For You Whizz Kid Scientific Type Members - A Bizarre Hypothetical

This is a discussion on For You Whizz Kid Scientific Type Members - A Bizarre Hypothetical within the General Firearm Discussion forums, part of the Related Topics category; Originally Posted by RKflorida Can you imagine how many rounds it would take to zero in a rifle with that range? one to range and ...

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  1. #31
    Distinguished Member Array claude clay's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by RKflorida View Post
    Can you imagine how many rounds it would take to zero in a rifle with that range?
    one to range and the next will hit if you can use a calculator correctly

    reason being there is no atmosphere hence no coefficients of drag or changes in density over height
    you will still have to factor in rotation during travel but thats part of the calculations.
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  3. #32
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    Even if you could escape the moons gravitational gull, how much Kentucky windage would you have to factor in?
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  4. #33
    Member Array GettingOld2's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tangle View Post
    Well, even if one could make the escape velocity, I'm not sure that solves the problems. One problem would be if the sun's gravitational pull would pull the very slowly moving bullet toward it harder than the earth's gravitational pull. Also I'm not quite sure that one ever escapes gravity. After all, what influences the tide in our oceans? The gravitational pull of both the sun and the moon.

    And as small and far away as Pluto is, Pluto is held in orbit by the sun's gravitational pull.
    The term "escape velocity" is sort of a misnomer. You never escape gravity. Assuming no other influences, there are 3 possibilities:

    Shoot something up too slowly, it falls back down.
    Shoot something up fast enough, and although it slows forever as a result of gravity, it will keep moving away.
    Shoot something at just the right speed, and it will slow to zero as it approaches infinity. ESCAPE VELOCITY

    Think of it as the minimum speed for something to never come back.

  5. #34
    Member Array GettingOld2's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by rstickle View Post
    There are (I think) areas in our solar system where gravity is pretty much cancelled out buy the competing gravitational forces. There is an area between the Sun and Earth the orbital dynamics folks refer to as "L1" (don't know why) where they have "parked" some of the solar research observatories.
    They are called "Lagrange Points" after the mathematician who did the original work, hence "L" for Lagrange. There are others that are not in a direct line called L2 & L3.

  6. #35
    VIP Member Array dukalmighty's Avatar
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    I believe if you rub the ass of a cat with a corn cob dipped in turpentine he would not only reach lunar escape velocity,but exceed it
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  7. #36
    VIP Member Array dukalmighty's Avatar
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    Think of it as the minimum speed for something to never come back.
    70 miles per hour "My Ex-Wife"
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    OMG, Duklalmighty! I am laughing so hard I'm crying! Maybe with the budget crunch, NASA could use something similar. On the HARP Project, research Gerald Bull. Quite an interesting fellow. HARP( high altitude research project) did succeed in shooting an object to the very edge of space. Pretty cool.

  9. #38
    Senior Member Array RKflorida's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by dukalmighty View Post
    70 miles per hour "My Ex-Wife"
    hehe. My ex was a model. For those ice cubes with holes in them.

  10. #39
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    ok, only cause this seems fun...... has anybody considered that the velocity of a round on earth is limited my the earths thick atmosphere? on the moon there is significantly less if no atmpsphere at all...nothing to slow the round down except gravity. I wonder what the velocity of a round fired in a vacum would be? also, there are many many dime sized items zipping around in space at thousands of miles an hour. Just saying that there will be a big difference in velocity between a round fired on earth and on the moon....

  11. #40
    Senior Member Array RKflorida's Avatar
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    I don't think the friction of air is big factor since we are speaking of muzzle velocities. However, an object getting through the 20+ miles of atmosphere leaving the earth is a really big deal.

    As to aiming, can you imagine the amount of lead you would need? Literally you would have to lead by 2 days. Hmmm, maybe not, the moon always presents the same face to the earth so it would be like firing to the center of a circle, in effect, no lead?? Too much for me, my head hurts.

  12. #41
    Member Array GettingOld2's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by modernknight View Post
    ok, only cause this seems fun...... has anybody considered that the velocity of a round on earth is limited my the earths thick atmosphere? on the moon there is significantly less if no atmpsphere at all...nothing to slow the round down except gravity. I wonder what the velocity of a round fired in a vacum would be? also, there are many many dime sized items zipping around in space at thousands of miles an hour. Just saying that there will be a big difference in velocity between a round fired on earth and on the moon....
    The velocity relative to the gun would not change ... much. The lack of leading air in the barrel would increase it a little bit. The main difference is that the round would not slow down. You'd have the same velocity at a 1000 yards as the muzzle velocity.

    We think of bullets as fast, but when the Apollo capsules first hit the Earth's atmosphere returning from the movie set ... er ... the Moon, they were doing 25 thousand miles per hour. In bullet terms, that's around 36000 ft/sec. At nearly 13 feet in diameter and weighing around 13000 lbs or 91 million grains, that is one big caliber!

  13. #42
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    Quote Originally Posted by GettingOld2 View Post
    The term "escape velocity" is sort of a misnomer. You never escape gravity. Assuming no other influences, there are 3 possibilities:

    Shoot something up too slowly, it falls back down.
    Shoot something up fast enough, and although it slows forever as a result of gravity, it will keep moving away.
    Shoot something at just the right speed, and it will slow to zero as it approaches infinity. ESCAPE VELOCITY

    Think of it as the minimum speed for something to never come back.
    The use of the term 'escape velocity' applies only to an object without self-propulsion, such as a bullet, etc. Rockets, i.e. the space shuttle don't necessarily have to achieve 'escape velocity' because they are propelled. It may be most efficient of fuel to hit escape velocities, but in theory, given enough fuel, they could enter space/orbit or head to the moon far below escape velocity.

    There are a couple of other possibilities as well as the one's you mentioned.
    They could go into a circular orbit or,
    They could go into an elliptical orbit.

    A Wikipedia definition of escape velocity is: "It is the speed above which an object will depart on a ballistic trajectory, i.e. in free-fall, and never fall back to the surface nor assume a closed orbit. Such an object is said to "escape" the gravity of the planet. Which fully agrees with what you stated.
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    Intriguing question and some great answers.

    However it falls in that category of "stuff I don't need to know"........just sayin'
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  15. #44
    Member Array GettingOld2's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ppkheat View Post
    Intriguing question and some great answers.

    However it falls in that category of "stuff I don't need to know"........just sayin'
    Yeah that's probably true in most cases. I grew up during the big race to the Moon and it fired my imagination.

  16. #45
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    You guys are in orbit somewhere way over my head.

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