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This should help ! Teachers Train to Tackle Gunmen

3K views 47 replies 29 participants last post by  C Paul Lincoln 
#1 ·
#2 ·
We have 280 lb professional athletes playing football every Sunday that make millions per game struggling to tackle a man with a BALL and they think they can teach a 50 year old wormy math teacher to tackle a madman with a gun? And they're the ones calling for "common sense?" Really???
 
#18 ·
What a ridiculous comparison. We're not talking about chasing a gunmen around a field who's been trained to evade a tackle. Did you watch the video? The goal is to surprise him and get behind him as he enters a classroom, take out his legs, and disarm. I'm not sure how you could watch the video and make any comparison to a football game. They're learning techniques that the trainer uses with police.
 
#14 ·
And they will probably want you to call the police so they can turn themselves in. All those signs do is let the nut jobs know that the schools are a turkey shoot. I work in the 3rd largest ISD in dfw and I would like to see select teachers and administrators receive the training (not just a weekend course but extensive training) to be able to have a firearm at their disposal(my wife tends to disagree) whether it be on their person or in a locked cabinet where they can retrieve it quickly. I work with several emotionally disturbed kids who can become extremely violent at the drop of a hat. We've already had two teachers injured this year. Who's to say one of them couldn't bring a gun to school and go on a rampage? More than likely not but a disgruntled parent who is upset with the teachers or going through a custody dispute and is just totally distraught might. Call me a hypocrite if you will, but I do not send my child to a public school. I work in public school and see what's out there. Don't get me wrong, there are some great families and children at my school but they are starting to become the minority. I am tired of us catering to the lowest common denominator and forsaking the good ones. Sorry for the rant, I am just fearful of the world my child in which my child to grow up. I know I can't protect them forever but I would like to as long as I can. I am a child of the 80's and I remember how different(safe) it was. The worst thing we had to worry about was someone being caught with cigarettes or a pocket knife. We need desperately another Reagan..and another Patton. Sorry, I'm done now.
 
#6 ·
This reminds me of that scene in the first Indiana Jones movie where he 'could' have chosen to fight the guy with the scimitar by other means, but just ended up shooting him. Makes sense to me. But at least they're not just training them to lock that door that has the huge glass pane in it and cower in darkness waiting for the worst. So, I guess it's progress.

I'd much prefer that someone be armed, like a LEO, a teacher or other staff member trained for this role, or heck, me! I'd be happy to take a shift at my daughter's school. Not saying this would necessarily be a good idea without some specific training, but...try shooting up a school with a team of armed volunteer parents watching over the kids and see how far that would get.
 
#7 ·
Almost anything is better than blindly screaming, fainting and wilting en masse. Couldn't be any worse than the shooting galleries most such places are right now.

Of course, they could do a whole lot better.
 
#8 ·
Not the best solution, but heck yeah - if my choice were to stand there and give away my life or force the guy to take it the hard way...it's going to be the best of what I've got against whatever he's bringing to the table.
 
#9 ·
I guess it is possible though...when I was a kid I asked my Dad for $5 and I had to listen to a story about him walking to school, in 3 feet of snow, barefoot, uphilll, both ways, and he fought off a grizzly bear with his spiral notebook and a #2 pencil.
 
#11 ·
Ha! My dad walked backwards, uphill, in 5 ft of snow ON HIS HANDS while juggling the bears with his feet! It was only black bears, but there were usually 3 of them.

Sorry, I know I think I'm sooooo amusing...

With what we're seeing the news these days I'm doing what I can to avoid being found drooling and rocking back and forth in a corner. I mean, I want to try to focus on other things like writing letters to my reps, etc., but I find myself staring at the TV saying, "Too....horrible....can't....not...look!"
 
#15 ·
I think it would make more sense to teach them Advanced Scolding Techniques..........Not too harsh, not too soft, just right. If I had children in school, I'd be happy as a clam to know that some of their teachers were armed. Liberal thinking is indeed a form of mental illness. Sort of like children who believe that if they cover their eyes, you can't see them............ Sandpiper
 
#16 ·
The NBC family of stations are the most liberal and egregious at twisting the facts to meet their agenda. Therefore, I find that watching these teachers tackling grown adults who weigh much more and have an agenda truly disturbing. Perhaps I missed it but none of the "perpetrators" resisted during the takedown or after. I have serious doubts that this training will accomplish much. But, most of the liberal/progressive agenda is to make them feel good about something they are doing!!!!!
 
#17 ·
Those were Texas teachers taking that training and it is a start, a good start.

Train them to fight, and once they accept that they will have to fight to defend themselves and their "kids" (every good teacher that I know, including my sons' teachers, consider all of their students their kids), they will realize that using their hands, feet, textbooks, etc... on someone with a gun does not make sense.

Almost all of the teachers that I know will gladly sacrifice their lives for their kids, once they accept that they might have to physically fight for their kids, they will start thinking of better tools to fight with
 
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#19 ·
Personally I think it's a great idea, and while I don't believe it's a "solution" to anything, I think it's a place to start.

The real lesson behind the class is to grasp the concept that the individual is responsible for their safety. This is a huge leap forward, if you think about it. A good number of those folks have probably never considered the actual real possibility of having to even strike someone. Giving them an open opportunity to jump on, punch, kick or whatever to an aggressor, is going to help them adopt a "defensive" mindset.

Think about it this way, you darn sure can't count on any teacher to want the option to arm themselves in their classroom if they don't grasp the fact that "fight" is actually an option for them; they have to learn something besides "flight" first.
 
#24 ·
I think there is definitely merit to teaching the "fight instead of cower" mindset. Once people realize they may have no choice to fight no matter how pacifist they wish they could be, they'll actually pause to think and realize that a firearm is the only reasonable equalizer.
 
#25 ·
I think I agree... I guess it's been illustrated that calling 911 after a whole class is massacred doesn't do any good. Step 1: Take responsibility.

I think the follow-up class should include an airsoft gun. Tackle the guy before he pelts you. Next class... Airsoft for the teachers also.

Baby steps, as they say.
 
#31 ·
At my school, they have implemented a "new plan" which involves the teachers "confronting" the gunman. so far, there is no explanation as to what that means or how we are supposed to implement the plan...
 
#32 ·
As I've said before, I'm a principal in a smaller high school. We have always practiced lockdown drills, and I have empowered my staff to take actions other than cowering in darkened and locked rooms with their kids. That includes escaping the building and counterattacking if somebody enters their room. We have known since Columbine that hiding under tables isn't the answer.

After Columbine, law enforcement changed tactics to rapid entry teams, and if you talk to individual officers, they will tell you that it they arrive alone and hear continuing gunfire many will enter the building alone. Law enforcement has changed their response because what was being done wasn't effective. Schools need to change their response also.

Just yesterday, I attended training provided by DHS that covered school shooting preparation and response. Some of those in the class were teachers and principals, some were law enforcement. The instructor of course talked about restricting access points, lockdown, and barricading of doors. Unlike most training in the past, however, this instructor referred to the ALICE protocol, which includes ESCAPE as one option in response to school violence (Alert, Lockdown, Inform, Counterattack, Escape).

This was a step forward, but when the instructor recommended that at the sound of gunfire principals lock themselves in their office and make themselves small, some of us spoke up. The instructor dismissed the thought that principals would attack a gunman. I told him, I PLAN TO FIGHT! With whatever I have -- improvised weapons, hands, etc. The best weapon is, after all, your brain. I know my school well, and think I cold likely approach a shooter and have a fair chance of tackling them. The average school shooting is over before police can arrive -- we need to buy time for students to lockdown or escape. In almost every school, there are a few sheepdogs who have the fight mentality. Unarmed against a handgun or rifle, my fight may be short, but any delay or distraction of the shooter I can cause gives teachers and students time to escape, and puts the police that much closer.

Unfortunately, most school principals don't think tactically like those of us on this forum. I don't know how to change this, except to continue to do training and planning with them. The daily business of the school is learning and teaching -- it isn't realistic to make every principal a tactical expert, but we can incrementally increase their mental preparation and training.

C Paul Lincoln
 
#35 ·
It's amazing to me that teachers are training to fight back against an attacker, and nobody on this thread has anything to say other than how unrealistic it is, or how worthless it is. Here I would've thought that people would be glad to hear that these teachers want to do something to protect their kids other than hide.
 
#36 ·
I didn't think I said anything was worthless or unrealistic. I thought I suggested something semi-valid and realistic.

There was a High School Principal earlier on this thread who also had some valid ideas (I can't believe I just supported an
administrator who couldn't spell "could" - OK, a semi-LOL because I can't type very well either).
 
#40 ·
I will agree that doing something, anything, to fight back is better than cowering in a corner with pee on the floor waiting to be shot. I just think it is woefully inadequate in the grand scheme of things. Good start maybe, but that's about it.
 
#45 ·
This is just a feel good doing something measure. What will most likely happen is that some teachers are going to get hurt. Train these teachers with a weapon, not their hands. Unless they're a Bruce Lee type, this training is not going to make much of a difference. Hand to hand needs to be a practiced, second nature response. A few classes ain't gonna do it.
 
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