assault rifle vs battle rifle

This is a discussion on assault rifle vs battle rifle within the Defensive Rifles & Shotgun Discussion forums, part of the Related Topics category; Originally Posted by Thanis I see. Caliber is more to do with the round size and is more of hand gun term? Cartridge more often ...

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Thread: assault rifle vs battle rifle

  1. #16
    Ex Member Array United93's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Thanis View Post
    I see. Caliber is more to do with the round size and is more of hand gun term? Cartridge more often used in rifle conversations?
    Caliber is simply the diameter of the round (a .22 is 0.22 inches across the bullet).

    Cartridge is the actual loaded round, regardless of caliber. It is the cartridge that defines how powerful the load is.

    There could exist a .50 caliber cartridge that only reaches 120fps.

    Likewise, there could exist a .50 caliber cartrdge that reaches 4000fps.

    The cartidge is what makes that difference in speed, even thought the caliber is the same.

    I hope that helps (I probably made it sound confusing).

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  3. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by atctimmy View Post
    The definition of assault rifle is an intermediate range rifle capable of full and semi auto fire. The idea was invented by the Germans at the end of WW2 as a cross between a battle rifle and a submachinegun.
    Not true the first select fire assault rifle was invented by a russian in 1917 it was select fire and used the 6.5x50SR Arisaka and was called Fedorov "Avtomat" very few were made but they were sold to the USSR. Long before the Germans even thought of it...

    Long story short the "Idea" was originated from the russians almost 30 years prior...

  4. #18
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    Exclamation Assault vs Battle rifle

    The term assault rifle is a translation of the German word Sturmgewehr (literally meaning "storm rifle"), "storm" used synonymous with assault. The name was coined by Adolf Hitler to describe the Maschinenpistole 44, subsequently re-christened Sturmgewehr 44, the firearm generally considered the first true assault rifle that served to popularize the concept.

    The translation assault rifle gradually became the common term for similar firearms sharing the same technical definition as the StG 44. In a strict definition, a firearm must have at least the following characteristics to be considered an assault rifle:

    It must be an individual weapon with provision to fire from the shoulder (i.e. a buttstock);
    It must be capable of selective fire;
    It must have an intermediate-power cartridge: more power than a pistol but less than a standard rifle or battle rifle;
    Its ammunition must be supplied from a detachable box magazine.
    Rifles that meet most of these criteria, but not all, are technically not assault rifles despite frequently being considered as such. For example, semi-automatic-only rifles that share designs with assault rifles such as the AR-15 (which the M-16 rifle is based on) are not assault rifles, as they are not capable of switching to automatic fire and thus not selective fire. Belt-fed weapons (such as the M249 SAW) or rifles with fixed magazines are likewise not assault rifles because they do not have detachable box magazines.

    The term "assault rifle" is often more loosely used for commercial or political reasons to include other types of arms, particularly arms that fall under a strict definition of the battle rifle, or semi-automatic variant of military rifles such as AR-15s

    The US Army defines assault rifles as "short, compact, selective-fire weapons that fire a cartridge intermediate in power between submachinegun and rifle cartridges."

    A Battle Rifle is a full-size rifle designed for military use that fires a high-power rifle cartridge such as the U.S. .30-06 Springfield, the German 7.92x57mm IS, the Russian 7.62x54mmR, or the 7.62x51mm NATO cartridge. While the term battle rifle is usually given to post-World War II selective-fire infantry service rifles such as the H&K G3, the FN FAL, the AR-10, or the M14, this term can also include older military bolt-action or semi-automatic rifles such as the Mosin Nagant or the M1 Garand.

    The Battle Rifle's power and long-range accuracy are intended to engage targets at long distances, but this comes with a trade-off of length and weight that make it relatively cumbersome in close-quarter combat. Also, the recoil of a full-size cartridge makes most battle rifles difficult to control when using full-automatic fire, though a few designs have attempted to control this tendency.

    The Fedorov Avtomat was an early self-loading battle rifle designed by Vladimir Grigoryevich Fedorov and made in Russia. A total of 3,200 Fedorov rifles were manufactured between 1915 and 1924 in the city of Kovrov. In 1919, after 500 had been built, production was increased. The weapon saw combat in World War I, the Russian Civil War, and later in the Winter War with Finland in 1940, when some were withdrawn from storage and issued to elite units of the Red Army. The Fedorov Avtomat is sometimes considered to be an early predecessor to the modern assault rifle, due to its relatively light weight compared to other automatic rifles of the time and selective-fire capabilities.

    By early 1918, as a result of turmoil of the Russian Revolution and the subsequent civil war, production was finally stopped.


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  5. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by buckeyeLCPL View Post
    Yes, that would make complete sense to me. In my mind some assault rifles are: M-16 and variants, G36, AK-74, LA85, FAMAS, ect... And battles rifles would be the FAL, G3, M-14, ect... But maybe that is just in my head.

    In my mind its not just caliber though, the weapon has to be able to accurately engage human sized targets at 500 yards, which is why the AK-47 and SKS, while having a round that is above .30 cal in diameter, don't fall into the battle rifle class.
    Heck, MOST people could not hit a human sized target with an AK or SKS past two hundred yards at all. In my experience, these guns drop off significantly after 100 yards.
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  6. #20
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    The original POLICE "RIOT" configuration shotguns were shortened barrel with a "spreader choke" at the muzzle that made the shot pattern spread out horizontally. Just FYI.

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    Quote Originally Posted by C hawk Glock View Post
    Heck, MOST people could not hit a human sized target with an AK or SKS past two hundred yards at all. In my experience, these guns drop off significantly after 100 yards.
    My experience tends to be much different.. I own a wasr 10 (yes a wasr... I dont get what all the fuss is about on them...) and I can hit targets well beyond 175 yards away that are 4 by 2 1/2 feet.. Nearly every ones a hit...

  8. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by SuRpLuS View Post
    My experience tends to be much different.. I own a wasr 10 (yes a wasr... I dont get what all the fuss is about on them...) and I can hit targets well beyond 175 yards away that are 4 by 2 1/2 feet.. Nearly every ones a hit...
    Sure you could hit a target every time at that distance. You just need to be aware and aim two feet high.

    You must be a better shot then the AK expert in this video, he even is shooting indoors on a bench rest. At two hundred yards, he only hits the paper one time. He only hits the lower left corner of the paper, it would not of hit a human target at all.

    By the way, this by no means is an AK .vs AR post. I have my own opinion on both rifles their inherent advantages.

    AK 47 vs M16 | SplodeTV.com
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  9. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by C hawk Glock View Post
    Sure you could hit a target every time at that distance. You just need to be aware and aim two feet high.

    You must be a better shot then the AK expert in this video, he even is shooting indoors on a bench rest. At two hundred yards, he only hits the paper one time. He only hits the lower left corner of the paper, it would not of hit a human target at all.

    By the way, this by no means is an AK .vs AR post. I have my own opinion on both rifles their inherent advantages.

    AK 47 vs M16 | SplodeTV.com
    Welp you've gotta realize that a TV show on american networks can tend to be byass... (the american weapons are usually shown as higher quality weapons for the better trained soldier [ahh propeganda]) The truth is that I can hit a human sized target up to 200 yards fairly consistantly, although beyond that point becomes fairly difficult... The sight on it's own helps adjust for the drop... Plus the guy wasn't an expert he was the host...

  10. #24
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    It's not the arrow (that successfully hit the target), it's the Indian!
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  11. #25
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    I consider my AR-10 (308) a battle rifle compared to my friends M-16/M-4 semiautomatic assault rifles. Theirs are better for close range work, even for home protection, while mine is more for long range work and shooting through significant cover (like brick walls). Two different arms for two different needs. Would I like to be shot at by either at 200 yards? Nope. At 600 yards or more I'd be much more worried about someone with an AR-10, Socom, FAL, or any other battle rifle over any M16, M4 or AKS semiautomatic. Still wouldn't press my luck though. All three rounds are good and can get the job done. All in what floats your boat and what your intended need is IMHO. Probably could use at least one of each in my household, if the wife would go for it.
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  12. #26
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    Probably could use at least one of each in my household, if the wife would go for it.
    And that is the kicker isn't it? I would do the same if I had the money and the wife wouldn't freak seeing those evil black rifles in the house.

  13. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by SuRpLuS View Post
    Welp you've gotta realize that a TV show on american networks can tend to be byass... (the american weapons are usually shown as higher quality weapons for the better trained soldier [ahh propeganda]) The truth is that I can hit a human sized target up to 200 yards fairly consistantly, although beyond that point becomes fairly difficult... The sight on it's own helps adjust for the drop... Plus the guy wasn't an expert he was the host...
    SuRpLus it's a fact, you must not have watched the video. The video sure showed the penetration power of the AK over the AR. What was bias about that? I am not here to convince you, one way or the other, and if you think the video is wrong then so be it. If you honestly think an AK is just as accurate then you are misinformed.
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  14. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by C hawk Glock View Post
    SuRpLus it's a fact, you must not have watched the video. The video sure showed the penetration power of the AK over the AR. What was bias about that? I am not here to convince you, one way or the other, and if you think the video is wrong then so be it. If you honestly think an AK is just as accurate then you are misinformed.
    I never said an ak-47 is just as accurate I just know I can hit that target a hell of alot better than that guy [I've shot a 4 by 3 target consistantly at 190 yards] ...(with an ar-15 I could hit a target at a further range around 250-300..)

    What I said was that it can be byass in the way that they want to say "the better trained soldier is better equipped with this" the propeganda is that they want to show a more proffesional feel to the m-16 while keeping us thinking the ak-47 is more for a militia sort of people...

    Thanx for disregarding everything though... Way to pay attention sport...

  15. #29
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    Well, there are "AKs" that are the best of all worlds with regard to extreme functional reliability, accuracy, & range.
    These days it takes a pretty heavy cash outlay to own one though.


    7.62mm X 51mm (.308)

  16. #30
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    Nice mods on that rifle QK.
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