Levergun question: I searched - Page 2

Levergun question: I searched

This is a discussion on Levergun question: I searched within the Defensive Rifles & Shotgun Discussion forums, part of the Related Topics category; Originally Posted by Janq I've got two boxes of 300 gr. and gone through two more in testing as chambered in .45-70 out of a ...

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  1. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by Janq View Post
    I've got two boxes of 300 gr. and gone through two more in testing as chambered in .45-70 out of a Marlin 1895.
    That stuff is potent as Hornady manufactures it. But it won't fire as accurate as I prefer out of the 16" barrel ported 'Guide Gun' I've had on loan to me.
    Marlin changed the rifling on their big-bores from the "Micro-Groove" to the more conventional Ballard style, around the time they started chambering the .45-70 a buncha years ago... if the loaner Guide Gun has more then 6 grooves in the barrel, that might be related.

    And pray tell... whatcha hunting for with that big boomer? A friend back in CT started using his .45-70 on deer, and (according to him) he never had to trail a wounded deer. Minimal meat damage, too.
    Smitty
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  2. #17
    VIP Member Array Janq's Avatar
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    Good point about the rifling Smitty!

    I believe it's an early production run model circa 80s...But I will check the rifling tonight.
    Funny thing is it shoots everything else I could locate with good enough to hunt (to my own standards) accuracy. POA = POI out to 50 yds. with approx. 2" drop on average at 100 yds while shooting off hand. I never test off a bench or bags because I never shoot off of a bench or bags. I test how I will shoot & use the gun real world.
    Meanwhile the Hornady were consistently shooting right by 3" and low by an inch in same wind as all the other various ammo weights and makes I've tested. I could compensate for it but for as much as that ammo costs at retail I figure there is no point when other fly better (from this gun) and hit nearly as hard.

    I'd settled on 405 gr. Remington (R4570G).

    Source - 450 Bushmaster

    The rifle was loaned to me last fall season toward black bear hunting in MA by my hunting mentor.
    After a talk about power levels (energy on target) and accuracy as well as regional terrain conditions he'd suggested I run with .45/70 Govt....Which prior I'd never heard of as my background and knowledge is largely toward modern combat & military purpose cartridges. I ran a bunch of research and numbers on the cartridge as it compares to other large bore and high energy options....And was intrigued. So I said okay where do I get this?
    He then offered to loan me his own personal rifle which he uses as a general purpose gun when in dangerous game areas (he's a professional wildlife biologist with the USFWS and travels globally) and said this would stop a black bear easy one shot stop style IF I do my part and maintain accuracy.
    The rest was 2 weeks of testing every type of commercial ammo I could get my hands on and time spent at home dry fire training to get the unique lever action method down pat and smooth.

    I fell in love with that gun and upon shooting it the cartridge as well.
    This thing is a beast!

    Far more punch than a slug shotgun and more fun than a pump to run while being MA (bear only...not deer) and most every other state lawful to take game of most any sort.
    Also IMHO this would make for an excellent camp/field/cabin security gun, better than a shotgun.

    Within 125 yds. (200 with Hornday and a barrel that will shoot them) this thing is God's finger for any being that bleeds.
    For really big or tough game such as Grizzly or thick hide African game I'd make a call to Garrett for some of their hard cast boolits and call it a day.

    YouTube - 45-70 Marlin vs. Tree
    YouTube - Marlin 45-70 Guide Gun First Day

    Stupid fun. : )

    - Janq
    "Killers who are not deterred by laws against murder are not going to be deterred by laws against guns. " - Robert A. Levy

    "A license to carry a concealed weapon does not make you a free-lance policeman." - Florida Div. of Licensing

  3. #18
    OD*
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    I believe it's an early production run model circa 80s...
    Your not talking about the Guide Gun, but a Marlin 1895?
    "The pistol, learn it well, carry it always ..." ~ Jeff Cooper

    "Terrorists: They hated you yesterday, they hate you today, and they will hate you tomorrow. End the cycle of hatred, donít give them a tomorrow."

  4. #19
    VIP Member Array Janq's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by OD* View Post
    Your not talking about the Guide Gun, but a Marlin 1895?
    Nope, it's a 'Guide Gun'
    Specifically Marlin model 1895G 'Guide Gun', Marlin's own term and IIRC it's stamped into the barrel as well.

    Marlin Model 1895G "Guide Gun"

    Factory ported with 'Widescan' hooded front sight and a folding semi-buckhorn rear sight.
    Blued finish and walnut straight stock.
    I personally prefer a pistolgrip type stock as is OEM on the SBL model.

    - Janq
    "Killers who are not deterred by laws against murder are not going to be deterred by laws against guns. " - Robert A. Levy

    "A license to carry a concealed weapon does not make you a free-lance policeman." - Florida Div. of Licensing

  5. #20
    OD*
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    OK, it can't be from the 1980s then, the 1895G intro'd in 1998 and the 1895GS a few years later (2001). The .450 Marlin (basically a rimmed 45/70) chambered Guide Gun in 2000.
    "The pistol, learn it well, carry it always ..." ~ Jeff Cooper

    "Terrorists: They hated you yesterday, they hate you today, and they will hate you tomorrow. End the cycle of hatred, donít give them a tomorrow."

  6. #21
    Member Array carry ok's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by cvhoss View Post
    Whether it appears pointed or not, what you will notice about any factory ammo for a lever gun is that it has an exposed lead tip. This soft lead cushions the blow to the primer of the cartridge in front of the bullet.

    I doubt you'll be able to buy any factory ammo for your rifle that wouldn't be safe as the vast majority of 35 Remington rifles were lever guns. Should you decide to handload for your rifle, DO NOT use any pointed, hard-tipped bullets. If you do, you're only asking for trouble. If you want fully jacketed hollowpoint bullet performance, buy a different rifle.

    If you want the LEVERevolution ammo, you might want to look at Cheaper-Than-Dirt (as much as I hate to recommend them). At $21.38 a box, that's as cheap as I see it anywhere.

    Hoss
    I ordered some just a few minutes ago, fromATG. 22.95, so not too bad. But, cheaper than the 200grn. Remingtons.
    Extremism in the Defense of Liberty is No Vice--Moderation in the Pursuit of Justice is No Virtue. - Senator Barry Goldwater

  7. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by Janq View Post
    Nope, it's a 'Guide Gun'
    Specifically Marlin model 1895G 'Guide Gun', Marlin's own term and IIRC it's stamped into the barrel as well.

    Marlin Model 1895G "Guide Gun"

    Factory ported with 'Widescan' hooded front sight and a folding semi-buckhorn rear sight.
    Blued finish and walnut straight stock.
    I personally prefer a pistolgrip type stock as is OEM on the SBL model.

    - Janq
    Just yesterday, before I got the 336c, I was a Dick's. They had 2 Guide Guns. A stainless, for $649, and blue for $549, IIRC.
    Extremism in the Defense of Liberty is No Vice--Moderation in the Pursuit of Justice is No Virtue. - Senator Barry Goldwater

  8. #23
    VIP Member Array Janq's Avatar
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    Got ya OD.

    Again the gun is not mine so I can't say exactly when he purchased it, but he had told me he had bought it when they first came out as quote in the 80s.
    He's much older than me though and possibly it's just a case of decade memory slip. It happens. :p

    - Janq
    "Killers who are not deterred by laws against murder are not going to be deterred by laws against guns. " - Robert A. Levy

    "A license to carry a concealed weapon does not make you a free-lance policeman." - Florida Div. of Licensing

  9. #24
    VIP Member Array Janq's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by carry ok View Post
    Just yesterday, before I got the 336c, I was a Dick's. They had 2 Guide Guns. A stainless, for $649, and blue for $549, IIRC.
    Know that there are two different models of stainless 1895 45/70 and the only one referred to as 'Guide Gun' by Marlin is the blued model.

    Stainless models
    1895GS - Marlin Model 1895GS
    1895SBL - Marlin Model 1895M in 450 Marlin <A brand new model as of last early summer with distinctive grey laminate wood and a scout rail mounted OEM at the receiver extending over the barrel>

    The regular 1895 is a 21" rifle where as the 1895G 'Guide Gun' is an 18" carbine.

    - Janq
    "Killers who are not deterred by laws against murder are not going to be deterred by laws against guns. " - Robert A. Levy

    "A license to carry a concealed weapon does not make you a free-lance policeman." - Florida Div. of Licensing

  10. #25
    OD*
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    Quote Originally Posted by Janq View Post
    possibly it's just a case of decade memory slip. It happens. :p

    - Janq
    I can vouch for that first hand.

    I had an 1895GS (non-ported) and sold it in favor of my 1886 "Brownchester", but Marlin has a new model 1895 out that kinda intrigues me, the 1895STBL.



    Know that there are two different models of stainless 1895 45/70 and the only one referred to as 'Guide Gun' by Marlin is the blued model.
    But the "G" does represent "Guide" and the "S" stainless, they are both considered guide guns.
    "The pistol, learn it well, carry it always ..." ~ Jeff Cooper

    "Terrorists: They hated you yesterday, they hate you today, and they will hate you tomorrow. End the cycle of hatred, donít give them a tomorrow."

  11. #26
    Senior Member Array Jackle1886's Avatar
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    The .35 with the leverevolution bullets will shoot about a 4" grouping at 100yards. But from there to 200 yards it will drop off significantly; I know this as there is a gorgeous 180class 10pt that still walks the forests. Enjoy your gun, it's a great one!
    Better to die on your feet, than to live on your knees.

  12. #27
    VIP Member Array Janq's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by OD* View Post
    But the "G" does represent "Guide" and the "S" stainless, they are both considered guide guns.
    That maybe but as by the Marlin website info they drop they apply the Guide Gun nomenclature to just the one model; 1895G.
    I'm only going by Marlins documentation on paper (catalog) and at their website.

    They list no 1895 STBL as current.
    I'd not heard of it until your post. It looks to be an 1895 SBL with 1895G sights.

    GalleryofGuns.com - Gun Genie

    - Janq
    "Killers who are not deterred by laws against murder are not going to be deterred by laws against guns. " - Robert A. Levy

    "A license to carry a concealed weapon does not make you a free-lance policeman." - Florida Div. of Licensing

  13. #28
    VIP Member Array cvhoss's Avatar
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    Janq -- Unless you have a modified gun, OD is right on the production dates. If it is a Guide Gun, it would have the Ballard rifling. According to the Blue Book of Gun Values, no Guide Guns were manufactured with Micro-Groove rifling. Also, it should have a 18 1/2" barrel.

    I have a 1895 SS (back then the SS on that model didn't mean stainless steel) that is one of my deer rifles and a 1895 Cowboy that I use for long range (to 500 yards) CAS matches.

    The 45/70 is a formidable cartridge when loaded for modern rifles. A lot of the factory ammo is loaded to be safe in the old Trapdoors and as such leaves a lot to be desired. My deer hunting handloads are with a 300 gr. Sierra HP at a shade over 2100 fps. That makes right at 3000 ft. lbs. of energy at the muzzle. Compare that to the numbers in your chart for the Remington factory ammo and you'll see how much difference there is.

    If you don't want to hand load for it, some of the better factory loads are the Cor-Bon Hunting Ammunition line. Be forewarned though that these types of loads will kick like a mule in the short barreled Guide Gun though the porting may help some. They're bad enough in my 26" barreled Cowboy.

    Hoss
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  14. #29
    VIP Member Array Janq's Avatar
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    Thank Hoss...We already got it figured out though. :p

    Geez I gotta stop looking at this thread.
    It's 40 degrees outside and my trigger finger is really itchy now for some boomstick action and visit with the .45-70 to my local outdoor range.

    This gun is soo much fun to shoot.

    - Janq
    "Killers who are not deterred by laws against murder are not going to be deterred by laws against guns. " - Robert A. Levy

    "A license to carry a concealed weapon does not make you a free-lance policeman." - Florida Div. of Licensing

  15. #30
    VIP Member Array cvhoss's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Janq View Post
    Thank Hoss...We already got it figured out though. :p

    Geez I gotta stop looking at this thread.
    It's 40 degrees outside and my trigger finger is really itchy now for some boomstick action and visit with the .45-70 to my local outdoor range.

    This gun is soo much fun to shoot.

    - Janq
    Man, you guys type too fast. In the time I spent researching the gun in my Blue Book, you and OD swapped a half a dozen posts.

    Quote Originally Posted by Janq View Post
    ............This gun is soo much fun to shoot.

    - Janq
    And if you think that ones fun to shoot, come to Kansas for a visit and I'll let you shoot this one with my black powder handloads.
    Hoss
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