Perhaps you friendly folks here at Combat Carry can help me out!

This is a discussion on Perhaps you friendly folks here at Combat Carry can help me out! within the Defensive Rifles & Shotgun Discussion forums, part of the Related Topics category; The reason why I posted here, is because I find the people here answer questions no matter how dumb they are. Ok, I've decided its ...

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Thread: Perhaps you friendly folks here at Combat Carry can help me out!

  1. #1
    Distinguished Member Array SubNine's Avatar
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    Perhaps you friendly folks here at Combat Carry can help me out!

    The reason why I posted here, is because I find the people here answer questions no matter how dumb they are. Ok, I've decided its time to add a bolt action rifle to my collection. I have my sidearm (XD45), short range gun (Remington 870), mid-range gun (AK47), and now I must add a long range gun (rifle) to my collection. Now, when it comes to rifles, and the different calibers that are available, it really overwhelmes me. Here is my criteria for a bolt action rifle.

    No more than 500 dollars
    Relatively low recoil (I wanna keep my right shoulder in one piece)
    Able to reach a minimum of 600 yards
    Inexpensive ammo
    I haven't really priced rifles, nor the ammunition, but I was thinking either 30-06 or 308, but perhaps someone or some of you can recommend other calibers that have relatively low recoil. I really don't have a need for a rifle other than in case I decide to get into big game hunting, but just something to have I guess LOL! I'll probably wait till the Permanent Fund Dividend check rolls in, so I got plenty of time to research.

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    Distinguished Member Array Dakotaranger's Avatar
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    I paid about $500 for my Savage .30-06. It does have a pretty good recoil, but your going to deal with that in any rifle over a .22.
    "[T]he people are not to be disarmed of their weapons.
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    Distinguished Member Array SubNine's Avatar
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    I can handle recoil from a 12 gauge, but not without waking up the next morning with a sore shoulder!

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    VIP Member Array ccw9mm's Avatar
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    The reason why I posted here, is because I find the people here answer questions no matter how dumb they are.
    Yeah, but I'm trying to break myself of that habit.

    Well, "recoil" is a subjective thing. I don't find the punch of the hottest .44mag rough, in my Marlin 1894 lever rifle. Nor do I find 6mm or 7mm rounds bad. The right .30-06 round seems to beat me up a bit, but then the average .308 doesn't. Go figure.

    I'm looking for a decent 7mm, right now, to handle 300-1000yd plinking. A fair-quality Remington 700, Savage 111 or Sako 75 could be a good base. With some 'smithing on the action, re-barrel to ~28-32" or so, and bedding of the action, it should be plenty accurate for my needs out to 1000yds. I'll need to find a willing reloader, to assist. With the right action, barrel, bedding and scope, plenty of folks are competing out to 1000yds with the Remington 700's.

    From what I've gathered here and on a couple other forums, the Savage rifles seem to be very accurate out of the box, while the Remington 700 seems to be better supported (more gunsmiths, more options for tweaking, more parts choices). Though, I'm sure a good 'smith can handle any of these.

    20rds of retail ammo is least expensive in .308 (~$12), next in .30-06 (~$15) and most in 7mm (~$17). 6mm is a couple dollars more. Of course, if you reload, the prices drop quite a bit, though you need the gear to do it.
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    Distinguished Member Array Doc Holliday's Avatar
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    I would recommend a Remington 700 in .30-06. The basic model can be had for a decent price at the local Wally World and they won't break the bank. Under $400 I think. Then you can take the rest of the money to invest in a decent scope. Decent bargain scopes from Bushnell and Redfield are also at the local Wally World. By the time you walk out you should be at $500.

    The .30-06 is in my opinion the best all around rifle cartridge ever made. It may not be the fastest, the newest, or the most flat shooting round out there but it is accurate well beyond the ranges that you will probably shoot at and has a variety of bullet weights which could take almost any species of game in North America. (Ok, I wouldn't want to hunt a Grizzly Bear with it....but it could drop one with a heavy bullet and good shot placement.)

    If you can handle the recoil of a 12 gauge you can handle the "ought six."

    If you you decide that you most have flat shooting rifle, then I would look at the .270. The .270 is a necked down .30-06. Actually IIRC the .270 case is slightly larger but not to the naked eye. A .27 caliber bullet on an .30-06 case equals a fast, flat shooting round. Bullet weights only go up to around 160 grains or so where as with the .30-06 you can go up to 220 grains.
    Last edited by Doc Holliday; April 6th, 2007 at 02:10 AM.
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    Post Recoil Reduction

    CLICK HERE

    You guys should know that the Mercury filled recoil supressors DO work extremely well.
    The heavy liquid mercury "Fractures" which really helps eat up some recoil energy.
    It's a proven principal and they really do work.
    You'll actually notice the difference.
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    JT
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    I would recommend a Remington model 700 in .308. Winchester model 70 is also a great option. I don't have any experince with Savage, but they have a good reputation.

    30-06 is more popular with hunters, but .308 is the choice of military and law enforcement. There’s not as much 7.62x51mm surplus around as there was, but it still is an advantage to have a caliber that is used by military and law enforcement.

    The .308 is only about 100 fps less than the 30-06 in any given bullet weight, and (opens can of worms) it has been shown to be up to 3 times as accurate as the 30-06. Don’t get me wrong, the 30-06 is no slouch in the accuracy department, and the gains in accuracy for the .308 are minimal closer in, but if you are going to stretch things out, the .308 will give you an advantage.
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    Member Array Bryan's Avatar
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    I bought a savage .308 2 years ago at the "gun show" for $550 with a harris bi-pod and scope rings. Savage hast a unique 2 stage trigger system that some will recommend being replaced later. The older stock is not glass bedded but with some wielding rods and a bedding kit this is a moderately easy fix.

    The new models have a much improved (stiffer and wider) folding stock. Remington 700 and Winchester 70 are great but the base price is over $800 rifles(good if you have the money). Also save some money for the optics that's an extra $150-300+ addition.
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    JT
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bryan View Post
    Remington 700 and Winchester 70 are great but the base price is over $800 rifles(good if you have the money).
    You can get them a lot cheaper than that.
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    Senior Member Array blueyedevil's Avatar
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    If you're trying to put a rifle together for 600+yds, I'd recommend getting a rifle with a MOA gaurantee, the only two that fit your price range are Savage and Tikka. However, I hope you're not including a scope in your final price tag, because at those ranges excellent glass is vital. A $300-400 Nikon is about as cheap as I would recommend on glass for those ranges. Also getting target knobs is a must.

    As for caliber I'd recommend the .300 wsm, .300 win mag ballistics with around .308 recoil. Also spend the extra $ to get top quality bases and rings and have them installed correctly.
    Last edited by blueyedevil; April 6th, 2007 at 12:25 PM.

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    kpw
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    Any of the .308 family will get you to 600 yds easily and with modest recoil. The .243, .260, 7mm-08 and .308 in that order for recoil. Any modern manufacturers can give you want you want for accuracy. Some need some fudging to get them there and doing a bedding job yourself is easy and cheap. Tikka and Savage are usually very accurate out of the box. If your serious about 600 yds, don't skimp on the scope and mounts. Used Leupolds can be had at good prices if you shop around and then you have Burris, Nikon, Sightron and Zeiss Conquests for $200-$400 that will work for 600yds unless your looking at competition shooting.

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    VIP Member Array Rob72's Avatar
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    http://lib.store.yahoo.net/lib/cdnn/CDNN2007-1.pdf
    A bit more than you have budgeted, but you may be able to find one locally- the Styer SBS Prohunter. Lighter and at least as accurate as my Remington 700 PSS, with a better OTB trigger, and butter-smooth bolt travel. It really has lost some of its glitz,for me though. It boringly throws 168 gr BTHPs into little 1.0" off hand groups, at 75-100 yards, everytime I pick it up.

    Savage can do the same, certainly, just a different degree of fit & finish. You can always work up from a base 110FP.

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    VIP Member Array farronwolf's Avatar
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    Either the 30.06 or the .308 would be my suggestion. I prefer the 30.06 personally, since I have a great shooting Husqvarna model, that I picked up about 20 years ago for 200 bucks, but don't count on getting that lucky. I have no complaints about my wife's Savage .270, it is a great shooter too, and the platform is good.

    Here is a link to the ballistics from Remington with three common weight bullets the 150, 165, and 180 gr on both the 30.06 and the .308. This will give you an idea of the shooting characteristics of the two. Other cartridge manufacturers will differ some but not much between to two.

    http://www.remington.com/products/am...308WB*PRC308WC

    What you need to choose is the platform that you will shooting from if this is your choice of calibers. Go to a local gun shop, handle some different brands, shoulder them, and get a good feel of how each model feels. If they don't have the particular caliber you want it really doesn't matter the only difference is the barrel diameter, you can get them to order the caliber you want, if you find one that feels good, and you like the way the action and trigger feel.

    You have time, so don't rush it. If you buy the right gun you will have it a lifetime, and be able to pass it down to your kids.
    Just remember that shot placement is much more important with what you carry than how big a bang you get with each trigger pull.
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    Distinguished Member Array SubNine's Avatar
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    Thanks for the feedback everyone. I'm gonna look into Remington and Savage, as they seem to be within my price range.

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    VIP Member Array Tom G's Avatar
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    A remington 30/06 works good and you can use a wide range of bullet weights. The price is reasonable too.

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