Shooting the 03A3 and Marlin 1894P ( PIC HEAVY)

Shooting the 03A3 and Marlin 1894P ( PIC HEAVY)

This is a discussion on Shooting the 03A3 and Marlin 1894P ( PIC HEAVY) within the General Firearm Discussion forums, part of the Related Topics category; I have been on vacation for a few weeks, staying in the woods, tracking deer, and doing alot of shooting. I do this every year ...

Results 1 to 12 of 12
Like Tree12Likes
  • 7 Post By glockman10mm
  • 1 Post By ccw9mm
  • 2 Post By glockman10mm
  • 2 Post By glockman10mm

Thread: Shooting the 03A3 and Marlin 1894P ( PIC HEAVY)

  1. #1
    VIP Member Array glockman10mm's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Location
    Kentucky
    Posts
    8,923

    Shooting the 03A3 and Marlin 1894P ( PIC HEAVY)

    I have been on vacation for a few weeks, staying in the woods, tracking deer, and doing alot of shooting. I do this every year to test loads in different calibers for all types of platforms, long guns and handguns. So far, the past couple of weeks I have blown thru almost 2000 primers and several pounds of powder and different bullets.

    I also take this time to prepare for deer season, which is also a testing ground for various calibers and bullet types. This year, I hope to take one with the 45acp using the Hornady XTP, and start a thread with complete info and pics of bullet performance and damage to the internal organs.

    The last few days has been the most interesting so far. Last night I put together some 30 06 loads for the Smith Corona. For those not familiar with this rifle, it was used From WW1 and was replaced by the Garand in WW2, but still saw service thru Korea and even limited use in Vietnam.
    This particular rifle was given to me by a friend who was a Marine Capt, and has been retired for 30 years. The stock was sporterized before it became mine.


    Using a handload of 47 grains of H380 under a Hornady 165 SP bullet, my goal was a relatively mild all purpose round to load up in bulk and have on hand for whatever was needed. I chose H380 because; #1, I had only a limited amount of IMR 4064 and 4831, and wanted to save it, and #2, I had never tried H380 and had a pound of it, so I thought it would be good knowledge to add to my library of load data.

    I also loaded 5 rounds with the same powder and charge with a 150 weight Sierra FP made for a 30-30, just to see how it would perform.

    Heres my grouping at 50 yards with the Hornady 165 SP loads.
    URL=http://s1183.photobucket.com/user/glockman10mm/media/photo_zpsd9b94fc7.jpg.html][/URL]
    The target is only a 1.5 inch dot, so with the very skinny front sight, I was happy with these results.

    Moving back to the 100 yard distance, once again iI was satisfied with the results using only military iron sights, and using a powder bullet combo not known for the best 30 06 accuracy. I used a 3 inch target at 100 yards, but surely this rifle has potential left in it.



    My target at 100 yards.


    I thought this would be a good time to try the rounds loaded with the 30-30 bullets, and see how they shot in comparison to the 165 grain Hornady SSP bullets. The circled rounds show the impact of the 30-30 bullets. My POI change between the two was negligible.


    Notice the difference in bullets used specifically for the 30-30 compared to standard rifle bullets such as the 165 grn SSP.
    I seated them both to the same depth.
    URL=http://s1183.photobucket.com/user/glockman10mm/media/photo_zps76257001.jpg.html][/URL]

    Extremely satisfied with the early results of this load testing, and concluding that this rifle has alot of potential, I decided to move on to another favorite rifle; the Marlin 1894P with 16 inch barrel and compact 4x Burris scope.


    The load was a healthy dose of 2400 under a 240 grain XTP. After 3 shots, the test at 50 yards was over.


    And so today was great! I learned a few new things to document and add to my library of load data, and had alot of fun with two of my favorite rifles.
    Now days, you can buy fancier, higher tech guns, that hold more rounds, and are good shooters. But there is nothing more satisfying than to wrap your hands around a powerful, well made relic of the past, and take it out and shoot them, knowing they can still do the job they were designed for and then some!
    Ignorance is a long way from stupid, but left unchecked, can get there real fast.


  2. #2
    Distinguished Member Array 5lima30ret's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2013
    Location
    Mountains of Western North Carolina
    Posts
    1,391
    Good shooting! I think you have some winners! I have always loved those 1894 carbines! That 1894 would make a decent home defense gun as well. Enjoy!
    Retired Police Lieutenant, Retired USAF Reserve, Glock Armorer, NC CWP, HR-218 Qualified
    Second generation American, Third generation Legionnaire
    "I can do all things through Christ who strengthens me" Phil 4:13

  3. #3
    OD*
    OD* is online now
    Moderator
    Array OD*'s Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2005
    Location
    Coopersville
    Posts
    11,265
    Excellent job!
    "The pistol, learn it well, carry it always ..." ~ Jeff Cooper

    "Terrorists: They hated you yesterday, they hate you today, and they will hate you tomorrow. End the cycle of hatred, don’t give them a tomorrow."

  4. #4
    Moderator
    Array bmcgilvray's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2007
    Location
    Texas
    Posts
    10,098
    What a nice thread!

    What a great place to hole up and shoot. Trees! Green!

    It's heartwarming to see the gift '03A3 which obviously has a lot of life and use yet in it, if the targets are any indication. Can't really come up with anything that really has much more to offer than that rifle.

    The Marlin with that particular scope sounds really practical and useful.
    Charter Member of the DC .41 LC Society

    “No possible rapidity of fire can atone for habitual carelessness of aim with the first shot.”

    Theodore Roosevelt, The Wilderness Hunter, 1893

  5. #5
    Moderator
    Array gasmitty's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2007
    Location
    Gilbert, AZ
    Posts
    10,569
    Wish I would use my time off so productively!

    All interesting, but I found the comparison of the FP .30-30 rounds with the 165 SPs particularly interesting. I think your results are pretty clear evidence that at decent rifle velocities, ballistic coefficient is a second-decimal place effect up to 100 yards, possibly more.

    And that 50-yard group with the .44... simply awesome!
    Smitty
    NRA Endowment Member

  6. #6
    VIP Member
    Array oneshot's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2009
    Location
    +42.893612,-082.710236 , Mi.
    Posts
    8,187
    Quote Originally Posted by bmcgilvray View Post
    What a nice thread!

    What a great place to hole up and shoot. Trees! Green!

    It's heartwarming to see the gift '03A3 which obviously has a lot of life and use yet in it, if the targets are any indication. Can't really come up with anything that really has much more to offer than that rifle.

    The Marlin with that particular scope sounds really practical and useful.
    Quote Originally Posted by gasmitty View Post
    Wish I would use my time off so productively!

    All interesting, but I found the comparison of the FP .30-30 rounds with the 165 SPs particularly interesting. I think your results are pretty clear evidence that at decent rifle velocities, ballistic coefficient is a second-decimal place effect up to 100 yards, possibly more.

    And that 50-yard group with the .44... simply awesome!
    ^^^^YEP^^^^^^^^^^

    I too wish I could/would spend my off time doing this, but alas,,, family concerns/vacations up N. have the priority currently.

    Still take enough time to get out in the woods and hunt during Oct./Nov/Dec. and some turkey hunting in the spring, and some walleye fishing in the spring/summer months so all is not lost I suppose.

    Great shooting/handloading glockman.
    For iron sights, the bolt action warhorse is still doing its job very effectively.
    If you want to make God laugh, tell him your plans.

    Washington didn't use his freedom of speech to defeat the British, He shot them!

    Politics is the art of looking for trouble, finding it whether it exists or not, diagnosing it incorrectly, and applying the wrong remedy." -- Ernest Benn

  7. #7
    VIP Member Array ccw9mm's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2006
    Location
    USA
    Posts
    27,050
    Hard not to like a nice Marlin 1894P .44mag, or a Winchester Trapper .44mag. IMO it's the perfect format and caliber. Light, compact, hard-hitting, accurate as anything else with a bit of practice and the "right" sights (for the eyes of the shooter). Gotta love 'em.

    Nice to see someone enjoying the simple pleasures of the 1894P.
    bmcgilvray likes this.
    Your best weapon is your brain. Don't leave home without it.
    Thoughts: Justifiable self defense (A.O.J.).
    Explain: How does disarming victims reduce the number of victims?
    Reason over Force: The Gun is Civilization (Marko Kloos).
    NRA, SAF, GOA, OFF, ACLDN.

  8. #8
    VIP Member Array glockman10mm's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Location
    Kentucky
    Posts
    8,923
    Quote Originally Posted by gasmitty View Post
    Wish I would use my time off so productively!

    All interesting, but I found the comparison of the FP .30-30 rounds with the 165 SPs particularly interesting. I think your results are pretty clear evidence that at decent rifle velocities, ballistic coefficient is a second-decimal place effect up to 100 yards, possibly more.

    And that 50-yard group with the .44... simply awesome!
    Well, there have been some minor glitches in my time off, such as lawn care, honey-dos and such distractions that a man must suffer:)

    Yes, I was quite pleased with the FP bullets performance. I am now interested to see how they perform on game. The only issue I can see is they are designed to work at velocities up to 2100 fps and less. I believe I am getting between 2400 and 2600 fps.
    ( I didn't bring the chrono because it initially looked like rain when I left for the range).
    So that's an educated guesstimate.

    So would I have a deer grenade with that load? We will find out during gun season.

    The little Marlin is no surprise. I have killed many deer with it. Although I haven't used it in several years, it was pleasing to see it is still dead on with my loads where I left it several years back.
    bmcgilvray and OD* like this.
    Ignorance is a long way from stupid, but left unchecked, can get there real fast.

  9. #9
    VIP Member
    Array OldVet's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2009
    Location
    S. Florida, north of the Miami mess, south of the Mouse trap
    Posts
    16,505
    Glockman10mm, I did extensive testing with my Rem 700 .30-06 while in Alaska, and similar to you, I found that my best accuracy and overall performance came with 165 grain bullets. I settled on 4064 and Sierra 165 grain SPBTs for the longer range shots and it has never let me down. Perhaps 165 grains is the "sweet spot" for the .30-06?
    Retired USAF E-8. Lighten up and enjoy life because:
    Paranoia strikes deep, into your heart it will creep. It starts when you're always afraid... "For What It's Worth" Buffalo Springfield

  10. #10
    VIP Member Array glockman10mm's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Location
    Kentucky
    Posts
    8,923
    Quote Originally Posted by OldVet View Post
    Glockman10mm, I did extensive testing with my Rem 700 .30-06 while in Alaska, and similar to you, I found that my best accuracy and overall performance came with 165 grain bullets. I settled on 4064 and Sierra 165 grain SPBTs for the longer range shots and it has never let me down. Perhaps 165 grains is the "sweet spot" for the .30-06?
    I would say you were exactly right. And it's kind of ironic that the US Army Ordnance Dept found the 173 grain bullet the best choice for the rifle.

    Going into it, my first instinct was to go with 4831, and 4064, as these two are THEE 30 06 and 270Winny powders for top accuracy. But I had a limited supply of it, so, after looting around, I found the H380 I had purchased for use with a 257 Roberts, but never used. So I thought, what the hell, if I can find any load data on it, I'll try it.
    I was surprised that my Lyman 47th had data for it , AND, H335, which is usually a better small bore powder.

    The accuracy with a 165 weight bullet, I have found given the general twist rates of 30 caliber sporting rifles, is never a suspect of bad or sub par accuracy. It's the powder.

    And mediocre accuracy is what I have with these particular loads in this rifle. But only because I know I can shoot better. But by how much with the sighting system and aging eyes?
    Would it be worth the effort to put together some loads with extruded powders?

    For all practical purposes, no. In reality, the accuracy I achieved on this first outing and hand loading experiment has practical accuracy out to much further than anyone has any business shooting game, let alone see it.
    So I think I'll just leave it alone.

    Sorry about the rambling on, lol. I was actually doing some out loud thinking.
    bmcgilvray and gasmitty like this.
    Ignorance is a long way from stupid, but left unchecked, can get there real fast.

  11. #11
    VIP Member
    Array OldVet's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2009
    Location
    S. Florida, north of the Miami mess, south of the Mouse trap
    Posts
    16,505
    I also noticed that COL had a greater effect on accuracy than minute adjustments in powder loads. My best loads were long, too long to fit some other makes, and just shy of contacting the lands. They had to be handled a bit carefully as the bullets were seated so shallow they could be pulled out by hand. Part of the fun of reloading one's own medicine.
    Retired USAF E-8. Lighten up and enjoy life because:
    Paranoia strikes deep, into your heart it will creep. It starts when you're always afraid... "For What It's Worth" Buffalo Springfield

  12. #12
    VIP Member Array glockman10mm's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Location
    Kentucky
    Posts
    8,923
    Quote Originally Posted by OldVet View Post
    I also noticed that COL had a greater effect on accuracy than minute adjustments in powder loads. My best loads were long, too long to fit some other makes, and just shy of contacting the lands. They had to be handled a bit carefully as the bullets were seated so shallow they could be pulled out by hand. Part of the fun of reloading one's own medicine.
    We must be drinking the same thing, because once again I whole heartedly agree. As a matter of fact, one thing I always do while working up loads for a new gun, or new loads using a drastically different bullet weight for an old gun is to make a dummy round and using a black marker to color the bullet, and adjust depth until the lands and grooves start to touch the bullet.

    It doesn't always give the best results initially, but its a great starting point.

    Another plus with this method, is it usually makes the OAL a little longer than listed in the manual, and if it doesn't interfere with feeding, gives a little margin for error when working up near full pressure loads by providing just a little more " breathing room" between the powder and bullet base.

    So yeah, you are dead on with your experience. It's the first place I start to make load adjustments for accuracy, as long as velocity is within desired limits.

    Speaking of accuracy, I use to spend countless hours making adjustments to get the very best accuracy I could. Not anymore. I hand load rifles for hunting, and have come to realize that in my neck of the woods, 2 or 3 inches is as good as 1 or even 1/2 inch when the kill zone is paper plate sized.

    But it's nice to know how to tweak it if you want to:)
    Ignorance is a long way from stupid, but left unchecked, can get there real fast.

Links

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  

Search tags for this page

03a3 practical hunting rifle
,
1894 p marlin
,
1894p marlin
,

marlin 1894p

,
marlin 1894p forum
,
photo's/of/marlin/1894p
Click on a term to search for related topics.

» Log in

User Name:

Password:

Not a member yet?
Register Now!

» DefensiveCarry Sponsors