M14 series rifle reliability

M14 series rifle reliability

This is a discussion on M14 series rifle reliability within the Defensive Rifles & Shotgun Discussion forums, part of the Related Topics category; I carried a few of the M16 series rifles for a couple of years in the Marines; in my experiences, if you didn’t clean them ...

Page 1 of 3 123 LastLast
Results 1 to 15 of 37

Thread: M14 series rifle reliability

  1. #1
    Senior Member Array cagueits's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2006
    Location
    Puerto Rico
    Posts
    911

    Question M14 series rifle reliability

    I carried a few of the M16 series rifles for a couple of years in the Marines; in my experiences, if you didn’t clean them daily, you wouldn’t get them to work under battle field conditions.

    I never carried an M14, so how long could the M14 series rifle go without cleaning (actual battle conditions – going thorough river crossings/mud/sand/etc) before experiencing a jam? Any vets that carried the rifle out there, your comments are most welcome.


  2. #2
    VIP Member Array SatCong's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2005
    Location
    Arizona
    Posts
    2,925
    In Nam, if you had to a long time, as long the piston moves back and forth.

  3. #3
    Distinguished Member Array RSSZ's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2005
    Location
    USA
    Posts
    1,843
    Believe me.......they're akin to the pink bunny with the drum ! (with a small amount of tinkering) ----------

  4. #4
    Lead Moderator
    Array rstickle's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2004
    Location
    Laurel, MD
    Posts
    21,961
    They weren't as "tight", and therefore a little more forgiving. Don't think I ever had a problem with one while I was in.
    Rick

    EOD - Initial success or total failure

  5. #5
    Senior Member Array AirForceShooter's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2004
    Location
    Central Florida
    Posts
    1,155
    my M-14 functioned in all conditions and I mean all of them.
    When Uncle Sugar took it away from me and gave me an M-16, no A, no 1, I couldn't wait to dump that piece of trash. Thank the Lord I was with the Aussies who, after one look at the 16, took pity on me and handed me a FAL. Probably saved my life.
    I still want my M-14 back.
    edit for this:
    The people in my command were always allowed to use "captured" weapons. That's from VN to DS1.






    AFS
    Last edited by AirForceShooter; September 7th, 2006 at 12:32 PM.
    Gun control is hitting what you aim at

  6. #6
    Distinguished Member Array randytulsa2's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2006
    Location
    Oklahoma
    Posts
    1,548
    Forgive my (hopefully slight) off-topic rant here.

    I had an M16 in the Marine Corps. It was an A1.

    I was required to memorize that it was a "Lightweight, Air-cooled, Gas-operated, Magazine-fed, Semi-automatic, Automatic, shoulder Weapon".

    They even gave me a neat acronym by wihch to remember that description, and which accounts for the seemingly random capitalization set forth above: "LAGMSAW".

    I still remember the serial number. It was 1052985.

    Now days I am told they have A2's and others, and that they are as reliable as any weapon ever made.

    But friends, my M16 was, quite simply, a POS. Maybe it was shot-out before I got it. Maybe we were just mismatched.

    I had hunted deer all my life and NEVER had a problem with a bolt-action .30-06. It shot. Every time you had a round in the magazine and you cranked that bolt, that baby S-H-O-T. "Boom", it said.

    Silly me, I thought our government might just make sure that people who were risking their lives for its policies had a weapon that was at least equally reliable as grandpa's deer rifle. Or at least "minimally reliable".

    That !@#$%$#@#$% M16 jammed every third round when fired on full-auto. It didn't matter HOW MUCH cleaning I did to it. And it didn't work all the time on semi, either. Results were better on semi-auto when it was cleaned. For best results, it needed to be cleaned after every !@@#$#@#$ shot.

    In contrast to the "boom" of my old '06, the M16 had a habit of going "click, click, click".

    I would have preferred my old deer rifle to it. I would have preferred a rail-splitter to it, because you couldn't even use that flimsy POS aluminum whatnot alloy M16 as a club when it didn't shoot (which was often, if I haven't mentioned it).

    One thing really kind of summed it up for me at the time. The doggoned thing had been manufactured with a "forward assist". That meant to me that someone involved in the design of that particular "rifle" KNEW it was unreliable and built in a jam-clearer (instead of making sure the damn thing WORKED properly to begin with).

    Yes, I am bitter about it.

    Just one of many things that made me want out of the military and away from the government as fast as I could get there.

  7. #7
    Lead Moderator
    Array rstickle's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2004
    Location
    Laurel, MD
    Posts
    21,961
    Quote Originally Posted by randytulsa2 View Post
    That meant to me that someone involved in the design of that particular "rifle" KNEW it was unreliable and built in a jam-clearer (instead of making sure the damn thing WORKED properly to begin with).

    Yes, I am bitter about it.
    Be careful, it's unhealthy to hold back!

    That may have been an advantage to EOD being classed as "Combat Support" in the Army, we got the old "working" stuff!
    Rick

    EOD - Initial success or total failure

  8. #8
    VIP Member
    Array dr_cmg's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2006
    Location
    Alabama
    Posts
    10,808
    The M14 was the natural descendant of the M1 Garand. The M16 was the illegitimate off spring of a Mattel Shootin' Shell and a drunk US bureaucrat. Then add to that the government's wonderful ability to screw up the recipe for ice water and you get a rifle that is issued without a cleaning kit (even though the manufacturer stated that it was necessary) and ammo for that rifle that does not meet the manufacturer's specifications.

    The original M16 might not be the worse weapons procurement mess up in US history, but it has a long lead on whatever was third and is right on the heels of number 1.

    The M14 was a superior weapon. There were problems with using it in a jungle environment, but none were with its reliability. It was too long and too heavy for the environment. The solution would have been to create a carbine version. Then at least the soldier or marine using it would have had a weapon that functions. Instead the government bought a weapon that had numerous shortcomings and exacerbated them by not providing the cleaning kit nor proper ammo. So the user was left with a weapon he could not even use as a club.

    Rant over - you touched a hot button issue.
    George

    Two things are infinite: the universe and human stupidity; and I'm not sure about the universe. Albert Einstein

  9. #9
    Senior Member Array cagueits's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2006
    Location
    Puerto Rico
    Posts
    911
    Quote Originally Posted by dr_cmg View Post
    The solution would have been to create a carbine version.
    To solve that problem I really like the Vltor collapsible stock other forum members suggested. Link:

    http://www.vltor.com/socom.htm

    A link I found that you will love:

    http://video.google.com/videoplay?do...48791930127574

    More info on the weapon on the video:

    http://www.janes.com/defence/land_fo...0510_1_n.shtml

    There was a really nice side view on wikipedia - don't know what happened to the photo:

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_...d_Battle_Rifle
    Last edited by cagueits; September 7th, 2006 at 01:50 PM. Reason: Typo

  10. #10
    JD
    JD is offline
    Administrator
    Array JD's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2006
    Location
    Central Iowa
    Posts
    19,290
    From what I've heard (second hand) you could drag the thing from the back of a tank for a mile through mud and it would still bang away....gotta love a good rifle, my next long gun will be a SOCOM 16

  11. #11
    Senior Member Array cagueits's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2006
    Location
    Puerto Rico
    Posts
    911

  12. #12
    Member Array msg usa's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2006
    Location
    USA
    Posts
    130
    I would give my left (dingle-berry) to own an M-14. I've spent more time cuddled up with that rifle than I did with women, back in those days. It was heavy, clunky, loud, would bite a chunk out of your belly if the breech closed unexpectedly, BUT would go BANG every time!! Dirt, sand, water, mud, foliage, just knock off the big chunks and continue firing. 7.62 is a great round. She was real accurate up to and beyond 300 meters. I loved my 14 and would love to have one of my own. Sweet!! (glad to hear today's young snipers are bringing back the 14)
    God Bless the USA

  13. #13
    VIP Member Array ELCruisr's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2006
    Location
    Central FL
    Posts
    2,073
    Served with a gent in the late 70's who had done his tour of 'nam back in the very early days. He always sang the praises of his M-14. He got stuck in the boonies without resupply for 30 days on one operation. It was so dirty he had to force the first round forward out of the clip. At the end of the operation with the rifle in that condition he, as he put it, had a little "set to" with the enemy. He credited the fact that it still operated with saving his butt. He never said a kind word about the M-16. Figured he lost to many friends when they were issued.
    If you stand up and be counted, from time to time you may get yourself knocked down. But remember this: A man flattened by an opponent can get up again. A man flattened by conformity stays down for good. ~ Thomas J. Watson, Jr.

  14. #14
    VIP Member
    Array dr_cmg's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2006
    Location
    Alabama
    Posts
    10,808
    cagueits, thanks for the links! I have just spent 15 minutes or so just scanning them. Now the carbine exists a mere 35 years after it was needed. I guess I need to sell the car to buy me an M14. I used one in ROTC summer camp at Ft. Bragg in 1969. Thought it was a fantastic weapon. Fast forward 2 years and I am a training officer at Ft. Ord, CA. The trainees are using the M16. I spent some time with it and then I washed my hands of it. We had no choice of what we used for training nor for combat, but I hated to think that the boys we were training were going to go to SouthEast Asia and handed that plastic back scratcher to use to defend himself. Like I said you could not even us it as a club. And it was too light to use as a boat anchor.

    I would hate to be the guy that approved the M16 for issue to the US military. There is no way of telling how much blood he has on his hand for sending our troops out with that thing. There is plenty of guilt to go around. What about the guy who decided it did not need a cleaning kit. In SouthEast Asia? He may be the most guilty. And while we are passing out the guilt don't forget the guy who procured the ammo that did not meet manufacturer specs. I hope if they are still alive that they suffer everyday from the knowledge that they killed and maimed thousands of Americans through their stupidity. If they aren't alive I hope they died realizing what they had done.

    There I go again. Rant off. It's just that as a training officer I had to send these guys on the AIT and the Army would send them to SE Asia without the benefit of a decent weapon to use to defend themselves. And although I did not make the decision I still feel responsible. Sometimes someone will say something about a movie about Viet Nam. When they do I always hope they won't ask me if I have seen it. Because if they do I will tell them that I have never seen nor do I ever intend to see a movie about Viet Nam. I'll then give them a brief statement about training guys who went and did not come back making it impossible for me to watch a movie about it. If they keep on about it for about 15 or 20 seconds I will go off on them and tell them exactly what it feels like to train a guy to use a weapon that you know will fail on him. And then send the guy off to Viet Nam where the failure of the weapon will most likely be fatal. I'll tell them about phone calls to the company to let us know that so and so was killed in Nam. And about how it feels to know that you failed that kid because you sent him off thinking he had the best equipment in the world when you knew the enemy's rifle was a superior weapon. I cannot watch even a poor portrayal of those guys dying for lack of a weapon that would work.

    Sorry, I really just wanted to say thanks for the links, but this is a subject that has played on me for years. It is one of those that sets me off in an instant. I apologize to anyone who owns an AR15 and thinks it is a great weapon. I am not talking about your weapon, but about the early M16s issued to American soldiers and marines. It was like handing them a live grenade and then when they weren't looking pulling the pen.
    George

    Two things are infinite: the universe and human stupidity; and I'm not sure about the universe. Albert Einstein

  15. #15
    Administrator
    Array QKShooter's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2004
    Location
    Off Of The X
    Posts
    35,577
    randytulsa2 that was a great post.
    Liberty Over Tyranny Μολὼν λαβέ

Page 1 of 3 123 LastLast

Links

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  

Similar Threads

  1. .22 LR reliability
    By BlackJack in forum Defensive Ammunition & Ballistics
    Replies: 38
    Last Post: August 1st, 2013, 11:46 PM
  2. Handgun Reliability Poll - Springfield XD series
    By 10thmtn in forum Defensive Carry Guns
    Replies: 57
    Last Post: August 17th, 2009, 11:18 PM
  3. 1911: colt 80 series vs 70 series vs SIG GSR
    By hughduffel in forum Defensive Carry Guns
    Replies: 6
    Last Post: July 29th, 2008, 09:56 AM
  4. Reliability
    By BlackJack in forum General Firearm Discussion
    Replies: 3
    Last Post: April 27th, 2008, 08:56 PM
  5. Reliability ????
    By dbracin in forum Defensive Carry Guns
    Replies: 15
    Last Post: November 18th, 2006, 10:13 AM

Search tags for this page

are m14 rifles reliable
,
how reliable is the m14
,
is the m14 reliable
,
m14 action reliability
,

m14 reliability

,
m14 reliabilty
,
m14 reliable in sand
,
m14 rifle reliability
,
m14 vs m16 reliability
,
reliability m14 vietnam
,
reliability of m14
,
reliability of the m14
Click on a term to search for related topics.