Disappointed with my accuracy, need help.

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Thread: Disappointed with my accuracy, need help.

  1. #1
    Member Array fullmetal1911's Avatar
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    Disappointed with my accuracy, need help.

    Made it to the range for the first time since moving from CA to AZ. Decided I NEEDED to put some rounds down range since I sold the only handgun that I brought into this state with me and had 4 new ones. Now, I guess my title is a little misleading, because I was only really disappointed shooting one of them.

    I started off small and shot my Kel Tec P-32, its a gen one with the non-existent rear sight and slight hump for a front sight, set the target out at 5 yards and got to work. Put 4 mags through it and after getting used to it in the first mag I kept everything on the other three within a 4" group at 5 yards, which for not having "sights" I considered not half bad, next up I switched to my Kel Tec P-11 9mm, which I was expecting to be the worst of the 4 to shoot, has decent usable sights, albeit a short sight radius, but I managed a much nice 2.5" group at 5 yards and kept them within 6 inches at 10 yards.

    Switched over to my M&P 9 after I was done with that because I had the 9mm ammo out already. Even better, 3" groups at 10 yards, although the gun was shooting about 3" lower than point of aim, but still, with those groups I was feeling really good. I by no means consider myself a great shot, but I was feeling really good. Took a break from everything and ran some of my reloads through my GF's revolver to cool off a bit, punched paper with those, love the soft recoil and accuracy.

    Finally to wrap things up I pulled out my LCP with the crimson trace laser. This little sucker ruined the entire trip for me. I started off trying to use the factory "sights" which were worse than the P-32 sights, but was getting distracted by the laser shining on the paper, and of course I didn't bring the allen wrench to take the laser off the gun. So I decided to try using the laser, I could not hit ANYTHING, and I am not talking about the laser not being zero'd I would aim the laser on the bullseye and the shots would just dance around the outside of the target, like the gun was taunting me. This gun seemed to have the snappiest recoil out of everything I had shot there, and for the life of me I was just having no luck.

    I took a few minutes, collected myself, and went back to it, I managed to get myself into the black of the target at 5 yards, but it was still nowhere near how well I was doing with any of the other guns. I don't know what the deal is. I practice dry-firing with the gun at home all the time, I love the laser for that purpose because I can point it at a switch or other fixed spot on the wall and make sure I am not moving while pulling the trigger. I was just completely off with that gun for some reason.

    Any advice from anyone that can help me improve my accuracy with that gun? I'm honestly considering just putting it on the chopping block and replacing it with something else since my P-11 is my main carry and I prefer the smaller P-32 as a BUG, I got the LCP to be a secondary carry gun in case my attire would not allow for the bulk of the P-11, but realistically I could either use the P-32 for that or buy a PF9 for that purpose. I want to like the gun, I have wanted one for a long time and was finally able to get it after moving away from CA's draconian "safe handgun roster".
    Last edited by JD; September 5th, 2012 at 10:04 AM.

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  3. #2
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    That trigger (LCP) is LOOOOONNNNNGGGG and the break is WAY back there. Sounds like you need some qaulity trigger time with it. To me, sounds like you need to become more familiar with where the trigger breaks and make sure your squeezing nice and even and pushing the trigger back, not pulling the trigger. Probably would've been good to do some dry fires right there on the lane. I bet the recoil was causing you to move your hand anticipating the shot. Live fire is different from dry fire, I'll stop and dry fire all the time to get myself back on track, it helps. I'm pretty sure the recoil will be the worst with that gun, it is the smallest and lightest.
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    VIP Member Array glockman10mm's Avatar
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    People will like what they like for a variety of reasons. But there is one truth that always applys; the shootability of guns vary by size, design, and action. None of these weapons you have are exactly range guns, but what I would call " get off me" guns meant for close proximity.

    Even these guns can be manipulated with practice.
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  5. #4
    Member Array Skidboot's Avatar
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    I have a couple of LCP's and have found them to be fairly accurate given their small size and "limited" sights. I wouldn't be too quick to give up on the gun. The next time you go to the range, reduce the number of variables by bringing a wrench, so you can turn the laser off. I'd also recommend high visibility sight paint. The sights become much more useful. Finally, don't try to "stage" the trigger. Just use one, smooth pull. I think you'll also find that the trigger tends to loosen up some with use.

  6. #5
    Senior Member Array Spidey2011's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by glockman10mm View Post
    People will like what they like for a variety of reasons. But there is one truth that always applys; the shootability of guns vary by size, design, and action. None of these weapons you have are exactly range guns, but what I would call " get off me" guns meant for close proximity.

    Even these guns can be manipulated with practice.
    Yup. I don't expect a lot of accuracy out of my .380. If it stays in the black at 5 yards, I'm happy. Like GMan said, it's a "Get off me!" gun.

    You did fine with the other guns, so don't sweat a little looser grouping with the LCP. Keep shooting it and you'll only improve.

  7. #6
    VIP Member Array blitzburgh's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by glockman10mm View Post
    People will like what they like for a variety of reasons. But there is one truth that always applys; the shootability of guns vary by size, design, and action. None of these weapons you have are exactly range guns, but what I would call " get off me" guns meant for close proximity.

    Even these guns can be manipulated with practice.
    What would you consider a range gun? I'm not being aa smart ass, just genuinely curious.

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    Ex Member Array bmglock23's Avatar
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    Contact the liberals ... sounds like you need more gun control!

    OK, OK, I was just being a smartass. The world needs more humor.

  9. #8
    VIP Member Array glockman10mm's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by blitzburgh View Post
    What would you consider a range gun? I'm not being aa smart ass, just genuinely curious.

    Sent from my palm device
    Range gun, my definition; a gun used for enjoyable extended shooting sessions, capable of combat accuracy as defined by military or LE criteria out to a minimum of 25 yards, which is reasonable for a wide variety of uses, such as hunting, SD, military and police, or competition.
    General characteristics are at least a 3-5 inch sight radius with high profile sights, a usable trigger, and a caliber sufficient to the variety of applications listed above. Anything below 38 spl or 9mm need not apply.

    That's my definition of a range gun. But it can be a 22 rimfire specifically used for targets and competition if that's all the user desires.
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    VIP Member Array 357and40's Avatar
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    Echoing the sentiment of others: The weapons you brought (M&P aside) are not the easiest to keep on target.

    The printable targets at this link may hep you figure out what you need to do to correct your errors.

    Trigger Press: Lee Precision Diagnostic Targets for Handgun
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  11. #10
    Member Array tricolordad's Avatar
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    Dont get discouraged. It sounds like you just need more time at the range. Maybe practicing solely with one gun first will help you. Are you shooting high right? Low left? We could help you more if we knew where you were on the paper.

  12. #11
    Member Array fullmetal1911's Avatar
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    The thing that got me is my P11 has a much longer and heavier trigger than the LCP and I wasnt having trouble with that or my P32 which has a nearly identical pull. I'm going back to the range Friday so I will definitely take a break and dry fire between mags.

    As far as where I was hitting, while consistently aiming for the bullseye and not trying to compensate for anything the rounds were hitting all around the outer ring of the target, not consistently hitting anywhere as far as to the left or right.
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  13. #12
    Member Array SFCDan's Avatar
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    A heavy trigger pull can affect accuracy. Try practicing with the weapon unloaded. If you squeeze the trigger with the empty weapon it should generally not move. Also be cautious of recoil anticipation. That can throw rounds all over the place. I find taking up the slack on a harder trigger pull can help and slowly squeezing through the last bit of trigger left while maintaining a proper sight picture works for me.

  14. #13
    Member Array tricolordad's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by fullmetal1911 View Post
    The thing that got me is my P11 has a much longer and heavier trigger than the LCP and I wasnt having trouble with that or my P32 which has a nearly identical pull. I'm going back to the range Friday so I will definitely take a break and dry fire between mags.

    As far as where I was hitting, while consistently aiming for the bullseye and not trying to compensate for anything the rounds were hitting all around the outer ring of the target, not consistently hitting anywhere as far as to the left or right.
    To me, it seems like youre anticipating recoil. Have somebody load for you and slip an empty casing or snap cap, trainer, dud whatever... into it so that way youll notice if you flinch. It does get better as you get more comfortable with the gun itsself as well.

    Ive fired many many different guns, but when I brought home my Mosin-Nagant a few years ago, i had a slight flinch problem. I had somebody at the range load my gun for me with a few empty casings and after a box or two, i wasnt flinching anymore.

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