Army Bans High Performance Mags (PMags Included)

This is a discussion on Army Bans High Performance Mags (PMags Included) within the Defensive Rifles & Shotgun Discussion forums, part of the Related Topics category; Sounds like the decision of someone sitting behind a desk if you ask me. In Reversal, Army Bans High-Performance Rifle Mags | Military.com Opinions? Seems ...

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Thread: Army Bans High Performance Mags (PMags Included)

  1. #1
    Distinguished Member Array DontTreadOnI's Avatar
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    Army Bans High Performance Mags (PMags Included)

    Sounds like the decision of someone sitting behind a desk if you ask me.

    In Reversal, Army Bans High-Performance Rifle Mags | Military.com

    Opinions? Seems like this decision could be putting some lives at risk, all because someone wants more money.

    The Army has ordered that soldiers may use only government-issued magazines with their M4 carbines, a move that effectively bans one of the most dependable and widely used commercial-made magazines on today’s battlefield.

    The past decade of war has spawned a wave of innovation in the commercial soldier weapons and equipment market. As a result, trigger-pullers in the Army, Marines and various service special operations communities now go to war armed with commercially designed kit that’s been tested under the most extreme combat conditions.

    Near the top of such advancements is the PMAG polymer M4 magazine, introduced by Magpul Industries Corp. in 2007. Its rugged design has made it as one of the top performers in the small-arms accessory arena, according to combat veterans who credit the PMAG with drastically improving the reliability of the M4.

    Despite the success of the PMAG, Army officials from the TACOM Life Cycle Management Command issued a “safety of use message” in April that placed it, and all other polymer magazines, on an unauthorized list.

    The message did not single out PMAGs, but instead authorizes only the use of Army-issued aluminum magazines. The message offers little explanation for the new policy except to state that “Units are only authorized to use the Army-authorized magazines listed in the technical manuals.” Nor does it say what Army units should now do with the millions of dollars’ worth of PMAGs they’ve purchased over the years
    More info after the jump.
    If ye love wealth better than liberty, the tranquility of servitude than the animated contest of freedom, go from us in peace. We ask not your counsels or arms. Crouch down and lick the hands which feed you. May your chains sit lightly upon you, and may posterity forget that you were our countrymen.

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    Sounds like it to me also, doesn't make much sense otherwise.
    "Don't start none, won't be none!"

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    Member Array DurrtyBoy's Avatar
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    Sounds like someone isn't receiving any kickback money from PMAG and therefore they are out. Why would you get rid of a product that is operating well in favor of a new and not as well tested one? Smells a little fishy to me!

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    VIP Member Array jonconsiglio's Avatar
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    There is a valid reason for this. Take the new IAR for example. They don't accept PMags and in the heat of battle, it's inevitable one will be fed into an IAR and that precious few seconds can make all the difference.

    Mags are disposable. GI mags are extremely reliable if people accept the fact they're disposable, just like PMags. Throw them out when they reach the end of their life cycle.

    PMags are great, don't get me wrong, but there's not much advantage over a new GI mag. If you read through the thread I linked below, pay close attention to who's posting. Failure2Stop is a Bronze Star recipient. A couple guys are special operations. Iraq Guns is a contractor who services hundreds of rifles regularly. You'll see many prefer GI mags, though some prefer PMags. There's no "better", it comes down to personal experience. I can tell you that I've seen a higher percentage of broken PMags than I have GI mags. Anything but black PMags are more prone to failure also, which I noticed a number of years ago. It must be the additive in the compound, I'm not a chemist (if that's even who would know!) so I don't know.

    The fact is, the GI mag is a great magazine. Throw them out when they reach the end of their life cycle. Same with PMags. Try not to run them over with a truck then they won't bend or break as often. There are many magazine related failures from PMags, they're not what many make them out to be. Keep in mind as I say this, I have more than a few dozen loaded and ready to go, and I trust the one's I own 100%. I trust my GI mags 100% as well. If a mag fails me, I paint mark it and it goes in the training mag pile or the garbage, depending.

    Personally, I think it's a good idea to stick to just the GI mags. They work in every rifle in service while the PMags do not.

    Big Army says no more polymer mags - M4Carbine.net Forums
    sixgun, Bark'n, ANGLICO and 2 others like this.
    Proven combat techniques may not be flashy and may require a bit more physical effort on the part of the shooter. Further, they may not win competition matches, but they will help ensure your survival in a shooting or gunfight on the street. ~Paul Howe

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    Distinguished Member Array DontTreadOnI's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jonconsiglio View Post
    There is a valid reason for this. Take the new IAR for example. They don't accept PMags and in the heat of battle, it's inevitable one will be fed into an IAR and that precious few seconds can make all the difference.

    Mags are disposable. GI mags are extremely reliable if people accept the fact they're disposable, just like PMags. Throw them out when they reach the end of their life cycle.

    PMags are great, don't get me wrong, but there's not much advantage over a new GI mag. If you read through the thread I linked below, pay close attention to who's posting. Failure2Stop is a Bronze Star recipient. A couple guys are special operations. Iraq Guns is a contractor who services hundreds of rifles regularly. You'll see many prefer GI mags, though some prefer PMags. There's no "better", it comes down to personal experience. I can tell you that I've seen a higher percentage of broken PMags than I have GI mags. Anything but black PMags are more prone to failure also, which I noticed a number of years ago. It must be the additive in the compound, I'm not a chemist (if that's even who would know!) so I don't know.

    The fact is, the GI mag is a great magazine. Throw them out when they reach the end of their life cycle. Same with PMags. Try not to run them over with a truck then they won't bend or break as often. There are many magazine related failures from PMags, they're not what many make them out to be. Keep in mind as I say this, I have more than a few dozen loaded and ready to go, and I trust the one's I own 100%. I trust my GI mags 100% as well. If a mag fails me, I paint mark it and it goes in the training mag pile or the garbage, depending.

    Personally, I think it's a good idea to stick to just the GI mags. They work in every rifle in service while the PMags do not.

    Big Army says no more polymer mags - M4Carbine.net Forums
    Thanks for the info and link Jon. If there's anyone around here I'm gonna listen to on this topic, it'd be you.
    If ye love wealth better than liberty, the tranquility of servitude than the animated contest of freedom, go from us in peace. We ask not your counsels or arms. Crouch down and lick the hands which feed you. May your chains sit lightly upon you, and may posterity forget that you were our countrymen.

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    Thanks Jon. I'll un-wad my panties as well.

    I love my PMags.
    DontTreadOnI and scgunlover1 like this.
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    VIP Member Array Thunder71's Avatar
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    Where do I get in line for all the military surplus PMags? :D

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    VIP Member Array jonconsiglio's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DontTreadOnI View Post
    Thanks for the info and link Jon. If there's anyone around here I'm gonna listen to on this topic, it'd be you.
    Thanks man. I'm far from an expert, but I do try to pass on factual information and personal experience as best I can.

    Quote Originally Posted by WHEC724 View Post
    Thanks Jon. I'll un-wad my panties as well.

    I love my PMags.
    Don't worry, I guarantee there will be something else soon to wad them up again... Mine stay at a heightened state of ready!
    Proven combat techniques may not be flashy and may require a bit more physical effort on the part of the shooter. Further, they may not win competition matches, but they will help ensure your survival in a shooting or gunfight on the street. ~Paul Howe

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    Member Array DurrtyBoy's Avatar
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    Thanks for the insight jon - i was ready to go "conspiracy" Might need to limit my coffee intake in the a.m.

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    VIP Member Array jonconsiglio's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DurrtyBoy View Post
    Thanks for the insight jon - i was ready to go "conspiracy" Might need to limit my coffee intake in the a.m.
    Well, don't give up on that theory yet… It may very well be a conspiracy and maybe, just maybe, I might be involved in it…!
    Proven combat techniques may not be flashy and may require a bit more physical effort on the part of the shooter. Further, they may not win competition matches, but they will help ensure your survival in a shooting or gunfight on the street. ~Paul Howe

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    VIP Member Array varob's Avatar
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    Jon, what's an IAR? I've not heard of that?
    Don't believe what you hear and only half of what you see!
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    VIP Member Array jonconsiglio's Avatar
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    EDIT - Thunder71 beat me to it!

    Quote Originally Posted by varob View Post
    Jon, what's an IAR? I've not heard of that?
    It's the HK fielded by the marines right now. It's an addition (and replacement depending on mission) for the m249 SAW. It's basically an HK 416 that's modified for full auto fire. In certain situations, it offers advantages over the m249. It's faster to reload, lighter and it fires from a closed bolt, so it's more accurate. It's not a replacement for the 249, just another option.

    Now, it's being used by the Marines right now, but we'll likely see it used by all branches at some point as well as US SOCOM.

    As for the main topic, keep in mind that this is for all polymer mags. PMags are the most widely used, but there are others being used as well with less than stellar results.

    Marines + HK M27 IAR = The Good Lord's Work - M4Carbine.net Forums
    Proven combat techniques may not be flashy and may require a bit more physical effort on the part of the shooter. Further, they may not win competition matches, but they will help ensure your survival in a shooting or gunfight on the street. ~Paul Howe

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    Quote Originally Posted by jonconsiglio View Post
    As for the main topic, keep in mind that this is for all polymer mags. PMags are the most widely used, but there are others being used as well with less than stellar results. [/URL]
    That's what changed my mind about this topic when I went to the first link you posted. I can now see the need for a uniformly used mag. If guys are over there playing in the sand that have a cheap mag they thought would perform well but doesn't, it could very easily get them or someone else killed.
    If ye love wealth better than liberty, the tranquility of servitude than the animated contest of freedom, go from us in peace. We ask not your counsels or arms. Crouch down and lick the hands which feed you. May your chains sit lightly upon you, and may posterity forget that you were our countrymen.

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    Senior Member Array Herknav's Avatar
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    The title of the article says "High-Performance Rifle Mags". What makes a PMag "high performance"? That's an honest question as opposed to my usual sarcasm.
    I would rather wake up in the middle of nowhere than in any city on Earth.--Steve McQueen

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