Beuller? Beuller? ANyone? Anyone?
This is a discussion on Looking for Benelli Mod. within the Defensive Rifles & Shotgun Discussion forums, part of the Related Topics category; Trying to find someone who can put a Picatinny rail on the upper of a Benelli Super 90 M1... Anyone know of anyone? Thanks, Rick...
Trying to find someone who can put a Picatinny rail on the upper of a Benelli Super 90 M1...
Anyone know of anyone?
Pretty much a straightforward drill-n-tap (be sure to use 48 pitch screws). IIRC, if you get a more traditionally profiled rail, the 870 contour is the same as the Benelli.
Be cautious about adding weight to the receiver of a S-90. When I bought my S-90, I mounted a side saddle on it before ever firing it.
When I took it to the range, gun wouldn't cycle. Thought something was wrong with the gun so I removed the side saddle so I could take the gun back to the dealer. Thought I'd give it one more try to confirm gun wasn't working but now it cycled fine. Figured I must have had the screws too tight on the side saddle so remounted it a little looser and tried the gun. Cycled fine. Put six rounds in the side saddle and found that the gun would not cycle again. I finally realized what was happening. This is an intertia operated shotgun. By adding weight to the receiver, I was absorbing part of the recoil and there wasn't enough recoil remaining to cycle the gun. Found that I can not have more than four 2 3/4" shells or three 3" shells in the side saddle for the gun to cycle. Adding or removing a side saddle is a non-permanent modification. Drilling holes in the receiver to mount a rail or epoxying one to the recieiver is a little more permanent and you may find that it prevents your shotgun from working properly.
The shooter has to lock the shotty in tight. Extra weight removes the "shock" of the recoil impulse to the shooter, encouraging you to ride it out, rather than bracing. Interestingly, you can get an M1 to cycle light loads, if you push into the recoil. IOW- correct, you are absorbing the recoil, but its a practice/training issue,not hardware.
If I'm reading your post correctly, you are saying that I am incorrect in my assumption of what was happening with my shotgun failing to cycle. If that is what you are saying, I must respectfully disagree with you. If you should ever get to SE Kansas, I'd be happy to take you out to the range with this gun and prove it. With the magazine loaded with High Base #6 pheasant loads and one round from the magazine then cycled into the chamber, we can put 6 shells in the sidesaddle and let you start shooting it, replacing the one round you fired with a fresh round into the magazine each time to keep the weight constant. With 6, 5, or 4 rounds in the sidesaddle, the empty will not clear the ejection port and will be caught by the bolt. From 3 shells on down in the sidesaddle, the gun funtions flawlessly. NO other factors are changed and I can assure you that there is no change in my shooting style and no "limp-shouldering" is involved. (btw, Iím 6í6Ē and weigh 375#)
Weight of the firearm most definitely is a factor in the recoil energy. The formula for recoil energy in ft. lbs. is:
(Bw*Mv + 4700*Pw)^2 / (64.348*Gw) where:
Gw= the weight of the gun in pounds
Bw = weight of the ejecta (shot and wad) in pounds
Pw = powder weight in pounds
Mv = muzzle velocity in feet per second
(source Ė Hodgdon Powder Co.)
This is why my 45/70 load of 28 grains of powder behind a 455 gr. bullet in my 8# Marlin 1895 is punishing at 22.05 ft. lbs. of recoil but the same load is not bad at all in my 13.5# Shiloh Sharps at 13.07 ft. lbs. of recoil.
How old is your M1S90, and how did you break it in?
The reason I ask, is because I also have one with the extended tube and I have no problem with light loads. Mine has 8 rounds loaded, with an extra 6 rounds in my buttstock ammo holder, with a mounted M3X. I broke both my Benelliís in with 100 rounds each 1 ľ OX Max Dram loads, it wasnít much fun, but it smoothed the actions.
In theory, our loaded weights should be the same and I run cheapie Wal-Mart 1 1/8 3-DRAM loads for practice. I took a tactical shotgun class a few months ago and shot the same gun weight with low recoil OO buck, and the same Wal-Mart cheapies without an issue. My old SBE will even cycle 1OZ loads now.
It could be that your recoil tube is in need of lubrication and/or cleaning. IF you havenít done it in a while, PM me with an Email address and Iíll send you the Benelli instructions. Also, both my Benelliís like to run with the bolt rails wet.
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I bought the gun used from my local dealer. The previous owner had purchased it about a month before Benelli released the M4 and traded it in as he had a bad shoulder and wanted the new M4 gas gun. At the time, it supposedly had less than one box of shells through it and, given the condition, I'd believe it. I stripped the gun and cleaned it thoroughly, but I lubed it as I would have one of my hunting shotguns. The recoil tube is immaculate, but again, I only lubed it as I would a hunting firearm. If they tend to like the rails wet, then I may be running it a little dry and that may have added to the problem.
It's funny but in reading your post (your shell carrier is on the buttstock) and in my own experience with this gun, it appears that its failure to cycle is directly related to the fact that the extra weight is hanging on the receiver. As you can see from the picture in my earlier post, it didn't originally have the extended mag tube. This was the condition when I experienced the first round of failure to cycles. Shortly after getting the gun, I added the Benelli mag tube extension but even with more weight out front from the extension and added shells, it still fails to cycle with the exact same number of shells in the sidesaddle (4,5,6 -- won't cycle; 0,1,2,3 -- will cycle).
I've got the owner's manual but if you'd like to share any other suggestions, my email is firstname.lastname@example.org . Right now, I'm hoping it quits raining so I can try adding a little more lube to it and heading to the range to see if that helps out.
BTW, my apologies to Rick if I've somewhat hijacked his thread. I only made my original post as a sidesaddle is not a permanent alteration but adding the Picatinny rail to his gun may lean toward a more permanent modification and I just wanted him to be aware of my experience with added weight on the receiver.
I'm not saying its not happening, I'm saying that the M1 has comparatively narrow operating parameters. If you're experiencing FTEs, and maintain proper control, you'll have to look at different loads or a different spring (as you've said your tube is clean). I could never get anything other than "real" 00/000 or slugs to reliably cycle.
I emailed you the directions. Up here in Leavenworth, we donít have any rain yet.
Thereís really no telling! I wouldnít think that the position of the shells in the shell carrier or that slight a change in weight would make that much of a difference, especially with full power loads, light loads maybe. Iíve shot mine in awkward positions, upside-down and one handed, and it still runs.
Is it possible that the carrier is tightened a little too much and pinching the aluminum frame?
If itís that new, then I think that part of the problem is that itís not broken in yet. Get some stout loads, some Excedrin, and put about 100 rounds down range. I lightly lube my recoil tube, but do keep my rails wet with good oil like CLP. Also, put a couple drops in the barrel extension where the lugs lock up. When new, both of my Benelliís required the bolt to be retracted quite a bit and released before the bolt would lock up in the barrel extension, now they both lock up easily.
I agree about the rail, I wouldnít mount one either. The inertia guns are sensitive to weight (should not be as sensitive as yours though), thatís why the M4 was developed.
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Once I put the Surefire and extended shot shell tube on the gun, it would not cycle the lighter bird shot loads, but would cycle full charge OO buck loads and magnum loads.
Once I stipped the goodies off the gun, it would again cycle the lighter charged loads. I'm just sticking to full charge and magnum charge loads with the goodies.
U.S. Army retired