Concerns with using a rifle for home defense - Page 2

Concerns with using a rifle for home defense

This is a discussion on Concerns with using a rifle for home defense within the Defensive Rifles & Shotgun Discussion forums, part of the Related Topics category; My other concern is my wife...she is petite and she shot a 12g and it almost took her off her feet. i want her to ...

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Thread: Concerns with using a rifle for home defense

  1. #16
    Senior Member Array 762's Avatar
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    My other concern is my wife...she is petite and she shot a 12g and it almost took her off her feet. i want her to be confident/comfortable with the weapon she will have to use if i am not around.

    She has handled the AK well and has her own XD.


  2. #17
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    A PCC is perfect then IMO. They are easy to shoot and have plenty of power for the job at hand.
    "Just blame Sixto"

  3. #18
    Distinguished Member Array sniper58's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by msgt/ret View Post
    Considering the possibility of over penetration from a rifle I prefer a 12ga shotgun loaded with #4 buck for a back-up to my 1911.
    +1 - yeah, what he said! Rifle's a bit strong and I don't have a PCC.
    Tim
    BE PREPARED - Noah didn't build the Ark when it was raining!
    Si vis pacem, para bellum
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  4. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by sniper58 View Post
    I don't have a PCC.
    You're in luck, I've figured out how to solve that problem.
    "Just blame Sixto"

  5. #20
    Senior Member Array Chuck R.'s Avatar
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    Here's some decent info on 5.56/.223.

    "Penetration tests conducted by department range staff and several other highly respected experts have resulted in the following conclusions (see accompanying chart for numbers):

    "The first thing you notice is the startling over-penetration of the typical jacketed hollowpoint pistol bullet once its nose is packed with an inert substance. The second thing you notice is that the over-penetration effect of .223 rifle ammo may have been highly over-rated.

    Selecting Home Defense Ammunition | American Handgunner | Find Articles at BNET

    Here's another:
    Results

    Caliber testing medium Penetration Condition of bullet
    .223 Rem. gelatin only 9.5" two pieces
    .223 Rem. wall & gelatin 5.5" * fragmented
    .40S&W gelatin only 13.5" mushroomed
    .40S&W wall & gelatin 22" * no deformation
    .40S&W wall & gelatin 22" * no deformation
    .40S&W wall & gelatin 19.5" * slight deformation
    12 ga. wall & gelatin 27.5" mushroomed
    * these measurements do not include penetration of the 6" wall.
    CCI Gold Dot.

    Summary
    The 55 grain HP .223 has less penetration than any of the other ammunition tested. Based on the results of this testing, there appears to be no basis for concern regarding the over penetration of the .223 [HP] round. In fact, it seems even safer in this regard than .40 S&W handgun ammunition.

    The hollow point cavity in the .40S&W round filled with material when shot through the wall. This caused [these bullets] to fail to expand when they entered the gelatin. As a result, they penetrated 8.5" farther than when shot directly into the gelatin.

    When the .223 [HP] was shot through he wall it began to fragment and as a result penetrated the gelatin only 5.5".

    Because the .223 [HP] begins to break up on impact, it has less potential for damage or injury than the 12 ga. in the event of a ricochet. The .223 [HP] is obviously safer in an urban environment than the 12 ga. with slugs or buckshot.

    Olympic Arms, Inc. - Real World .223 testing d=26

    Chuck
    homo homini lupus est

  6. #21
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    Good post Chuck, Thats what I was talking about when I said it was basic physics.
    "Just blame Sixto"

  7. #22
    VIP Member Array crzy4guns's Avatar
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    This has got me thinking about getting a Ruger mini 14 carbine for home defense.

    That new NRA model with the 16" barrel may just do the trick.
    God bless our troops!

  8. #23
    VIP Member Array Cuda66's Avatar
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    This is, imho, another area where the .223 shines over the 7.62x39.

    For in-home defense, one can load 40grn varmint-type rounds--Hornady V-Max (aka TAP), Ballistic Silvertips, Nosler BT's, etc...utterly devastating at home-defense ranges, and little overpenetration concerns. And, any gun store (or even wally-world that still stocks ammo) will have them in stock.

    Never seen high-performance 7.62x39 rounds. They may exist, but I've yet to see them on a gun shop shelf, or even at gun shows.
    There are no dangerous weapons; there are only dangerous men.--RAH

    ...man fights with his mind; the weapons are incidental.--Jeff Cooper


    There is a reason they try and make small bullets act like big bullets--Glockmann10mm

  9. #24
    VIP Member Array aus71383's Avatar
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    My go to gun for HD is my AR15. It has a red dot sight that is on 24/7, and a light that is always attached. Loaded with 75 grain TAP ammo it has great terminal ballistics, and will penetrate fewer walls than my .40 S&W or my .45 ACP with HSTs would. I would much rather have "too much gun" than "not enough gun" if I ever end up using it. Just my two cents..

    Austin

  10. #25
    Senior Member Array 762's Avatar
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    Would 7.62x39 hollow points proove to work better in a HD situation?
    Let's Roll - Todd Beamer

    MOΛΩN ΛABÉ

  11. #26
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    Not sure about terminal ballistics with the 7.62x39 - I'm sure there is info out there though. I know for a fact that 7.62x39 will have better performance than any pistol caliber, but whether hollowpoints are better than ball I couldn't tell you. Sometimes ball is better than hollowpoints - like in the light weight 5.56x45mm loads - because some ball ammo will yaw and fragment and provide adequate penetration, while some hollowpoints will fragment instantly on impact and not penetrate very far at all (like less than 6 inches in some cases for varmint ammo). I would do some searches for AK type forums and read up on their ammo section for a start.

    Austin

  12. #27
    VIP Member Array Cuda66's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by 762 View Post
    Would 7.62x39 hollow points proove to work better in a HD situation?
    Most of the 7.62x39 HP rounds I've seen (Wolf, for example)...really aren't; they're more like a OTM (Open Tip Match), which don't expand well, if it all...they tend to collapse in on themselves.

    I have a friend who used them with a SKS for deer hunting; according to him the exit wound was pretty much the same size as the entrance.
    There are no dangerous weapons; there are only dangerous men.--RAH

    ...man fights with his mind; the weapons are incidental.--Jeff Cooper


    There is a reason they try and make small bullets act like big bullets--Glockmann10mm

  13. #28
    VIP Member Array aus71383's Avatar
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    Its likely you'll end up with something that has a relatively thin wall with a deep cannelure - that'll help the round break up easier. I don't know what the velocity is like with the AKs though - I know with 5.56 around 2200 fps fragmentation isn't likely with the loads I'm using - generally each particular ammo will have its own velocity that it will fragment at. But don't think that if someone says that (for instance) "55 grain Wolf doesn't fragment" that all 55 grain ammo won't fragment - it likely will. Each load will have different bullet construction....

    Austin

  14. #29
    Senior Member Array 762's Avatar
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    Depending on the grain, a 7.62x39 is between 2,700-2,900 FPS.
    Let's Roll - Todd Beamer

    MOΛΩN ΛABÉ

  15. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by BAC View Post
    That he would. Anyway, there's a reason 5.56 caliber rifles are becoming more commonly used as indoors weapons. They are much, much less likely (using proper ammo) to over-penetrate than pistol and shotgun ammo.


    -B
    Yup....get a decent frangible round and a 5.56 will not penetrate two sheets of drywall.

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