Placing black tape over serial number- Federal violation???

This is a discussion on Placing black tape over serial number- Federal violation??? within the General Firearm Discussion forums, part of the Related Topics category; Originally Posted by STLRampage I may be missing something but what does it matter if a LEO runs the serial on a gun if it's ...

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Thread: Placing black tape over serial number- Federal violation???

  1. #16
    Member Array Ionracas's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by STLRampage View Post
    I may be missing something but what does it matter if a LEO runs the serial on a gun if it's legally purchased and carried?
    Quote Originally Posted by F350 View Post
    Oh I don't know; maybe a little thing called the CONSTITUTION!

    If I am walking down the street OCing (which I do) and LEO unlawfully detains me for nothing else but OCing, seizes my firearm without cause and unlawfully searches (removes the tape to run the numbers) without being challenged, what is next but LEO standing on the street corners hollering "PAPERS!!! YOU VILL SHOW YOUR IDENTITY PAPERS!!!" Does that matter??
    I have absoloutley nothing to hide but that does not mean I will be happy about being told what to do when there is no need for it.
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  3. #17
    Member Array STLRampage's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by F350 View Post
    Oh I don't know; maybe a little thing called the CONSTITUTION!

    If I am walking down the street OCing (which I do) and LEO unlawfully detains me for nothing else but OCing, seizes my firearm without cause and unlawfully searches (removes the tape to run the numbers) without being challenged, what is next but LEO standing on the street corners hollering "PAPERS!!! YOU VILL SHOW YOUR IDENTITY PAPERS!!!" Does that matter??
    Your comparison is a bit extreme. They can run me and my firearms all day long and I will walk away clean.

    I actually have a copy of the bill of sale for both my Handguns in my wallet with my CCW showing my name and serial numbers. (Just in case.)

    And I vould have my papers too. LOL

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  4. #18
    Member Array STLRampage's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DontTreadOnI View Post
    What does it matter that an officer stops and questions you for no reason as long as you're not wanted or committing an illegal activity?
    I'd answer the questions and be on my way.

    I'm not doing anything wrong so I'm good to go.

  5. #19
    VIP Member Array Smitty901's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by STLRampage View Post
    I may be missing something but what does it matter if a LEO runs the serial on a gun if it's legally purchased and carried?
    First they would not care they would just pull the tape off.
    What is the harm simple once they run the number and your name there will be a record of both for ever.
    In Wisconsin when you buy a fire arm there is a back round check but no registration of the fire arm. Office doing this is a back door way of making a record of who has what fire arm.
    They do the same thing at some indoor ranges, the name and weapon serial number of everyone that uses the range is turn over to the local police chief.

  6. #20
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  7. #21
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    Originally Posted by F350
    Oh I don't know; maybe a little thing called the CONSTITUTION!

    If I am walking down the street OCing (which I do) and LEO unlawfully detains me for nothing else but OCing, seizes my firearm without cause and unlawfully searches (removes the tape to run the numbers) without being challenged, what is next but LEO standing on the street corners hollering "PAPERS!!! YOU VILL SHOW YOUR IDENTITY PAPERS!!!" Does that matter??

    Quote Originally Posted by STLRampage View Post
    Your comparison is a bit extreme. They can run me and my firearms all day long and I will walk away clean.

    And I vould have my papers too. LOL

    Sent from my DROID RAZR using Tapatalk 2
    A little extreme, yea. But encroachment of liberty by authority must be challenged wherever, whenever encountered, I am a firm believer in incrementalism; look at how much infringement we have on the 2nd amendment now because the first little steps were not challenged. I will not sit by and watch as liberty is slowly whittled away or some day down the road we will have those friendly LEO in their black leather trench coats standing on the street corners. What is disturbing to me is the number of US troops who say they will fire on US citizens if ordered.

    Ever read any Alexis de Tocqueville??
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  8. #22
    Member Array Ionracas's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by STLRampage View Post
    I'd answer the questions and be on my way.

    I'm not doing anything wrong so I'm good to go.
    I agree with you and I comply with an officer when Im questioned too. The problem is that if you havnt done anything what right does the officer have to be questioning you? Big picture is, if there is an officer who is acting with a chip on their shoulder or feels high and mighty because they have a badge then who is going to make a stand against it? I am not saying fight the officer but being passive and allowing these things to happen gives them more power than they need.

    Okay so you make a minor traffic violation then get stopped. You did break the law. The officer is well within their right to stop you and take a reasonable ammount of control. But if you provide your CCW with your license even if your not required to do so, then why should they take your gun? Why should they run the number?

    If you are walking down the street OC'ing (where legal of course) and an officer questions you on it, it should not go beyond showing your carry permit. You are legaly carrying, end of story.

    The point is not that your a law abiding citizen with nothing to hide but your a law abiding citizen with rights. If we as a community are going to fight for our right to carry then we have to fight for all of our rights. I may not like what antis say for instance but I still respect their right to say it.
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  9. #23
    Ex Member Array F350's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ionracas View Post
    I agree with you and I comply with an officer when Im questioned too. The problem is that if you havnt done anything what right does the officer have to be questioning you? Big picture is, if there is an officer who is acting with a chip on their shoulder or feels high and mighty because they have a badge then who is going to make a stand against it? I am not saying fight the officer but being passive and allowing these things to happen gives them more power than they need.

    Okay so you make a minor traffic violation then get stopped. You did break the law. The officer is well within their right to stop you and take a reasonable ammount of control. But if you provide your CCW with your license even if your not required to do so, then why should they take your gun? Why should they run the number?

    If you are walking down the street OC'ing (where legal of course) and an officer questions you on it, it should not go beyond showing your carry permit. You are legaly carrying, end of story.

    The point is not that your a law abiding citizen with nothing to hide but your a law abiding citizen with rights. If we as a community are going to fight for our right to carry then we have to fight for all of our rights. I may not like what antis say for instance but I still respect their right to say it.
    1} I am walking down the street OCing "and an officer questions you on it" Well the Colorado constitution explicitly states..
    Article II Section 13. Right to bear arms. The right of no person to keep and bear arms in defense of his home, person and property, or in aid of the civil power when thereto legally summoned, shall be called in question; but nothing herein contained shall be construed to justify the practice of carrying concealed weapons.
    So to start with the LEO would be in violation of the state constitution.

    2}As per Article II Section 13 I do not need a permit to OC and do not have it in my wallet when OCing. (Interesting note, at the time of the Colorado Constitution only persons of a nefarious nature would carry a concealed weapon so concealed carry was prohibited and righteous people carried openly).

    Then there are the federal constitutional rights like to be secure in my person, house and papers and the guidelines established in Terry which brought about the concept of Reasonable Articulable Suspicion.

    So the jest of it is the LEO would have NO legal authority to stop me in the first place so everything starting with the stop on is unconstitutional (in Colorado state and federal constitutions) and a deprivation of my rights.
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  10. #24
    Member Array Ionracas's Avatar
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    ^ THIS ^

    Of course only where applicable.
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  11. #25
    Member Array STLRampage's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Smitty901 View Post
    First they would not care they would just pull the tape off.
    What is the harm simple once they run the number and your name there will be a record of both for ever.

    When I buy a gun in a Missouri they do the same background check so my name and serial are already on file.

    To get my CCW My hands and finger prints are in a database as well.

    I don't see the problem with either as I have no plans to commit any crime.

  12. #26
    Member Array Ionracas's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by STLRampage View Post
    When I buy a gun in a Missouri they do the same background check so my name and serial are already on file.

    To get my CCW My hands and finger prints are in a database as well.

    I don't see the problem with either as I have no plans to commit any crime.
    Very true but with that is another discussion of, "shall not be infringed." Therfore, once again constitutional rights are violated. Just because we do not intend to commit crimes does not mean we should be treated as if we might.
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  13. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by Smitty901 View Post
    First they would not care they would just pull the tape off.
    What is the harm simple once they run the number and your name there will be a record of both for ever.
    In Wisconsin when you buy a fire arm there is a back round check but no registration of the fire arm. Office doing this is a back door way of making a record of who has what fire arm.
    They do the same thing at some indoor ranges, the name and weapon serial number of everyone that uses the range is turn over to the local police chief.
    Dang dude, move up here. We dont do that crap. Looks like youre getting Flynn'd.

  14. #28
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    And so it begins . . . again.
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  15. #29
    Member Array Ionracas's Avatar
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    I wish I had a computer and could use all thoes fancy smilies and maybe spellcheck and proof read. But I digress.
    "The thing about quotes on the internet is that you can not confirm their validity."
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  16. #30
    Member Array linuss's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Smitty901 View Post
    First they would not care they would just pull the tape off.
    Luckily the SN of my handgun is actually inside the grip visible through a little window, so if I tape it, there is no way they're taking off the tape without taking about the gun.

    What is the harm simple once they run the number and your name there will be a record of both for ever.
    What's the harm in letting the police randomly search your home when they want? Same idea.
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