Question about giving a gun as a present

This is a discussion on Question about giving a gun as a present within the General Firearm Discussion forums, part of the Related Topics category; Long involved story, if you're not interested in the sappy workings of my family, just skip to the bottom. So my parents live in North ...

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Thread: Question about giving a gun as a present

  1. #1
    Member Array General Geoff's Avatar
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    Question about giving a gun as a present

    Long involved story, if you're not interested in the sappy workings of my family, just skip to the bottom.

    So my parents live in North Carolina, they moved down there about a year and a half ago (I stayed here in PA and bought their house from them). As far as I know, my dad's never owned a gun, though he's stated that he enjoys shooting, and he's gone shooting with me a few times (before he and mom moved). One of the main reasons for that is my mom is a bit anti (she wigged out when I brought my first rifle home, an M44 Mosin Nagant). She's since gotten much more relaxed around guns, I've taught her the basics of firearms safety. In any case, that's the main reason dad's never owned a gun.

    So I just got done talking to dad over the phone, and he mentioned that his boss stopped by his house and gave him a frozen turkey he won at a skeet shooting competition. I jokingly mentioned that he should have entered, he could've gotten more (he's actually a really good shot). He said nah, he doesn't have a shotgun. So I asked him if he'd like one, he said, "nah, I wouldn't have any use for it."

    "But you could go skeet shooting then."

    "Yeah, you're right..."

    "How about I get you one for christmas?"

    "Oh, they're too expensive. Don't worry about it."

    "No seriously, if you'd like one, I'll get it for you. Just make sure mom's ok with it."

    So anyway. I'm gonna get him a Mossberg Maverick 88 8-shot security 12-gauge for christmas. My question: Is there any procedure or anything I have to go through (paperwork, etc) to legally gift a long gun to my father? From what I understand of the law, long guns don't require paperwork but handguns do. Also, when I purchase it, one of the forms has a question asking if I'm purchasing the firearm for myself or someone else (to prevent straw purchases). How would I answer this? My dad is perfectly legal to buy firearms, I'm sure of it. So it wouldn't be a straw purchase, per se. Anyone know what to do/what would happen in this situation? Thanks for any help/info. :)
    Discretion is the better part of valour; and a virtue beyond reproach.
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  3. #2
    Senior Member Array afeazell21's Avatar
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    I don't know the laws where you live but in Texas he would either have to be with you to buy it for the paperwork. Or you would have to give him the money aor a gift card to buy it himself.
    "Dont be afraid to go after what you want to do, and what you want to be. But don't be afraid to be willing to pay the price." - Lane Frost

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    Array SIXTO's Avatar
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    You can gift a firearm to anyone you want, provided they are not a felon.

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    Senior Member Array Joshua M. Smith's Avatar
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    In Indiana a father may give a firearm to a son and vice-versa. Check your local laws.

    Josh <><

  6. #5
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    Heres the offical answer, look in the 'b' section....


    http://www.atf.gov/pub/fire-explo_pu...04/q_and_a.pdf

    My suggestion is to go ahead and buy it locally, have your dealer transfer it to a shop near your dad, and have dad do the 4473 and pick it up from there.

    You can gift a certain number of guns a year, but the out of state stuff gets a bit sticky.

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    Member Array Bando's Avatar
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    You can give a rifle or shotgun to anyone of age with no prior felonies or mental bla bla bla...
    The Problem: When stupid people do stupid things, smart people end up getting killed.

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    Member Array denverd0n's Avatar
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    Uh... Not quite. You can give a gift of a firearm, but there's more to it than just making sure he's not a felon. You have to comply with all of the laws where you live to buy it, shipping it to him, and where he lives to receive it--federal, state, county, city, you have to consider ALL of those laws.

    The good news is that in most places this is not that big of a deal. If you want to send an "assault weapon" to your cousin in California, or a handgun to your brother in Washington, DC, as just two examples, though, you may have some issues. The fact that it is legal for you to buy and own one doesn't make it okay to send one to them.

    In this particular case, though, so long as it is legal for you to buy the gun, and so long as it would be legal for him to buy and own the gun where he lives, there should not be any problems. If you want to ship it to him then it will have to go through an FFL.

  9. #8
    Member Array Bando's Avatar
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    I don't think he is talking about shipping it. Are you?
    The Problem: When stupid people do stupid things, smart people end up getting killed.

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    Senior Member Array purple88yj's Avatar
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    Where in NC is your father?

    Reason I ask is if you are going to ship and he is in my area, you can ship to me and I can take care of the transfer for you. If you lived with in the state, there would be no problems with you gifting the weapon to your father, or any other family realtion. I am not certain about gifts from out of state, but to be covered, if you send it to an FFL dealer, they can do a legal transfer.

  11. #10
    Member Array General Geoff's Avatar
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    Actually I'm planning on driving down and staying with them from the 23rd of December till the first of January, so I can give it to him in person. They live in Garner, NC (about 10 miles northwest of Clayton, and about a mile south of Raleigh). Not sure how far away you are from there, purple88yj.
    Discretion is the better part of valour; and a virtue beyond reproach.
    Pennsylvania Firearm Owners Association

  12. #11
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    If your doing it in person, you can give it to him as if it were a pair of socks.... as long as you have no reason to believe he's not prohibited from having a firearm for some reason.

  13. #12
    Senior Member Array Wayne's Avatar
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    Okay, the law:

    You are allowed to gift a firearm to another as long as you reasonalby know that he/she is not inelible to own (felon, etc.. but you have to reasonably believe that they can own a firearm, if you reasonably believe that they can, and you gift to them, and they can't, you won't be held liable for it).

    If you wanted to ship, then you would have to go through the FFL process, you can send, an FFL on the other end must receive.

    Face to face, it is a gift. You will have to abide by the laws of the state that you are taking the firearm into, that means any foid requirements/registration requirements.

    Since you are going from PA to NC, there are no foid/registration requirements. It all seems kosher to me but do a search on the atf page as well as the states you will be traveling to ensure no laws have changed. Believe me, look at the laws, what was once lawful one week/day, is unlawful the next.

    You are okay to go. The only thing is, if your dad is going to be shooting skeet/birds (clay) then you may want to look into something else other than the mossburg. The shorter barrel will have to be gotten used to and it can be done (Shoot birds/skeet with a 18.5" saiga pump and kick butt at it) but others may lose interest in it (most of your defense shotguns are set to full bore without the option of using a choke/s).

    Hope this helps.

    Wayne

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    Distinguished Member Array LenS's Avatar
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    IANAL, but my read of the BATFE laws/regs are that you can NOT just give a gun (even a long gun) to someone that is NOT a resident of the same state as you are. It's a Fed Felony if I read it correctly. You need to go thru an FFL where your Father takes possession after the 4473 and NICS.

    Any FFL on here know anything differently?
    NRA Instructor

  15. #14
    Senior Member Array Wayne's Avatar
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    LenS,

    I will have to check on that, good point but I think you can still gift due to it's your property until you gift it over. That it is illegal to sell a firearm to another in another state.

    But, I real read it again to make sure. I believe it's some state laws that may cover the gifting of a firearm to someone out of state but I could be wrong.

    I should have said that the person should call the ATF if they aren't sure of the law (federal) and call the states AG for the state that he is going to to gift.

    Wayne

    *will read the ATF regs again, brb.

  16. #15
    Senior Member Array Wayne's Avatar
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    Okay, went and checked, didn't notice but the gifting portion of the law has either been changed or deleted from the ATF homepage. Heck, I didn't even know that they had a FAQ to cover potato guns.

    I would check with the ATF by phone or person if you are near an office. I could very well be wrong by the "good to go" in my previous, previous post and I should have re-read the ATF page before I posted. It used to say that if you own a firearm you could gift it to another in another state if it was face to face. Now it's "clear as mud".

    The reason that I was thinking that a longgun (rifle and shotgun) could be gifted to another is due to you can buy a rifle or shotgun from another state (through an FFL), the restrictions being on handguns.

    I would call the ATF on this one. Since Home Land Security took in the ATF as one of it's branches I've been noticing new laws or regs being put into place that weren't there before. So, as a word to all here, since it seems that the laws/regs are changing without notice, I would ask the ATF directly and not rely on the internet boards for any federal do's and don'ts.

    Wayne

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