+P ammo and gun wear question??

+P ammo and gun wear question??

This is a discussion on +P ammo and gun wear question?? within the General Firearm Discussion forums, part of the Related Topics category; What part of the gun wears (if any) when shooting +P ammo? To make it a bit more clear I ask because I often hear ...

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    Member Array defensive007's Avatar
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    +P ammo and gun wear question??

    What part of the gun wears (if any) when shooting +P ammo? To make it a bit more clear I ask because I often hear people say you shouldn't shoot +P ammo all the time because it has more than standard pressure and gun parts are not to handle the constant plus pressure?
    I have yet to be attacked by a block of ballistic gelatin but.........


  2. #2
    RKM
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    Recoil spring. I wouldn't make a habit out of shooting +P ammo at the range just for fun. Checking it for function, accuracy, and carrying is one thing.

    I suppose in some guns you can damage the chamber as some guns aren't desgined for +P.

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    Member Array defensive007's Avatar
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    If I'm going to test defensive ammo I want to run at least 15 rounds in my gun to ensure proper reliability
    I have yet to be attacked by a block of ballistic gelatin but.........

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    Distinguished Member Array RevolvingMag's Avatar
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    I don't have much experience with it, but, that seems to me like saying 'don't shoot magnum rounds through your .357magnum, it will wear it out because it can't handle the pressure'....

    I'm not an expert but if your weapon is designed for +P or Magnum, why shouldn't you use it. Maybe a difference with semi-autos because of the extra moving parts, mostly recoil springs like RKM says, but, if it's designed for it, then rock and roll. Or lock and load. Whichever you prefer.


    ...maybe both? 'Rock and load'?

    'Roll and lock'?
    "Rock and load, lock and roll... what's it matter? FIRE!!"

    "Gun control means hitting your target every time."

    Please take everything I say with at least one grain of salt- I am a very sarcastic person with a very dry sense of humor.

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    Member Array defensive007's Avatar
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    In my case I have the p238 and it doesn't specify that +P ammo is ok to shoot. I called Sig they stated until SAAMI approves plus pressure ammo they don't recommend using it (although people say they have used it and no harm done) but if something happens to the gun because of the plus pressure rounds the warranty will void. My recoil spring is a flat thin style and not like your regular recoil spring but I doubt 15 rounds will do any harm. Again, Sig states all their pistols are rated for plus P ammo but the 238 has not yet been Rated by SAAMI so it at your own risk.
    I have yet to be attacked by a block of ballistic gelatin but.........

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    VIP Member Array Superhouse 15's Avatar
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    I can see not warranting +P when they have no idea what specs somebody might load it to. Uncle Bob's Bait, Tackle, and Reloads might maybe load different than Double Tap or Cor Bon.

    I have seen frame cracks in alloy semi autos. I saw a couple mid sized .357s fail with split forcing cones after magnum loads were fired extensively. One after a class of about 200 rounds in a new gun. I saw a new snub that broke on the 3rd shot of +p was fired in it. (158gr LSWCHP). That made me nervous.

    I work at an indoor range and I see a lot of high mileage guns. Our rentals get fired a lot more than most carry guns ever will. Every week is an extensive CCW training classes worth of ammo for each rental. Even with plain old range ball everything breaks eventually. The odds are with you firing +P to test only, but failires have happened. There are plenty of proven non +P loads if you don't want to worry about it.
    Try not to screw up so bad they name the screw up after you. (Station 15 saying)

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    VIP Member Array MitchellCT's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by defensive007 View Post
    If I'm going to test defensive ammo I want to run at least 15 rounds in my gun to ensure proper reliability
    15 rounds does nothing more than insure the weapon is not made of tin foil and was assembled with no more than 3 missing parts.

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    VIP Member Array MitchellCT's Avatar
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    Buy a quality weapon and it will eat +p & +p+ without problems.

    Glock, H&K, SIG, Colt and S&W will not have issues.

    When Federal BPLE was cheap, I used to go through that stuff really fast. No issues with Glocks.

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    Quote Originally Posted by defensive007 View Post
    In my case I have the p238 and it doesn't specify that +P ammo is ok to shoot. I called Sig they stated until SAAMI approves plus pressure ammo they don't recommend using it (although people say they have used it and no harm done) but if something happens to the gun because of the plus pressure rounds the warranty will void. My recoil spring is a flat thin style and not like your regular recoil spring but I doubt 15 rounds will do any harm. Again, Sig states all their pistols are rated for plus P ammo but the 238 has not yet been Rated by SAAMI so it at your own risk.
    OK, in the first place, there is NO (zero, zip, nada) 'industry standard' for .380 +P ammo. Buffalo Bore to my knowledge is the only manufacturer offering a "+P" loading in .380, but SAAMI doesn't list a spec for that load. In general, the SAAMI specs for +P are 10% over the standard-pressure rounds, and my guess is that BB has not exceeded that general limit (but don't take my guess as a green light).

    As most gun manufacturers, Sig takes a risk-averse position re the use of non-SAAMI ammo, which also includes handloads. That's not surprising in the least.

    Back to your original question, what parts of the gun are subject to accelerated wear if you use hotter ammo? As another posted suggested, the recoil spring for sure. In addition to that, the recoil spring plug (guide), the slide stop and the holes in the frame that register the slide stop pin, the lower barrel lug that engages the slide stop, and anything on the slide that resembles a disconnector will be subject to increased wear with hotter ammo.

    This doesn't mean you can't or shouldn't use hotter ammo in your 238, it simply means be smart about it. Run 100 or more of your chosen carry rounds through the gun to assure reliability, but then limit the use of hot rounds to occasional use only. Guns like snubbies and the 238 are not recreational shooters, they are last-ditch personal protection tools. Practice with standard-pressure ammo to learn how to run the gun and keep current with its trigger, and then confirm point of impact with your carry ammo. At the very worst a warranty claim might be denied due to using non-SAAMI ammo, but that's a small price compared to the cost of your life.
    Dennis1209 and lchamp like this.
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    Senior Member Array IAm_Not_Lost's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by gasmitty View Post
    This doesn't mean you can't or shouldn't use hotter ammo in your 238, it simply means be smart about it. Run 100 or more of your chosen carry rounds through the gun to assure reliability, but then limit the use of hot rounds to occasional use only. Guns like snubbies and the 238 are not recreational shooters, they are last-ditch personal protection tools. Practice with standard-pressure ammo to learn how to run the gun and keep current with its trigger, and then confirm point of impact with your carry ammo. At the very worst a warranty claim might be denied due to using non-SAAMI ammo, but that's a small price compared to the cost of your life.
    Well said.
    "Brilliant. So now we got a huge guy theory, and a serial crusher theory. Top notch. What's your name?" - Paul Smecker

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    Ex Member Array apvbguy's Avatar
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    moderation is the answer, there is no reason to shoot +p every time you shoot

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    Senior Member Array SFury's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by apvbguy View Post
    moderation is the answer, there is no reason to shoot +p every time you shoot
    There is also no reason not to if the gun was designed to use it, and you can handle the recoil.

    Moderation is the key to success in life, but guns are tools that should be used as they were built for.

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    Quote Originally Posted by MitchellCT View Post
    15 rounds does nothing more than insure the weapon is not made of tin foil and was assembled with no more than 3 missing parts.
    if 15 rounds feed the way they should then 75 should do the same in my book . No need to over test something that doesn't need to be stressed
    I have yet to be attacked by a block of ballistic gelatin but.........

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    VIP Member Array MitchellCT's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by defensive007 View Post
    if 15 rounds feed the way they should then 75 should do the same in my book . No need to over test something that doesn't need to be stressed
    15 rounds is too small a statistical sample to rely on.

    Some instructors recommend 200 rounds, others 1,000 rounds of carry ammo...but regardless of the variance in the numbers, each wants a substantial round count to test reliability.

    If you would accept 15 rounds as a reliability test for something that is supposed to be a life saving tool, then you'd accept a 300 mile warranty for your car, and you'd marry someone after the 2nd date before finding out anything important about them.

    It's your life.

    Do as thou will, but don't expect anyone to not think it's a less than intelligent choice.

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    Member Array defensive007's Avatar
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    I carry HCD and reading how reliable it is in my gun I simply fired 8 personally and saw they fed flawless is all I needed
    I have yet to be attacked by a block of ballistic gelatin but.........

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