Is a shotgun "useless"? - Page 4

Is a shotgun "useless"?

This is a discussion on Is a shotgun "useless"? within the Defensive Rifles & Shotgun Discussion forums, part of the Related Topics category; Originally Posted by nedrgr21 Nope, more misleading info on the SG. Each pellet of 00 Buck is nowhere near a 9mm. They are 32 caliber ...

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Thread: Is a shotgun "useless"?

  1. #46
    Senior Member Array munch520's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by nedrgr21 View Post
    Nope, more misleading info on the SG. Each pellet of 00 Buck is nowhere near a 9mm. They are 32 caliber weighing in at about 55 grains, and usually soft lead, which has deformed even before hitting the target, impeding penetration.
    Thanks, I missed that
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  2. #47
    Member Array Miamieddie's Avatar
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    I prefer a shotgun without a doubt , i would use buck shot dont have to aim just point too general area and pull u cant miss anything within 25yrds. Or less u will take him and his accomplise out in one shot, and if hes closer than 10ft. You"ll cut him in half, now if hes 50or100 yards away or better than i will use a rifle, but if theyre that far from u there no longer a threat, bottom line is shotgun is the better choice.

  3. #48
    VIP Member Array 10thmtn's Avatar
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    Some of the advantages of the shotgun not already mentioned in this thread -

    Can be used to hunt small game without vaporizing it

    Can be used to hunt birds in flight

    Can be used to hit a moving target with "something" (you are accepting that some pellets will miss...know your backstop)

    Generally easier to find places to train (skeet/trap field) than a rifle

    Oh - and they cost MUCH less to buy (comparing a pump shotgun to even an inexpensive rifle)

    That said, I have moved our Mini 14 to the front of the safe for HD use - for the simple reason that it is easier for my (petite) wife to use than a 12 gauge. Unless the BGs are wearing body armor, I feel (maybe incorrectly) that the shotgun is a better "stopper" at across the room distance.

    Different tools for different jobs - with some interesting overlap!
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  4. #49
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    dont have to aim just point too general area and pull u cant miss anything within 25yrds.
    Or less u will take him and his accomplise out in one shot,
    and if hes closer than 10ft. You"ll cut him in half
    Do you have some specific training that corroborates these statements? Any de-briefs of field events that corroborates these statements? Are there any established articles of a scholarly nature that support your statements?

    You have a fanciful expectation of what a shotgun can and can't do at certain distances, but your expectations are not grounded in reality. Certainly a shotgun has specific traits, and certainly can be a potent weapon, but your statements are not reality based.

    You would benefit tremendously from quality training on shotgun tactics before you really need one in a defensive manner.

    Anyway, welcome to the Forum, and enjoy your stay. You may particularly enjoy the rifle and shotgun sub-forums.
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  5. #50
    VIP Member Array ccw9mm's Avatar
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    In the hands of someone reasonably comfortable with all three platforms (handgun, shotgun, rifle), IMO it comes down to the distance of the engagement and the effective range of the gun. I'm assuming we're speaking of defensive use against threats in the OP's question, so for me we're speaking of <100yd distances.

    For myself, I'm more comfortable and competent with handgun and pistol, somewhat less competent and effective with rifle. Though, certainly much of that comes down to training.

    The way I was introduced to arms was: a handgun and shotgun are roughly equivalent, in terms of effective range "stopping" power, with the handgun having less maneuvering/disarm issues within contact distances; a long gun, generally speaking, is going to tend to have greater accuracy (simply based on longer sight radius and stability of aim); beyond their range, a rifle's needed. For myself, I've basically found this to be true. I would assume that a skilled and trained operator can likely use any platform within that basic <100yd range, with the exception of close-quarters given the maneuverability/disarm limits.
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  6. #51
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    where ya gonna sleep later with a buned out home?
    Good point. I guess I'll just have to piss on him to put him out.
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  7. #52
    Distinguished Member Array Arborigine's Avatar
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    I would imagine that a Brenneke slug, weighing 1.25 Oz or 546.8 Grains would make a pretty good impression on a guy in a bullet proof vest, even though it probably won't penetrate. If I can't stop a home intruder with 2 of these slugs followed by 6 rounds of 00 Buck , then I'd better move into a bunker.
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  8. #53
    VIP Member Array jonconsiglio's Avatar
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    There are some truly off the wall, uneducated/ignorant comments in this thread. Don't need to aim?? Cut them in half?? Jesus, and we wonder how asinine rumors get started. Contrary to popular belief, criminals do not shutter in horror atthe sound of a shotgun's action and often times they don't stop what got them shot in the first place even after catching some buckshot center mass.

    Also, as I'm sure this will be the next statement to come in this thread, a shotgun does not send one airborn after being shot by one. By all accounts after talking to a guy that was shot in the stomach/side by a 12 guage, it felt like catching a sucker punch, not being hit by a car on fire goig 85 with bear traps on the front as some here make it seem.

    A shotgun is not a plasma rifle in the 40 watt range, it's just another tool that we can use in situations where it may be appropriate.
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  9. #54
    Distinguished Member Array onacoma's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Arborigine View Post
    I would imagine that a Brenneke slug, weighing 1.25 Oz or 546.8 Grains would make a pretty good impression on a guy in a bullet proof vest, even though it probably won't penetrate.
    I think all of us remember the MP, at least I think he was an MP, who was standing by his HumVee in BaggDaddy when a sniper shot him, he was up within a period of 10 to 20 seconds after a direct hit. With tunnel vision are you going to realize that the BG is wearing body armor for a follow up?

    I've moved from a shotgun to a CX4 Storm with 9mm +P+ and a M6-A2 in 6.8mm. She Who Must Be obeyed, can handle the CX4 while I'm running the M6. So the BG wearing a couple of ceramic plates in his vest, a follow up to the head is a requirement.

    I do have my Winchester 94 and my bird gun for harvesting game, but the carbine and rifle are SD items.


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  10. #55
    Ex Member Array Pythius's Avatar
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    target practise? useless.

    stoping a robber? very useful.

    fighting an invading army of martians? useless.

    hunting ducks? useful.

    hunting ants? useless.

  11. #56
    Member Array Miamieddie's Avatar
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    Hi there rock and glock, no i have nothing to back up my statement on what a shot gun can do im new to guns and starting to like talking about it, to be honest i know much less than everyone here no lie just like throwing my senses in here, realisticaly i just watch alot of movies lol. So most of my statements will be based on movies, and lots of time i try to use logic.i dont get upset wen people correct me i just learn from it, thats why im here to go learning from all of you's, thanx...

  12. #57
    Ex Member Array lizjimbo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ScottM View Post
    As much fallacy as not having to aim at close range and simply racking the gun being enough to scare the intruder.

    Any of these may work but I would not bet my life on it.
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  13. #58
    Senior Member Array Cold Shot's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Miamieddie View Post
    Hi there rock and glock, no i have nothing to back up my statement on what a shot gun can do im new to guns and starting to like talking about it, to be honest i know much less than everyone here no lie just like throwing my senses in here, realisticaly i just watch alot of movies lol. So most of my statements will be based on movies, and lots of time i try to use logic.i dont get upset wen people correct me i just learn from it, thats why im here to go learning from all of you's, thanx...
    lol

  14. #59
    Senior Member Array munch520's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jonconsiglio View Post
    There are some truly off the wall, uneducated/ignorant comments in this thread. Don't need to aim?? Cut them in half?? Jesus, and we wonder how asinine rumors get started. Contrary to popular belief, criminals do not shutter in horror atthe sound of a shotgun's action and often times they don't stop what got them shot in the first place even after catching some buckshot center mass.

    Also, as I'm sure this will be the next statement to come in this thread, a shotgun does not send one airborn after being shot by one. By all accounts after talking to a guy that was shot in the stomach/side by a 12 guage, it felt like catching a sucker punch, not being hit by a car on fire goig 85 with bear traps on the front as some here make it seem.

    A shotgun is not a plasma rifle in the 40 watt range, it's just another tool that we can use in situations where it may be appropriate.
    Stop it with your logic and sense and experience and stuf.

    I've seen DIE HARD...I know how guns work! Lol
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    Monotony is the awful reward for the careful

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  15. #60
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    Miamieddie: Again, welcome! There are many folks here with vastly more experience than I, so you'll probably note I read a lot and rarely post when it comes to many matters. What makes this the best Forum on the 'net is the quality of our members, and how willing they are to teach, coach, and help new members, as I once was a few years ago. You'll learn Hollywood vastly overstates the power of all guns, and likes to show bodies flying through the air or body parts flying off for dramatic purposes. While we all wish our weapons of choice might produce such results, alas, that will never be the case.

    Anyway, enjoy, read and discover, and learn. A great place this is..............
    10thmtn likes this.

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