Do you support a businesses right to ban guns(Poll added) - Page 9

Do you support a businesses right to ban guns(Poll added)

This is a discussion on Do you support a businesses right to ban guns(Poll added) within the General Firearm Discussion forums, part of the Related Topics category; Whether a business has the legal right to ban firearms or not is immaterial to me. If that is how they want to act, I ...

View Poll Results: Do you support a business's right to ban guns?

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  • YES

    87 82.86%
  • NO

    18 17.14%
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Thread: Do you support a businesses right to ban guns(Poll added)

  1. #121
    StarPD45
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    Whether a business has the legal right to ban firearms or not is immaterial to me.
    If that is how they want to act, I will spend my money elsewhere.
    I do like the idea of the business cards I've heard about that explain why we won't do business with them.
    discoboxer likes this.


  2. #122
    Member Array 2700's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by StarPD45 View Post
    Whether a business has the legal right to ban firearms or not is immaterial to me.
    If that is how they want to act, I will spend my money elsewhere.
    I do like the idea of the business cards I've heard about that explain why we won't do business with them.
    Here is a post of the cards I have made - No-Gun signs in GA

    If you want a handful, PM me your address and I'll drop some in the mail for you.
    NRA Certified Instructor - RSO - Life Member

    The significant problems we face cannot be solved at the same level of thinking we were at when we created them.
    -Albert Einstein

  3. #123
    VIP Member Array Richard58's Avatar
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    Same as a sign at a eating place that says, no pets, or shirts and shoes required.
    The police are not there to protect you from crime, they are there to arrest the guy after the crime has been committed, assuming they find him. It is your responsibility to protect yourself and your family.

  4. #124
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    Do you support a businesses right to ban guns

    Quote Originally Posted by torgo1968 View Post
    What seems to be getting lost over and over is what the Bill of Rights protects us from. On the radio today, a sports talk host in Columbus was on, he got fired for a very mild tweet. Callers kept bringing up his 1st Amendment rights and "freedom of speech".

    That's not what the 1A is about. It's about protecting you from government interference. Your employer canning you because you made a public statement that they found detrimental has nothing to do with the 1A, particularly in "at will" states.

    Similarly, a home or business owner barring you from carrying is not violating anyone's Second Amendment rights; he's not the government. Certain states ban carry in churches even if the church is ok with it. I think that's a 2A violation. They are taking away your 2A right to carry on private property and not giving the owner a choice. That's not what we are talking about here. If a business gets to choose, no Constitutional right is violated.
    I believe that the State gov is overstepping its bounds when they tell a church that they cannot allow guns. It should be a right for the church to decide on their property. I'm glad that is not the law here in WI.
    “There are only two ways to live your life. One is as though nothing is a miracle. The other is as though everything is a miracle.”
    ― Albert Einstein

  5. #125
    Senior Member Array rachilders's Avatar
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    Yes I do, to answer the OP's question. OTOH, I ALSO support the right of an individual not to patronize a business if he disagrees with the stores policy.
    "... Americans... we want a safe home, to keep the money we make and shoot bad guys." -- Denny Crane

  6. #126
    StarPD45
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    Quote Originally Posted by discoboxer View Post
    I believe that the State gov is overstepping its bounds when they tell a church that they cannot allow guns. It should be a right for the church to decide on their property. I'm glad that is not the law here in WI.
    VA has allowed carry in churches for legitimate reasons. The AG just recently stated an opinion that self defense is just that.
    discoboxer likes this.

  7. #127
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    I don't know how many topics are going right now in regards to this basic topic of no gun signs but it did motivate me to look up particular legal terminology that clears up some things. If I have posted this in this topic before sorry.

    Private property - Any property not owned by the state or controlled by the public as a whole is private property. Wal Mart, K Mart, Mom and Pop Grocery and your favorite restaurant, they are all private property. Period.

    Invitee - an invitee is a person who is invited to land by the possessor of the land as a member of the public or one who is invited to the land for the purpose of business dealings with the possessor of the land. Not a customer, guest and so on an invitee.

    Rights of that invitee - An invitee is only an invitee within the scope of permission granted by the landowner. You abide by their rules while in their business plain and simple. Don't like it don't go there.

    Constitutional backing in regards to state and local enforcement - by providing that powers not granted to the federal government by the Constitution, nor prohibited to the States, are reserved to the States or the people. Local Governments and the people are empowered to enforce laws, rules and regulations.

    Gun toters are not in a protected class. Business owners are not discriminating against the person they are stating an object, the gun, is not allowed on their premises. It does not come close to discrimination.

    Landlords can restrict what comes onto their property but they are limited to what is in the lease or rental agreement. If they say the do not allow firearms to be kept and you sign the lease/rental agreement you are now legally obligated to adhere to it or you will be asked to move. They are not discriminating. It is the same thing as no pets allowed, no smoking apartments and so on.

    An employer can have a different set of standards for customers and employee's. The owner can have a smoking area for his customers but can restrict his employees to no smoking on the premises. If you do not agree to this "condition of employment" don't work there or face the consequences.

    The matter is simple really. If signs carry the weight of law you risk being arrested if found with a firearm on their premises. Should the sign carry the weight of the law and you are put into a position that you have to use your firearm you would/could be held liable for anything that occurs even if you saved the day as you were not legally there in the first place.
    If they carry no weight and you choose to go in anyway that is on you. I simply feel that I will respect the owners rights and wishes. It is a personal decision that we each have to make.
    "A first rate man with a third rate gun is far better than the other way around". The gun is a tool, you are the craftsman that makes it work. There are those who say "if I had to do it, I could" yet they never go out and train to do it. Don't let stupid be your mindset. Harryball 2013

  8. #128
    Ex Member Array ArmyMan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by tacman605 View Post
    I don't know how many topics are going right now in regards to this basic topic of no gun signs but it did motivate me to look up particular legal terminology that clears up some things. If I have posted this in this topic before sorry.

    Private property - Any property not owned by the state or controlled by the public as a whole is private property. Wal Mart, K Mart, Mom and Pop Grocery and your favorite restaurant, they are all private property. Period.

    Invitee - an invitee is a person who is invited to land by the possessor of the land as a member of the public or one who is invited to the land for the purpose of business dealings with the possessor of the land. Not a customer, guest and so on an invitee.

    Rights of that invitee - An invitee is only an invitee within the scope of permission granted by the landowner. You abide by their rules while in their business plain and simple. Don't like it don't go there.

    Constitutional backing in regards to state and local enforcement - by providing that powers not granted to the federal government by the Constitution, nor prohibited to the States, are reserved to the States or the people. Local Governments and the people are empowered to enforce laws, rules and regulations.

    Gun toters are not in a protected class. Business owners are not discriminating against the person they are stating an object, the gun, is not allowed on their premises. It does not come close to discrimination.

    Landlords can restrict what comes onto their property but they are limited to what is in the lease or rental agreement. If they say the do not allow firearms to be kept and you sign the lease/rental agreement you are now legally obligated to adhere to it or you will be asked to move. They are not discriminating. It is the same thing as no pets allowed, no smoking apartments and so on.

    An employer can have a different set of standards for customers and employee's. The owner can have a smoking area for his customers but can restrict his employees to no smoking on the premises. If you do not agree to this "condition of employment" don't work there or face the consequences.

    The matter is simple really. If signs carry the weight of law you risk being arrested if found with a firearm on their premises. Should the sign carry the weight of the law and you are put into a position that you have to use your firearm you would/could be held liable for anything that occurs even if you saved the day as you were not legally there in the first place.
    If they carry no weight and you choose to go in anyway that is on you. I simply feel that I will respect the owners rights and wishes. It is a personal decision that we each have to make.
    All the leftist gun-control talk makes me wonder why you're member of this forum.

  9. #129
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    Armyman you are really something.

    So please explain how posting sections of the Constitution, case law and legal precedent make me a leftist gun control guy? Oh wait let me guess, it does not agree nor support your position so it must be anti gun, right? Your rhetoric and off the wall comments and just plain damn wrong advice given to others shows again you are talking out of your butt.

    You have made statements that support your own agenda, gotten butt hurt when others don't agree but you cannot offer any legal backing as to what you preach and in a final pitiful attempt to show how big and bad you are accuse me of being anti gun. You show a level of maturity that rivals a 5 year old.

    Since your time on this forum you have given advice and opinions that have gone from condoning a illegal activity to the plain damn stupid. With simple examples being "In the thread regarding carrying on school grounds you told the OP to "make a donation" to the school in order to obtain a contract which would allow him to carry a gun on school grounds". I don't know about South Dakota but most everywhere else in the states that is called "BRIBERY" and it is a felony. One of my favorites is the fact that with a memo from your commander you could carry a knife on a commercial aircraft while in uniform, but you never backed that one up either.

    You have been proven wrong on so many occasions with facts not circumstance but you simply ignore that and answer a question with a question, change the topic or state "It doesn't matter" and then in the end either simply disappear or resort to kindergarten statements.

    I am on this forum simply because firearms are a passion but I also realize that a firearm is simply a tool, I am not dependent on it to defend myself or have to carry one to show how big my pee pee is to the world. I have served my country in one way shape or form for over 32 years carrying a gun to protect myself, my family and those around me. I have had to do things and seen things in places around the world that caused me pause and shook my faith in myself and my God but I continue on serving because it is the right thing to do.

    So once again I will ask you to post facts, case law or legal precedent that proves any of my statements are wrong? If you can't then simply keep your ignorant, combat tested FOBBIT comments and opinions to yourself.

    Oh and by the way I would have sent this in a PM but as you advised me if I attempted to contact you again by PM you would report me as an internet stalker and lord knows I would not want that to happen.

    To the OP and others on the forum I apologize if it seems I am attempting to hijack the thread or lead it off topic that is not my intention but I have a problem with ignorance, stupidity, questionable morals and ethics and most of the time if things are not addressed directly and at that moment they tend to grow.

    Mods I will take the hit if you choose to give me one.
    "A first rate man with a third rate gun is far better than the other way around". The gun is a tool, you are the craftsman that makes it work. There are those who say "if I had to do it, I could" yet they never go out and train to do it. Don't let stupid be your mindset. Harryball 2013

  10. #130
    Ex Member Array ArmyMan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by tacman605 View Post
    So please explain how posting sections of the Constitution, case law and legal precedent make me a leftist gun control guy?
    This thread isn't about you.

  11. #131
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    Quote Originally Posted by ArmyMan View Post
    All the leftist gun-control talk makes me wonder why you're member of this forum.
    Unnecessary, unfounded and unproductive statement.

    Many folks on here disagree with you and have tried to compel you to a different understanding. It's ok if you do not agree. It's a good discussion when you can present compelling reason, but it goes south when you make personal attacks such as this.

    Please do us all a favor and keep it to topic and civil.
    suntzu likes this.
    “There are only two ways to live your life. One is as though nothing is a miracle. The other is as though everything is a miracle.”
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  12. #132
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    "a fear of weapons is a sign of a retarded sexual and emotional maturity" -Sigmund Freud
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  13. #133
    VIP Member
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    Armyman not about you either. It is about facts that govern actions.

    Once again you divert from the question as always.

    What part of the legal precedent, case law or the Constitution that I posted is wrong? Of course other than it show you have no legal standing to back up your rhetoric.

    Discoboxer it is all he has left, his box of crayons is empty.
    "A first rate man with a third rate gun is far better than the other way around". The gun is a tool, you are the craftsman that makes it work. There are those who say "if I had to do it, I could" yet they never go out and train to do it. Don't let stupid be your mindset. Harryball 2013

  14. #134
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    Armyman not about you either. It is about facts that govern actions.

    Once again you divert from the question as always.

    What part of the legal precedent, case law or the Constitution that I posted is wrong? Of course other than it show you have no legal standing to back up your rhetoric.

    Discoboxer it is all he has left, his box of crayons is empty.
    "A first rate man with a third rate gun is far better than the other way around". The gun is a tool, you are the craftsman that makes it work. There are those who say "if I had to do it, I could" yet they never go out and train to do it. Don't let stupid be your mindset. Harryball 2013

  15. #135
    Ex Member Array ArmyMan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chase127 View Post
    "a fear of weapons is a sign of a retarded sexual and emotional maturity" -Sigmund Freud
    Hoplophobia Analysis

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