm sure I'll need to answer other questions, but I'm tired and we're losing an hour of sleep tonight, so that's all I can think about right now.

    I do know there is a $200 transfer fee for each SBR / suppressor, and I've included that in my budget for the project. I'm just looking for some input from the experts on here. Thanks guys!


    OpJ

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  2. #2
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    Send HotGuns a PM and he can step you though the entire process or he'll post it up here for everyone's edification. He is probably the most knowledgeable person here on SBR's and Suppressors and the BATFE rules regarding same. Keep us posted - sounds fun!

    Do some searches here for SBR and Suppressors and you'll find a treasure trove of ideas too! There are a lot of people that know a lot here so have fun.

    Congratulations on the new Daughter too!
    Last edited by Rock and Glock; March 11th, 2012 at 12:11 PM.

  3. #3
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    You can use your current reciever.

    Since you are going to do it yourself, you will use what is known as a Form 1. This form is used for DIYers and what you need if you want to make a SBR,SBS or even make your own suppressor.

    You will fill it out. You will use the current serial number of your lower, but you will need to engrave your name adress and zip code somewhere on the recievers. On the AR,most people put their info on the magwell.

    You will need to enter the length of the upper that you use.

    You will need to fill a citizenship form, you will need two sets of fingerprint cards. On your form, you'll need the CLEO signature, as well as two passport sized photographs that get taped to the Form.

    Get that done, send it to the ATF with a check for 200 bucks. Wait anywhere from 6-8 months for approval, and someday you'll be coming home from work, you'll check the mail and there it will be.

    Once you have the Form One in hand, you can pin whatever lower you want on there and go back again to a legal length if you want to, because its the lower that is registered as the SBR, not the upper.

    I'd definatley go with the Blackout. The .223 loses a lot of velocity in an SBR, the .300 AAC is much more practical.

    You can use a 9mm can, and most of them sound great, but you have to understand that the 9mm cans are only rated for subsonic and not supersonic as much supersonic use will tear them up. I've sold several brands of 9mm cans just for dual use, its a pretty popular combo, because most people set up their Blackouts for sub use anyway, if they need a hotter round they'll just grab a .30 or something else.

    Most of the Blackouts that I build are in the 9-10" range. They'll shoot fine, are accurate and with most suppressors on them they arent any longer than a regular length rifle. Fimding handguards that fit the 9 is easy, 8's are hard to find.

    You can email the ATF and have them send all of the above to you in the mail for free. You'll need two Form Ones, two fingerprint cards,and the form known as the 5330.20,(citizenship form) certifiying you as a U.S. citizen.

    Hint...get a few more Forms that you think you'll need, in case you screw one up. Once you get started in the NFA world, no one stops at just one anyways...
    I would rather stand against the cannons of the wicked than against the prayers of the righteous.


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  4. #4
    VIP Member Array jonconsiglio's Avatar
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    HotGuns is dead on man, it never stops at one...

    There is a form online I found that you can fill in and print. I'll have to look again, but I keep a handful printed out that are filled in except for the specifics on the rifle. That way, I just fill in the little bit needed and off it goes. Between suppressors and SBR's, I can't remember the last time I wasn't waiting on at least one or two to come back.

    In addition to HotGuns' info, here's a couple links that are good reading to help familiarize you with the process and will give you little tips to help along the way. That way, at least you'll know what others are talking about and will put you more on track. HotGuns can answer the more specific questions then. Mot stuff was already covered, but I'll add that you should make 100% sure your lower is in spec and it's definitely the one you want to hold onto since you're basically married to it from this point on. You can always order a stripped Noveske or Daniel Defense for under $200 then add the lower parts kit of your choosing and receiver extension during the 5 to 6 month wait, or however long it currently takes. Just pointing out that you don't need to buy a complete lower or rifle if you find you don't want to be stuck with what you currently own for any reason. I know Noveske and some others will allow you to order the lower as an SBR, which I've done, so no engraving is necessary.

    How to SBR your current lower - How to SBR Your Lower by Scottryan - M4Carbine.net Forums

    State to state NFA laws, where to get your forms, how to set up a trust and other useful info - NFA info - M4Carbine.net Forums

    ATF NFA Handbook - http://www.atf.gov/publications/down...f-p-5320-8.pdf
    Rock and Glock and Skygod like this.
    Proven combat techniques may not be flashy and may require a bit more physical effort on the part of the shooter. Further, they may not win competition matches, but they will help ensure your survival in a shooting or gunfight on the street. ~Paul Howe

  5. #5
    Member Array OperatorJ's Avatar
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    Thanks for the wealth of information gents! So, would you not recommend using my current Rock River Arms lower? As far as I know, it's mil spec, but I'm not sure how to verify that. If not, what would a good lower to be married to be? Keep in mind, that will extend my budget, which is not ideal, but I understand the reasoning.


    OpJ

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  6. #6
    VIP Member Array jonconsiglio's Avatar
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    If you think it's good to go, go for it. I

    I've mentione this before, but my buddy SBR'd his and all was fine. He then ordered an LMT 10.5" upper and it wouldn't close on the RRA. Turns out the RRA was out of spec. It was always tight with others, but this was too tight.

    If you have access to gauges, certainly check it if possible, before sending off you paperwork. Pretty much any lower will be fine to SBR as long as its 7075 and in spec.

    I have my preferences, but that's just based on what has and has not worked for me.
    Proven combat techniques may not be flashy and may require a bit more physical effort on the part of the shooter. Further, they may not win competition matches, but they will help ensure your survival in a shooting or gunfight on the street. ~Paul Howe

  7. #7
    Member Array OperatorJ's Avatar
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    I don't have gauges. Wonder if my LGS would have them, I would think so. I believe I found the specs in one of those links you provided Jon. I'll have to call tomorrow and check. I'll do some more research and find out. If my RRA doesn't work out, any recommendations on a good spec lower that won't break the bank? I'm not opposed to piecing it together myself, but I don't have a lot of tools to do the final assembly & run certain checks on it. I've not gotten this in-depth before, but I'm not afraid to, as long as I have good resources on hand to help me out - like you guys.

    I've also heard that you can buy an SBR lower (stripped or complete) and then you don't need to get your info engraved on it. Can you guys verify that for me? If true, that may be the route I want to go anyway.


    OpJ

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  8. #8
    Senior Member Array Skygod's Avatar
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    The SBR registration is pretty easy. I've had my best luck with purchasing SBR upper recievers straight from the factory. LMT, BCM and DD.

    The LMT CQB MRP is the easiest. Two torx head screws with the supplied torque wrench and it's a 5 minute take out/put in procedure. Two rifles in one reciever. Of course pinning on an SBR upper is just as easy but the LMT CQB MRP upper is really second to none in the 10.5" configuration.

    BCM does not currently manufacture anything less than 11" barreled SBR's but they do have a whole selection of them with many rail offerings and CHF and standard Mil-Spec barrels and stainless barrels.

    My DD SBR upper is the newer Mk18 series that has supposedly replaced the LMT SBR upper on the military's/Navy Mk18. It's rock solid @ 10.3"

    I built my SBR lower with what I wanted in it and out of it to my own specs. I had that lower registered. It only took 2 months to get my stamped Form-1. I'd not do the whole rifle SBR Form-4 process. Yes, it's a PITA to have the lower engraved. I was lucky and found a guy that used a nice clean process to engrave it for me for $25.

    That's just me.
    Perhaps your sole purpose in life is to serve as a warning to others.

  9. #9
    Senior Member Array Landric's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Skygod View Post
    I built my SBR lower with what I wanted in it and out of it to my own specs. I had that lower registered. It only took 2 months to get my stamped Form-1. I'd not do the whole rifle SBR Form-4 process. Yes, it's a PITA to have the lower engraved. I was lucky and found a guy that used a nice clean process to engrave it for me for $25.

    That's just me.
    Good luck with that these days. I just got a suppressor form 4 stamp back. It was pending 163 days. I have another suppressor and SBR that have been pending 49 days and my other SBR has been pending 64 days. I'm not expecting any of them to come back before June or so. Wait time have been creeping up for the past nine months or so. Six months is about average for a form 1 or form 4 right now.
    -Landric

    "The Engine could still smile...it seemed to scare them" -Felix

  10. #10
    Member Array OperatorJ's Avatar
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    Yeah, the wait time will suck, but I'll spend 3 months of it in training, so at least that part will go by quickly.

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