Please some serious advice and suggestions would be welcome regarding the AR15

This is a discussion on Please some serious advice and suggestions would be welcome regarding the AR15 within the Defensive Rifles & Shotgun Discussion forums, part of the Related Topics category; Before anyone calls me a wimp let me preface with this. I've been married for over two years and with my wife over 7. Since ...

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Thread: Please some serious advice and suggestions would be welcome regarding the AR15

  1. #1
    Member Array NYMike's Avatar
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    Please some serious advice and suggestions would be welcome regarding the AR15

    Before anyone calls me a wimp let me preface with this. I've been married for over two years and with my wife over 7. Since I've known her (we're both 42, so we're adults long before we were married) I've gotten into guns. We are originally from NYC so I was never around guns until I started shooting trap in my early 30s.

    Anyway against her wishes mainly for my safety as I had suffered depression in my 20s but was and am treated and am well now, I started buying rifles and handguns and shotguns with NYC permits, obviously passing their mental health and background checks. We have since moved out west to Nevada. I own a Glock 27, SA XD9, Ruger's 10/22, Mini -14 Target Model and SR-22 pistol, Mossberg's 590a1 and 930, a Hi-Point 995TS, and a Marlin .35 Rem which was a gift from my wife at our wedding which had formerly belonged to her deceased dad.

    My purchases started out slowly and my wife came around fully supportive of my new hobby for both sporting and defensive purposes, hence the gift of the .35 Rem. she is now and has been completely relaxed and not worried at all about my gun safety skills since her initial apprehension as she is aware of my safety practices and multiple training classes taken at schools like Frontsight, Thunder Ranch, and Gunsite ( all defensive pistol.)

    My pistols other than the .22, and my 590a1 are all defensive guns, the others are fun plinkers and target shooters.
    Now to the issue at hand. I have always wanted an AR-15, for no special reason other than to have one for fun plinking. I have no defensive purpose for it, no combat purpose for it, etc... It would just be added to my repertoire of target fun guns. Since everything that happened on Friday we debated the purpose of this gun for the casual gun owner.

    I explained that there are many more powerful guns out there like the .35 Rem she gave me. She countered with the capacity issue. I explained that guns like my Hi-Point which has a 10-15 round capacity was used in Columbine where the shooter was found with I believe 30 ten round mags, so what really is the difference other than its a pistol round vs. rifle. She accepted that argument. She understands banning hi cap mags, AR's, AK's, SKS's, etc... won't stop mass killing but feels it will reduce them.
    I explained data from the previous Clinton weapons ban bears no proof of that? I advised that one ban could easily lead to more.

    But in the end, regardless of our debate I couldn't in all honesty provide a truly valid reason for civilian ownership of rifles which can have capacities the way these type do. Hunting guns typically are more powerful but accept less ammo in their magazines or clips. I still want an AR especially because I fear they will be banned or severely limited more so than the previous ban. I KNOW that this is one gun she will not stand for in our home no matter how much she approves of my gun ownership and responsibility I have evidenced to her over the years. This may indeed pass, but I was looking for a clearer argument to present her as to why I as a civilian should be able to own such a gun.

    P.S. I explained I already own a Mini-14 although it is the much heavier target model, not exactly a weapon you want to be shooting offhand, but explained its the same .223 ammo and although I own only 5 and 10 round mags, mags can be purchased up to 30 or even 40 I believe. I also do believe if need be she'd probably not mind another regular Mini in the home, though I'd rather not have two.

    I apologize for the long drawn out story and question, but felt necessary to preface it so the entire situation is understood. Thanks for any replies.

    Should I bite the bullet and get one regardless of her feelings?

    Yes

    No
    Last edited by gasmitty; December 20th, 2012 at 02:47 PM. Reason: language workaround

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  3. #2
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    No.

    I'd go with a mini14 tactical and get some high cap mags. It will fill the same role and keep the wife happy. After all, a happy wife means a happy life.....and more "marital bliss".
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    NMB
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    You already own the Mini-14, your wife is going to hate you for buying the AR-15, not worth it in my opinion.

    I would buy 3 or 4 30 round mini 14 mags before they are made illegal and save the rest of your money for ammo.
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    Senior Member Array mulle46's Avatar
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    Is her objection based on the "evil" appearance of the AR? Or due to the Newton shooting? As far as getting one regardless of her feelings, only you can answer that question. Some say better to ask forgiveness than permission, but you would have to decide if the juice is worth the squeeze.
    You gain strength, courage, and confidence by every experience in which you really stop to look fear in the face. You are able to say to yourself, "I have lived through this horror. I can take the next thing that comes along." . . . You must do the thing you think you cannot do. Eleanor Roosevelt

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    With all due respect, nobody can answer that question but you. You know your wife, and what you can get away with, and what are deal breakers.

    Back when I was married (33 years worth) I didn't ask permission, unless it was a "can we afford it" question. I also learned that a gun safe, that only I had the combination to worked out very well. I had a number of guns that she didn't know about, and didn't need to know about.

    Advantage to adding another mini-14 is the interchangeability of magazines with the one you already own. That Ruger is a fine weapon. Might also look at the Ruger Scout, in 7.62. She shouldn't object to it, since it's a bolt action platform, and it doesn't look like those "evil black guns". That will be my next addition I believe.

    My wishes for many more years of marital bliss. :)
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    I wouldn't buy an AR just to buy one if that results in putting a serious strain on your marriage. It's really not a bandwagon that everybody needs to jump on just for the heckovit. There are so many other great rifles out there that will probably and ultimately be more useful to you.
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    hbc
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    Buy a few hi-cap AR15 magazines now, then you won't relinquish the possibility of having a non-neutered AR15 in the future if your wife "comes around."

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    There is only one "practical" need for these weapons - defense of yourself and your republic against armed oppressors of any stripe. And, of course, zombies.

    But the fact is that the AR and its kin are extremely good self/home defense weapons, exactly the type of weapon that the framers had in mind when they wrote the 2nd Amendment. There are "civilianized" rifles that are extremely close functional equivalents (i.e. your Mini-14), so the argument that the Mini is ok but the AR is verboten is just silly.

    In the end, however, this is a purely emotional reaction/argument from the "anti" side, and no amount of reason will sway the vast majority of them. If it is causing strife in the house, you can likely find another rifle (in fact, you already have one) that can fill the role of the AR in almost every respect.
    KBSR and aus71383 like this.
    A man fires a rifle for many years, and he goes to war. And afterward he turns the rifle in at the armory, and he believes he's finished with the rifle. But no matter what else he might do with his hands - love a woman, build a house, change his son's diaper - his hands remember the rifle.

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    Quote Originally Posted by hbc View Post
    Buy a few hi-cap AR15 magazines now, then you won't relinquish the possibility of having a non-neutered AR15 in the future if your wife "comes around."
    This is a good idea. It may sound silly but I have a dozen AK mags in the basement along with about 600 rounds of 7.62X39. I no longer have an AK or any gun chambered for 7.62X39. I feel that the value of my holdings will increase and I can sell this stuff at a later time if I wish to make a profit. Also, in the case of a real SHTF scenario I'm sure an AK will show up around here at some time and it will need to be fed.

    A gun can't run without mags and ammo. I suggest stocking up on ammo, Mini 14 mags and probably ten or so AR mags. You will be able to buy ARs and Minis in the future but 30 rd mags might not be around.
    aus71383 likes this.
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    patriot and who isn't. Its function is to obey orders, not originate them.

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    Since the dawn of the Republic, civilians have owned the very same small arms as the military. Further, it is the civilian market which develops new firearms technology which the military subsequently adopts. My grandfather hunted deer c. 1912 with a Winchester .351 self-loader, essentially a generation before the American military adopted a semi-automatic battle rifle. I therefore discount any arguments about civilians not having "powerful military weapons" at their disposal, since it was the civilians who developed them in the first place. And Bill Ruger's inspiration for the Mini-14 was allegedly to compete with the AR design for use by military markets. Conceptually, there is scant difference between an AR-15 and a Mini-14; they are both compact semi-automatics firing essentially the same round and fed by detachable magazines. Not to beat up your wife, but why someone would accept the Mini-14 yet find the AR-15 objectionable just escapes me.

    My wife understands my shooting hobby and also the defensive reasons for being armed. She knows I don't ever "need" another gun, just like I know she doesn't "need" another fancy bag, but we occasionally satisfy our own "wants" as finances allow. I really think this is your more rational argument.
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    Distinguished Member Array Hoganbeg's Avatar
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    I suggest you do some research into the letters and discussions leading up to the signing of the Constitution. The current focus of having arms for self-defense was an important but secondary consideration at that time. The ultimate reason put forth was to stand as a countervailing force against tyranny, whether foreign or domestic.

    Like car or home insurance it is a protection put in place before you actually need it so not needing it right now doesn't mean you won't need it in the future.

    So, the question should not be why does a civilian need such an arm but why she thinks you should not have one. Try to find out what her true objection is. I would ask her if she thinks you are going to go out and use it improperly. I would then ask her if she is afraid she herself would use it improperly. Assuming she admits neither of you are a danger to society, the only issue is secure storage to prevent it from getting into the wrong hands.

    Beyond that, it is a matter of what do you want. If you want it strongly enough, and finances aren't a concern, get it. If it's not that big a deal, go with atctimmy's sage advice (post #2). While you are re-reading his post be sure to look at his signature line on the bottom.
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    I enjoyed reading your post.

    Maybe you technically dont NEED one, but maybe you just really want one.

    Surely she has acquired things she really just wants for no other reason than she really really wants it. Check closets, jewelery boxes, and kitchen appliance locations for an inventory of these things. Designer handbags, chrome wheels, truffle oil, wine fridges, acrylic nails, botox, etc.

    If you really want one, get one. They are expensive though. For this to be fair you would have to forgo other things on the want list or save up specifically for this. Maybe you sell guns you don't love anymore or have become outdated. Maybe you get a part-time job. Be creative, fair, and forthright with your thoughts on this.

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    Member Array Eichorn's Avatar
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    I KNOW that this is one gun she will not stand for in our home no matter how much she approves of my gun ownership and responsibility I have evidenced to her over the years.
    Based on this, I would say, no, not at this time.
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    I really think the want for an AR-15 is more for show than anything else. The reason I say that is the Ar-15 looks stealthy, military black ops, swat team etc. The mini-14 does the same thing except it doesn't look like it's evil. Mine has a wood stock and is a ranch model. It fires the same .223 that an Ar-15 does but it's not dressed up in black. But, alot of folks like and want that look of black ops it is just looksas far as I can see. Pull an Ar-15 out now at the range people jump out of their skin and either want to hold it or run - depending on your view. Pull a mini-14 out and a whole different reaction (based on looks alone).
    " Life is tough and it gets tougher if your stupid." John Wayne.

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    Senior Member Array GeorgiaDawg's Avatar
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    Is she worried about you going on a rampage with a 30-rnd magazine? If not, then why does she care what others use them for? Does she not trust you?

    Until she comes around, I wouldn't get one. As others have said, if the wife aint happy, you aint happy. With that said, keep working on her. The rifle is for you, not some school shooter, and it shouldn't matter if you have a 5, 10, 30, or 100 round magazine, because it's for your enjoyment and you are a safe and responsible gun owner.
    "For by grace you have been saved through faith. And this is not your own doing; it is the gift of God, not a result of works, so that no one may boast." - Ephesians 2:8-9

    “The purpose of the law is not to prevent a future offense, but to punish the one actually committed” - Ayn Rand

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