5.56 lethality?

This is a discussion on 5.56 lethality? within the Defensive Rifles & Shotgun Discussion forums, part of the Related Topics category; Not wanting to start a caliber war so lets not go that route. Was skimming through an AR-15 book at Borders yesterday and saw something ...

Page 1 of 3 123 LastLast
Results 1 to 15 of 37

Thread: 5.56 lethality?

  1. #1
    Distinguished Member Array Doc Holliday's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2006
    Location
    Georgia
    Posts
    1,675

    5.56 lethality?

    Not wanting to start a caliber war so lets not go that route.

    Was skimming through an AR-15 book at Borders yesterday and saw something that caught my eye. The author said that most problems with 5.56 "stopping power" comes at close range and and long range. I can understand about the long range bit, the little round has just petered out and doesn't retain alot of energy. But what are the problems with the 5.56 at close range? It seems to me that at close and medium range it is a pretty dang effective round.
    Why Ike, whatever do you mean? Maybe poker's just not your game Ike. I know! Let's have a spelling contest!

  2. Remove Ads

  3. #2
    JD
    JD is offline
    Administrator
    Array JD's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2006
    Location
    Central Iowa
    Posts
    19,212
    Maybe at close range w/ max velocity, the common Military FMJ round will over penetrate, and exit the body without creating much of a wound tract?

    If a vital organ, joint/bone structure, artery or vein isn't hit, the shot won't do much other than have psychological effect of the target being shot.

  4. #3
    Senior Moderator
    Array MattInFla's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2005
    Location
    Central Florida
    Posts
    4,857
    At close range, M193 ball should fragment and create a massive wound tract.

    I'd expect that modern JSP/JHP ammo would also be very effective at close range.

    Perhaps the author of the book in question is using some alternative physics?

    Or, maybe I am just wrong.

    Matt
    Battle Plan (n) - a list of things that aren't going to happen if you are attacked.
    Blame it on Sixto - now that is a viable plan.

  5. #4
    JD
    JD is offline
    Administrator
    Array JD's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2006
    Location
    Central Iowa
    Posts
    19,212
    Quote Originally Posted by MattLarson View Post
    At close range, M193 ball should fragment and create a massive wound tract.

    I'd expect that modern JSP/JHP ammo would also be very effective at close range.

    Perhaps the author of the book in question is using some alternative physics?

    Or, maybe I am just wrong.

    Matt
    It all depends on what ammunition is being used, I was thinking more along the lines of the M855 with the steel penetrator.

  6. #5
    Member Array Blackhawk6's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2005
    Location
    Southeast
    Posts
    370
    Quote Originally Posted by MattLarson View Post
    At close range, M193 ball should fragment and create a massive wound tract.
    As do M855 and Mk262.

    Quote Originally Posted by Doc Holliday View Post
    But what are the problems with the 5.56 at close range?
    There are not any.

    It seems to me that at close and medium range it is a pretty dang effective round.
    It is.

  7. #6
    VIP Member Array Rob72's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2005
    Location
    OK
    Posts
    3,468
    Gun writers spend a great deal of time writing, not always so much shooting, and certainly not meaty targets.

    Borders & Barnes&Noble do have some good books; they also (unfortunately) have what are sold as "authoritative" books, with little to no context for the basis of the authority.

  8. #7
    VIP Member
    Array OPFOR's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2006
    Location
    Nomad
    Posts
    4,711
    The 5.56 round (and any other round) needs time in a dense medium in order to destabilize, yaw, and (hopefully) fragment. At max velocities, it MAY not have enough time in flesh to complete that cycle (keeping in mind that it requires only a teeny, tiny fraction of a second). The thickness of the target will also have an effect - a very thin person may get a relatively clean through and through where a thicker person would get the whole gamut of affects.

    At long ranges, of course, the round may not have enough velocity left to do these things at all...

    All I know is that I don't want to get shot by one at close or long range!
    A man fires a rifle for many years, and he goes to war. And afterward he turns the rifle in at the armory, and he believes he's finished with the rifle. But no matter what else he might do with his hands - love a woman, build a house, change his son's diaper - his hands remember the rifle.

  9. #8
    BAC
    BAC is offline
    VIP Member Array BAC's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2007
    Location
    Tampa, FL
    Posts
    2,292
    Quote Originally Posted by Blackhawk6 View Post
    As do M855 and Mk262.



    There are not any.



    It is.
    Consistent with my learnin's.


    -B

  10. #9
    Senior Moderator
    Array MattInFla's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2005
    Location
    Central Florida
    Posts
    4,857
    Quote Originally Posted by OPFOR View Post
    All I know is that I don't want to get shot by one at close or long range!
    Copy that.

    As Clint Smith says, pistols are pistols and rifles are rifles.....

    Matt
    Battle Plan (n) - a list of things that aren't going to happen if you are attacked.
    Blame it on Sixto - now that is a viable plan.

  11. #10
    VIP Member Array Rob99VMI04's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2006
    Location
    NOVA...200 square miles surrounded by reality
    Posts
    3,180
    How does one measure lethality?

    Are there differn't versions of Dead?

    O wait according to that movie Princess Bride there is.

    Mostly Dead vs. All Dead......your Wesley is only mostly dead.
    “Are you a thermometer or a thermostat, do you reflect or become what is happening in the room or do you change the atmosphere, reset the temperature when you come into the room”?--Chuck Swindoll

    Its not about guns...Its about Freedom!

  12. #11
    Distinguished Member Array morintp's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2007
    Location
    Vermont
    Posts
    1,233
    I watched a Futureweapons episode where they compared 5.56 and 7.62 and a new 6.8 (I think) that is supposed to be better. The 5.56 wouldn't penetrate a car door or knock over a target, the 7.62 was less accurate but could knock over the target and penetrate a car door. The new 6.8 was accurate and passed the penetration and take down test.

  13. #12
    Member Array echo5tango's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2006
    Location
    NOLA
    Posts
    275
    here's some good reading

    and here's a TON of info re: 5.56 duty loads (registration required i think)

    the bottom line is 5.56 is effective if properly placed, and there are NO WONDER ROUNDS that take people down merely by being fired in their general direction.

  14. #13
    Member Array halfcrazy's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2007
    Location
    maine
    Posts
    218
    Quote Originally Posted by morintp View Post
    I watched a Futureweapons episode where they compared 5.56 and 7.62 and a new 6.8 (I think) that is supposed to be better. The 5.56 wouldn't penetrate a car door or knock over a target, the 7.62 was less accurate but could knock over the target and penetrate a car door. The new 6.8 was accurate and passed the penetration and take down test.
    so they are saying a 5.56 wont penetrate a car door at any range? i find that unbelievable but i may have a new experiment on my hands

  15. #14
    Administrator
    Array SIXTO's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2006
    Location
    Ohio
    Posts
    19,672
    Hmmm, I've done it a few times, 5.56 works just fine on car doors.
    "Just blame Sixto"

  16. #15
    Senior Moderator
    Array MattInFla's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2005
    Location
    Central Florida
    Posts
    4,857
    Quote Originally Posted by halfcrazy View Post
    so they are saying a 5.56 wont penetrate a car door at any range? i find that unbelievable but i may have a new experiment on my hands
    The Buick O' Truth puts the end to the claim that the 5.56 won't penetrate a car door:

    The Box O' Truth - The Buick O' Truth #4 - Rifles and Car Doors - Page 1

    Passed through the first door just fine, then dimpled the outside of the far door.

    .308 got through the far door 1 out of 3 rounds, otherwise was very similar to 5.56.

    Car doors aren't cover.

    Matt
    Battle Plan (n) - a list of things that aren't going to happen if you are attacked.
    Blame it on Sixto - now that is a viable plan.

Page 1 of 3 123 LastLast

Links

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  

Similar Threads

  1. Increasing Small Arms Lethality in Afghanistan: Taking Back the Infantry Half-K.meter
    By Janq in forum Law Enforcement, Military & Homeland Security Discussion
    Replies: 13
    Last Post: February 21st, 2010, 02:49 PM
  2. 'Lethality of the 22 LR standard velocity round'
    By Janq in forum General Firearm Discussion
    Replies: 40
    Last Post: April 10th, 2009, 04:21 PM
  3. Lethality of 22 Rimfire CCI Sabot Birdshot
    By Rock and Glock in forum Off Topic & Humor Discussion
    Replies: 7
    Last Post: June 15th, 2006, 01:10 PM

Search tags for this page

5.56 lethality

,
5.56 lethality in afghanistan
,
5.56 lethality range
,
5.56 one shot stop
,
5.56 stopping power
,

ar 15 lethality

,
ar-15 lethality
,
ar15 lethality
,

lethality of 5.56

,
lethality of m193
,

m193 lethality

,
m193 stopping power
Click on a term to search for related topics.