September 13th, 2012 07:57 PM
CDC's Violent Deaths National Violent Death Reporting System, 16 States, 2009
Just published. Right off the bat I note:
I call flag on the play, there is statistical evidence that private citizens account for nearly as many lawful homicides as do the police. Instead, we can only assume that lawful homicides are lumped in with:
A death from legal intervention is a death in which a decedent is killed by a police officer or other peace officer (a person with specified legal authority to use deadly force), including military police, acting in the line of duty.
A subtle way to "cook the books" if you ask me. The assumption being that all homicides not classified as "Legal intervention" are by default criminal in nature.
. Homicide is defined as a death resulting from the use of physical force or power, threatened or actual, against another person, group, or community when a preponderance of evidence indicates that the use of force was intentional.
There are a few other nuggets of info in the report that we might find useful. Like only half of suicides use firearms, and:
TABLE 10. Number and percentage* of homicides/legal intervention deaths, by victim's marital status and relationship to suspect
National Violent Death Reporting System, 16 states, 2009
Characteristic No. (%)
Married 834 (22.8)
Never married 1,985 (54.3)
Widowed 125 (3.4)
Divorced 528 (14.4)
Married, but separated 14 (0.4)
Single, not specified 34 (0.9)
Unknown 136 (3.7)
Total 3,656 (100.0)
Spouse/Partner (current or former) 417 (10.3)
Parent 86 (2.1)
Child 116 (2.9)
Other intimate partner involvement 37 (0.9)
Other relative 117 (2.9)
Acquaintance/Friend 412 (10.2)
Rival gang member 32 (0.8)
Stranger 185 (4.6)
Victim injured by a LEO 137 (3.4)
Other specified relationship 321 (7.9)
Relationship unknown/Missing 2197 (54.2)
Total 4,057 (100.0)
Surveillance for Violent Deaths — National Violent Death Reporting System, 16 States, 2009
"Each worker carried his sword strapped to his side." Nehemiah 4:18
Guns Save Lives. Paramedics Save Lives. But...
Paramedics With Guns Scare People!
September 14th, 2012 08:45 AM
Another recent report showed that justifiable homicides were up and total violent crime was down. Some would say that was the exected relationship. The interesting thing is that justifiable homicides committed by LEOs was up by the same amount that justifiable homicide increased my non-LEOs.
Clearly, one has to be careful NOT to attribute causation to correlational data. A lot of people don't understand this and it needs to be engraved on any tablet discussing survey data. E.g. there is a correlation between Vitamin D levels and skin cancer; but one does not cause the other. They are both caused by another factor all together: sun exposure.
'Guerir quelquefois, soulager souvent, consoler toujours.'
"Socialism never took root in America because the poor see themselves not as an exploited proletariat but as temporarily embarrassed millionaires." (John Steinbeck)
Good health actually just means dying at the slowest possible rate.
September 14th, 2012 09:39 AM
Another category which requires interpretation is the "acquaintance/friend" one. A drug deal gone bad and someone gets killed may fall into this 'bucket' if the combatants 'knew' each other... one can't assume it's just one golf buddy killing another. There's a practical limit to how many 'relationship' categories can be defined, and I'd say 11 is already enough. The problem arises when some AP newswriter comes up with "10.2% of gun murders occur between friends" or similar misinterpretation to sell gun control.
NRA Endowment Member
September 14th, 2012 03:10 PM
The following is the standard definition of homicide.
It is total deception on the part of this agency to make up new meaning for the word.
The killing of one human being by another human being.
September 14th, 2012 04:21 PM
And it should be divided, IMO, into two basic subcategories: Criminal killing of another; and, Non-Criminal killing of another (by whomever had lawful justification to do so, irrespective of who's paying the bills). As Para points out, the slanted definition doesn't include a good number of justifiable homicides, leaving any meaningful analysis of lawful homicides at the hands of citizens incapable of being done.
Originally Posted by mlr1m
Wonderful tools, statistics.
Your best weapon is your brain. Don't leave home without it.
self defense (A.O.J.).
How does disarming
the number of victims?
Reason over Force: The Gun is Civilization (Marko Kloos)
NRA, SAF, GOA, OFF, ACLDN.
September 14th, 2012 04:31 PM
This was my point. There was no reason to make up a new meaning for homicide the way they did. All they needed to do was use current language regarding justifiable homicide. The reason they did not do this was that it would prevent them from padding their stats. Normally when some agency tries to change the common language there is a reason for it.
Originally Posted by ccw9mm
September 14th, 2012 05:01 PM
Homicide from Latin: homicidium, Latin: homo human being + Latin: to kill. Generally refering to one human killing another
You can sway a thousand men by appealing to their prejudices quicker than you can convince one man by logic.
― Robert A. Heinlein,
September 15th, 2012 02:03 AM
"Homicide is defined as a death resulting from the use of physical force or power, threatened or actual, against another person, group, or community when a preponderance of evidence indicates that the use of force was intentional."
So if someone threatens someone else and the second person ends up dead, that means the one who threatened is responsible, regardless of who actually did the killing??? Really???
September 15th, 2012 05:45 AM
I'll go out on a limb here and say that I do not share this group's goal: "of preventing violent deaths". Violence does not need to be prevented, it needs to be directed back at those who employ it illegally. I do not think that justifiable homicide is a bad thing, quite the contrary I celebrate everytime a law-abiding citizen is able to continue their lives by exercising their right of self-protection. I'm not rushing to shoot anyone and hope it never comes to that but as others have said: hope is not a strategy. You can study and classify homocides until you're blue in the face and at the end of it all there will still be an element in society willing to unlawfully exert lethal force to get what they want. The best, most cost efficient, way of dealing with these miscreants is at the point of attack.
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