Shotgun Defense

Shotgun Defense

This is a discussion on Shotgun Defense within the General Firearm Discussion forums, part of the Related Topics category; For home defense I use a 1911 w/ JHP's and also beside my bed is a Rem 870. I know from experience that a .45 ...

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Thread: Shotgun Defense

  1. #1
    Senior Member Array tegemu's Avatar
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    Shotgun Defense

    For home defense I use a 1911 w/ JHP's and also beside my bed is a Rem 870. I know from experience that a .45 round will go through the walls of my house and kill my neighbors air conditioner (A $1360.00 case of sheer stupidity several years ago, thank God it was an inanimate object.) That got me thinking of the advisability of using the 1911, any round that misses the target, a very likely occurance in a stressful situation, stands a distinct possibility of taking out a neighbor or someone else in my home. I had 00 Buckshot in my 870 but got to thinking that 00 Buck was not much of an improvemrnt in the way of stray shot. Yesterday I loaded the 870 with #4 Buckshot which I feel makes bystanders safe. I'm soliciting comments on my plan and also on the advisability of putting a short barrel, tube extension and a pistol grip or folding stock on the 870, to make it more usable in the house. Thanx guys.
    People sleep peaceably in their beds at night only because rough men stand ready to do violence in their behalf. - George Orwell


  2. #2
    Senior Member Array MR D's Avatar
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    I use a mossberg pump

    first two are #6 shot

    next three are 00 Buck

    next come the slugs...

    If they are smart enough to run after #6 hits (or misses) then 00 does go through walls with 9 .30 caliber balls, good for when they hide

    and slugs go through walls and most appliances at short range (or stop a car if placed properly)

    this is also verry good for bear country (or so I'm told)

    bear cannot see or smell after hit in face with shot, buck and slugs put heavy, large chunks of lead in the vitals quickly....
    Last edited by MR D; November 9th, 2006 at 04:19 PM. Reason: spelling

  3. #3
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    Quote Originally Posted by tegemu View Post
    For home defense I use a 1911 w/ JHP's and also beside my bed is a Rem 870. I know from experience that a .45 round will go through the walls of my house and kill my neighbors air conditioner (A $1360.00 case of sheer stupidity several years ago, thank God it was an inanimate object.) That got me thinking of the advisability of using the 1911, any round that misses the target, a very likely occurance in a stressful situation, stands a distinct possibility of taking out a neighbor or someone else in my home. I had 00 Buckshot in my 870 but got to thinking that 00 Buck was not much of an improvemrnt in the way of stray shot. Yesterday I loaded the 870 with #4 Buckshot which I feel makes bystanders safe. I'm soliciting comments on my plan and also on the advisability of putting a short barrel, tube extension and a pistol grip or folding stock on the 870, to make it more usable in the house. Thanx guys.
    http://www.theboxotruth.com/docs/bot14.htm

    I doubt seriously that there will be any difference in the ability to penetrate walls between 00 and #4 buckshot.

    As for birdshot, it doesn't penetrate walls but it also doesn't penetrate the BG. He may well bleed out, but he'll have plenty of time to kill you before he does.

    Matt
    Battle Plan (n) - a list of things that aren't going to happen if you are attacked.
    Blame it on Sixto - now that is a viable plan.

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    I have #4 Fedearl Turkey Load in 3" magnums in my HD shotgun. For in house shooting it will rarley penatrate 2 sheets of dry wall. It will also not penatrate deep in a BG. I hope that the wound area results in tramatic shock and knocks said BG down. I do not think that the BG will continue to attack after being shot or shot at with a shotgun no matter what load is being used.

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    Senior Member Array TonyW's Avatar
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    Box O' Truth! That is a great website. Wish they had tested some #4 shot though. I have been debating what to put in my home shotgun too.
    <a target="_top" href="http://www.cybernations.net/default.asp?Referrer=TonyW"><img src="http://i227.photobucket.com/albums/dd188/18932471/imgad2-1.png" border="0"></a>

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    Senior Member Array hsuCowboy98's Avatar
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    As for birdshot, it doesn't penetrate walls but it also doesn't penetrate the BG. He may well bleed out, but he'll have plenty of time to kill you before he does.

    Having been personally peppered by a hunters errant heavy dove load 2 years ago....I can attest that it may not penetrate well but it will cause some severe, if not incapacitating pain.

    However, after that experance, I highly doubt that anyone hit with a full pattern of any size shot in the chest or face at distances of less than 15 yards would be in any condition to mount an effective attack.

    I would say that using small sized shot can be a good way to ensure that over penetration does not take out someone you dont intend to.
    I personally keep the first shell in my 870 police as a BBB steel shot 3'' mag load.

    The rest are 3'' magnum 00 buck though, in case they do feel the need to get up after having 60-100 pellets in their body.
    Fear No Evil.

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    Senior Member Array raysheen's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by hsuCowboy98 View Post
    However, after that experance, I highly doubt that anyone hit with a full pattern of any size shot in the chest or face at distances of less than 15 yards would be in any condition to mount an effective attack.
    dunno if I feel the same way on this one , in planning for a defensive shooting, I always plan for the worst so that would mean that the guy that I shoot will be on some serious drugs and "pain" won't be a stopper...neither will the psychological effect (Oh my! I've been shot!)...so I like to go with a sure and proven penetrating round. For me that is Federal Tactical Reduced Reciol 00 Buck. Though I do certainly see your point...and, in reality, BBB is probably going to work a good percentage of the time for sure!
    ...of course taking that same train of though and planning for the worst, I also have to consider what will happen to those pellets when they hit a wall.
    ...Overall, I think it's a personal choice and I would be comfortable with #4 buck or larger, but that's just me. Ask ten people and you'll get ten different answers!

    in the end, I think that anything that is going to be really effective on humans is going to go through many layers of sheetrock...and even if, in some magical way, it didn't go through a lot of layers of wall, there are still windows to think about....so, for me, the obvious answer is to practice hitting what I aim at so there will be less of a chance of a round that escapes the house.

  8. #8
    New Member Array 1911micro's Avatar
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    buckshot

    You know I always wanted to see what would happen too. A few years ago got a peice of land with an old house falling down on it ( testing time )( be safe wear ear and eye protection) .I took my 1100 with a 20" barrel #4,#6 and 00 at 10 feet all went right through the wall . It didn't slow them down a bit. @ 20 feet 6 shot didn't go through #4 and 00 did. I could only go out to about 24 feet and 00 went right out no stopping it. But I know from pratice that I won't be shooting my wall and the BG will take the blunt of it. so I put 8 00 buck loads and 3 big dogs. I think I'm covered

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    Senior Moderator
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    Quote Originally Posted by raysheen View Post
    so, for me, the obvious answer is to practice hitting what I aim at so there will be less of a chance of a round that escapes the house.
    I'm not worried about what's outside the house, I worry about what's on the other side of the wall in the house. Now my pistol beside the bed is there only to get me to the shotgun in the closet. But the shotgun is the main HD weapon. I'm going to have to get sheet rock and take pictures of my Turkey Load test after Xmas. I'll post them, plus my Canadain father-in-law can help he loves to shoot and never gets the chance in Canada

  10. #10
    Senior Member Array raysheen's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by pgrass101 View Post
    I'm going to have to get sheet rock and take pictures of my Turkey Load test after Xmas. I'll post them, plus my Canadain father-in-law can help he loves to shoot and never gets the chance in Canada
    mmm please do! I always love to see anecdotal data collected like this...it's very informative!!

  11. #11
    Senior Member Array hsuCowboy98's Avatar
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    Ive put the BBB shot through its paces, and it will penetrate at least 2.5 layers of drywall including insulation at 10 feet. The point is that for someone in an apartment or in extremely close proximity to others, or a child on the other side of the house...etc....smaller less penetrating shot may be a good alternative.

    For me, I like having that BBB shot first for 4-legged critters first and fore most, followed by 6 3''magnum 00 buckshot rounds for 2 legged critters. Thats 6x15 pellets....more than enough to stop anything that has lungs and is inside my house.
    Last edited by hsuCowboy98; November 10th, 2006 at 01:01 AM.
    Fear No Evil.

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    VIP Member Array artz's Avatar
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    I use a featherlight 16 ga. Ithaca #37 (24" barrel, I believe), english stock loaded with hi-base #6's. Then its a .357 magnum or .45 para.
    " Refuse to be a victim, make sure there is a round chambered ! "

    Just call me a pessimistic optimist !

    U.S. Navy vet 1981-1992

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    VIP Member Array frankmako's Avatar
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    you could go to the 20 ga shotgun over the 12 ga. not as strong, but will get the job done. at one time there was a company that made a home defense 20 ga pump shotgun, they sold a boat load of them, they were setup well. had all the items that you would want in a home defense shotgun. it was a nice gun, i wish i got one, but i did not, my lost.

  14. #14
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    My 870 serves pretty well - haven't even bothered to change the furniture.

    Usually keep it charged with 3" BB shells - at least that's the designation on the old shells I still have from UK.


    Chris - P95
    NRA Certified Instructor & NRA Life Member.

    "To own a gun and assume that you are armed
    is like owning a piano and assuming that you are a musician!."


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    Senior Member Array Macattack's Avatar
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    Lightbulb

    I currently load my remy 870 with 3" #2,bb,bbb,t shot, and 00 buck for the grand finale. What about the rock salt loads? are those even still around? Or are they "cruel and unusual punishment" Can't help but think a face full of high velocity salt shards would probably slow a bg down pretty quick!
    "In those days, there was a lot more respect for other people and it showed in peoples values.... Today the word value means nothing more than something you get on the $1 menu at McDonald's." -BARK'N

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