Recoil Magazine - "This firearm shouldn't be available to the public" piece (MERGED) - Page 3

Recoil Magazine - "This firearm shouldn't be available to the public" piece (MERGED)

This is a discussion on Recoil Magazine - "This firearm shouldn't be available to the public" piece (MERGED) within the General Firearm Discussion forums, part of the Related Topics category; Seems to be just another person looking to make money and not believing in the cause or lifestyle. The people involved in the creation of ...

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  1. #31
    Distinguished Member Array sid1's Avatar
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    Seems to be just another person looking to make money and not believing in the cause or lifestyle. The people involved in the creation of this magazine were not "gun people" and were not smart enough to hire gun people from the start to not only create content for them, but educate them on how gun people think. A fundamental lack of understanding of gun culture was very obvious from the first issue on. As in his article his true colors are shown, and thus could be the demise of this rag.
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  2. #32
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    From what I've seen from videos when criminals get surprised by armed Homeowners,shop owners etc. the resulting escapades can be quite "Sporty" kinda like walking into a covey of quail just before they take off.
    I'm all for any Firearm that can not only deliver a punch,but due to low recoil followup shots are fast and accurate which this gun claims to have about 50% less recoil than 9mm.
    As far as "RECOIL MAGAZINE" I don't think they ever expected to experience the "RECOIL" this story got them
    phreddy and FTG-05 like this.
    "Outside of the killings, Washington has one of the lowest crime rates in the country,"
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  3. #33
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    H&K isn't going to complain. It's basically advertising.

    I've seen similar things with weight-lifting supplements. They put on the "not recommended for women" tag, and it makes it vastly more likely the men will buy it because it sounds more potent.
    There WILL be patents with this (simple) discovery. That, and "type III levers". It's untapped wealth, waiting for you who Google. Or your kids. People expanding on the potential are welcome to elucidate; I didn't phrase it well

  4. #34
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    RECOIL Magazine--My personal belief that what they did was wrong.

    Many of you may have heard of the article in RECOIL magazine that put its creators up against the Second Amendment. I started following this story last night and thought I'd share some of my personal feelings about what the editor, Jerry Tsai, did.

    Here is the first statement, published in issue 4 of the new magazine.

    “Like we mentioned before, the MP7A1 is unavailable to civilians and for good reason. We all know that’s technology no civvies should ever get to lay their hands on. This is a purpose-built weapon with no sporting applications to speak of.”
    Problem? This implies that civilians should be limited in what firearms they can own, and more alarmingly that apparently a weapons needs "sporting applications" as a basis for civilian ownership. This is wrong.

    Now, had they issued an apology at this point, some may have accepted it as a stupid mistake. However for me the real issue comes from the first response (rather, justification) given by JT.
    Its manufacturer has not made the gun available to the general public and when we asked if it would ever come to the commercial market, they replied that it is strictly a military and law enforcement weapon, adding that there are no sporting applications for it. Is it wrong that HK decided against selling a full-auto pocket sized machine gun that can penetrate armor from hundreds of yards away? It’s their decision to make and their decision they have to live with not mine nor anybody else’s.

    I accepted their answer for what it was out of respect for those serving in uniform. I believe that we as gun enthusiasts should respect our brothers in law enforcement, agency work and the military and also keep them out of harms way. Like HK, I wouldn’t want to see one of these slip into the wrong hands either. Whether or not you agree with this is fine. I am compelled to explain a point that I was trying to make that may have not been clear.
    According to JT, owning a specific type of firearm shows disrespect for those serving in uniform!? As a service member, its a shame to see someone justifying limitation of the Second Amendment by claiming that my safety is at risk....

    He later issued another apology, however for me it doesn't make up for his attempt to use Military and Law Enforcement to back up his anti 2A statements. That is the EXACT same reasoning pushed by gun control groups in this nation. What a disgrace.

    Thanks,
    Clay

  5. #35
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    Totally agree. I think HK should be getting a little more heat from the whole dust up as well.

  6. #36
    Senior Member Array dV8r's Avatar
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    I know nothing of the rag, but from skimming this thread it gives me the impression that the editors are a group of antis trying to infiltrate and influence the Pro2A groups.
    LEARN something today so you can TEACH something tomorrow.
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    Where is the wisdom that we have lost in knowledge?" T.S. Elliot

  7. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by dV8r View Post
    I know nothing of the rag, but from skimming this thread it gives me the impression that the editors are a group of antis trying to infiltrate and influence the Pro2A groups.
    And from skimming this thread, you couldn't be more wrong. Read the man's apology, which everyone posting probably should've done before forming an opinion on the matter:

    Quote Originally Posted by Jerry Tsai's apology statement
    RECOIL Statement
    Article by Jerry Tsai

    I’d like to address the comments regarding what I wrote in the MP7A1 article in RECOIL issue 4. First and foremost, I’d like to apologize for any offense that I have caused with the article. With the benefit of hindsight, I now understand the outrage, and I am greatly saddened that it was initiated by my words. Especially since, I am an unwavering supporter of 2nd Amendment Rights. I’ve chosen to spend a significant part of both my personnel and professional life immersed in this enthusiasm, so to have my support of individuals’ rights called into doubt is extremely unfortunate. With that said, I retract what I wrote in the offending paragraph within this article. It should have had been presented with more clarity.

    In the article, I stated some information that was passed on to me about why the gun is not available for civilian purchase. By no means did I intend to imply that civilians are not responsible, nor do we lack the judgment to own such weapons, if I believed anything approaching this, clearly I would lead a much different life. I also mentioned in the article that the gun had no sporting purpose. This again, was information passed on to me and reported in the article without the necessary additional context. I believe everything published in RECOIL up to this point (other than this story), demonstrates we clearly understand and completely agree that guns do not need to have a sporting purpose in order for them to be rightfully available to civilians. In retrospect, I should have presented this information in a clearer manner. Although I can understand the manufacturer’s stance on the subject, it doesn’t mean that I agree with it.

    Again, I acknowledge the mistakes I made and for them I am truly sorry.

    Sincerely,
    Jerry Tsai
    Editor
    RECOIL

  8. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by dV8r View Post
    I know nothing of the rag, but from skimming this thread it gives me the impression that the editors are a group of antis trying to infiltrate and influence the Pro2A groups.
    Actually, the more reading I've been doing about the whole thing the more I believe that the editor, Jerry Tsai, was basically walked into a hornet's nest by the H&K rep that he was interviewing. The H&K rep is the one who made the statement that this firearm has no sporting purpose and therefore isn't available to the general public. Jerry was just dumb enough to echo that mentality in an effort to make the gun seem uber tacticool. Jerry buried himself with his poorly thought out apologies by trying to 'explain' what he meant instead of passing the turd sandwich back to the H&K guy.

    Overall, I think Jerry and Recoil deserve every bit of negative feedback that they are receiving, but I think that it's completely hypocritical for all the industry and public figures to rush in and heap the blame on Recoil and ignore the fact that the 'no sporting purpose' sentiment comes straight from H&K.

  9. #39
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    Quote Originally Posted by TX expat View Post
    Actually, the more reading I've been doing about the whole thing the more I believe that the editor, Jerry Tsai, was basically walked into a hornet's nest by the H&K rep that he was interviewing. The H&K rep is the one who made the statement that this firearm has no sporting purpose and therefore isn't available to the general public. Jerry was just dumb enough to echo that mentality in an effort to make the gun seem uber tacticool. Jerry buried himself with his poorly thought out apologies by trying to 'explain' what he meant instead of passing the turd sandwich back to the H&K guy.

    Overall, I think Jerry and Recoil deserve every bit of negative feedback that they are receiving, but I think that it's completely hypocritical for all the industry and public figures to rush in and heap the blame on Recoil and ignore the fact that the 'no sporting purpose' sentiment comes straight from H&K.
    No I firmly believe that this guy his entire life has believed there should be separation with certain types of guns in the hands of non-LEO....Hes drawn into the fantasy that cops are out there defending us from evil dowers, and at any moment one of us could turn into an evil doer and cause chaos. He statements clearly reflect that in his mind civilians can not be trusted! He was also trying to get folks to drool over the fact that he is one of the few "select" people to get to shoot and play with a MP7. Well it back fired. Since he tried to show how Bad/A he actually he is, he in trun has shown how the majority of 2nd Amendment folks truely feel about his way of thinking. He is not sorry for his statements he is sorry to have been caught.

    The other thing every writer has an editor or a few for that matter. This is not just his opinion this reflects opinions of at least 2 individuals at Recoil Magazine, if not the the Chief Editor of the magazine. I'm sorry I will not be ever purchasing that magazine again.
    “Are you a thermometer or a thermostat, do you reflect or become what is happening in the room or do you change the atmosphere, reset the temperature when you come into the room”?--Chuck Swindoll

    Its not about guns...Its about Freedom!

  10. #40
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    Have to admit I had a what-the-heck moment when I read this thread. What is an HK MP7a1? For one, it fires HK's 4.6mm ammo, their proposed replacement for the 9x19 cartridge. Two, it's a bullpup design. Imho, the scariest thing about 4.6mm ammo is also the scariest thing about 5.7mm ammo (another 9x19 replacement): the price.

    Heckler & Koch - USA

  11. #41
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    Can't say I've heard of this rag before this thread. I can say that based upon some of the replies in this thread that I will NOT be subscribing to it or buying a copy. Apology or not, I don't like their attitude.

  12. #42
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    The authors attitude reflects what many supposedly pro-gun people believe. That what I do is fine but what others do should have restrictions. Go out and ask fellow shooters you encounter if ordinary citizens should be able to own machine guns if you want proof.

    Michael
    phreddy and msgt/ret like this.

  13. #43
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rob99VMI04 View Post
    No I firmly believe that this guy his entire life has believed there should be separation with certain types of guns in the hands of non-LEO....Hes drawn into the fantasy that cops are out there defending us from evil dowers, and at any moment one of us could turn into an evil doer and cause chaos. He statements clearly reflect that in his mind civilians can not be trusted! He was also trying to get folks to drool over the fact that he is one of the few "select" people to get to shoot and play with a MP7. Well it back fired. Since he tried to show how Bad/A he actually he is, he in trun has shown how the majority of 2nd Amendment folks truely feel about his way of thinking. He is not sorry for his statements he is sorry to have been caught.

    The other thing every writer has an editor or a few for that matter. This is not just his opinion this reflects opinions of at least 2 individuals at Recoil Magazine, if not the the Chief Editor of the magazine. I'm sorry I will not be ever purchasing that magazine again.
    I don't disagree with your sentiment. I think Jerry really screwed up and I think he should lose his job over it. My only point is it's not just Mr. Tsai that believes that us poor civilians need to justify our small arms with "sporting purposes" it's H&K's view as well. I just don't want to see that fact get lost in all the bloodlust.

  14. #44
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    Quote Originally Posted by TX expat View Post
    civilians need to justify our small arms with "sporting purposes" it's H&K's view as well. I just don't want to see that fact get lost in all the bloodlust.
    This was on my mind with my previous post, but I chose not to comment on it. This thread has also (negatively) influenced my opinion of H&K. While I won't say that I would boycott their products, it does influence my purchase decision making.

  15. #45
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    Quote Originally Posted by noway2 View Post
    This was on my mind with my previous post, but I chose not to comment on it. This thread has also (negatively) influenced my opinion of H&K. While I won't say that I would boycott their products, it does influence my purchase decision making.
    In my personal opinion, it's good that you are seeing this. I hope others do as well. H&K has a very underwhelming record on supporting our Second Amendment and I think it's worth noting that Recoil isn't the only guilty party in that article. The writer/editor made the mistake of following the lead of an industry spokesperson, never realizing that the particular view he was spouting off was going to receive such a negative reaction. He did a very poor job of making amends and I think he needs to find employment outside of the firearms business. I also think that H&K ought to get called out for the very same believe that has buried Recoil with all the negative feedback.

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