Facebook posting says the gun-rich Swiss have lowest firearm crime rate in world

Facebook posting says the gun-rich Swiss have lowest firearm crime rate in world

This is a discussion on Facebook posting says the gun-rich Swiss have lowest firearm crime rate in world within the General Firearm Discussion forums, part of the Related Topics category; Interesting article. As always it is difficult to seperate the fact from the 'slant' so it will take some time for me to digest some ...

Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast
Results 1 to 15 of 27
Like Tree45Likes

Thread: Facebook posting says the gun-rich Swiss have lowest firearm crime rate in world

  1. #1
    Member Array gfrlaser's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2014
    Location
    Dayton, Ohio
    Posts
    38

    Facebook posting says the gun-rich Swiss have lowest firearm crime rate in world

    Interesting article. As always it is difficult to seperate the fact from the 'slant' so it will take some time for me to digest some of the stats. I was wondering if anyone else had an opinion or have seen any other posts regarding this article.


    Gun control advocates say that fewer guns mean less gun crime. But a Dec. 16 posting on Facebook by a group calling itself the Conservatives Club argues exactly the opposite, and uses the example set by Switzerland to prove its point.

    Full article.....

    Facebook posting says the gun-rich Swiss have the lowest firearm crime rate in the civilized world | PolitiFact Rhode Island
    gatorbait51 and Tinman517 like this.


  2. #2
    Senior Member Array vice87's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2013
    Location
    Oregon
    Posts
    530
    but but but, everything on the internet is the truth!!
    It's December 1941 in Casablanca, what time is it in New York?

  3. #3
    Member Array highorder's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2012
    Location
    Cincinnati
    Posts
    31
    The Swiss do not share our racially charged history. It's that simple.

  4. #4
    Distinguished Member Array Hoganbeg's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2010
    Location
    Washington State
    Posts
    1,515
    So it's all a matter of race? It is not simple at all. Keep in mind that correlation is not causation, and there are other factors involved in crime that have nothing to do with weapons. Education is one of them, and the list goes on.

  5. #5
    VIP Member Array maxwell97's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2013
    Location
    Minnesota
    Posts
    3,410
    I've read the stats before, and it's true. Switzerland (with lots of guns) has a murder rate of 0.7 per 100,000, compared to England (with no guns) at 1.2 and the US (with lots of guns) at 5.0.

    It doesn't prove that more guns means less crime. It does prove that fewer guns does not mean LESS crime.
    "Yet this government never of itself furthered any enterprise, but by the alacrity with which it got out of the way... The character inherent in the American people has done all that has been accomplished; and it would have done somewhat more, if the government had not sometimes got in its way."

  6. #6
    Distinguished Member
    Array RickyD's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2013
    Location
    North Georgia
    Posts
    1,890
    Comparing different cultures that have different socio-economic environments, eduction levels, histories, language, etc. is an extremely difficult thing. The way crime is measured or even defined can vary. We might be able to make some large assumptions if we had complete data sets, but looking at one statistic in a vacuum does not provide enough information for either side to really use.

    Incidentally, the article has a clear anti-2A bias and they selected certain facts to use to support their case as well.

  7. #7
    Member Array LouisianaMan's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Location
    Baton Rouge, LA
    Posts
    385
    I didn't read the article, but the Swiss have had a militia army for many decades now and have never had a violent crime problem. IIRC their population just passed a referendum sustaining mandatory military conscription. It has long since been the basis of that country's military posture, and the universality of service has long ingrained in the Swiss that they are free, equal citizens in a free country, and are "in it together." Despots since Napoleon, Hitler and Stalin have looked, then turned away rather than tackle 600,000 or so armed men who could be mobilized within 24-48 hours. Greener pastures elsewhere!

    I was stationed in Germany in the '80's, and enjoyed taking the train through Switzerland. Guys in uniform, packs worn with helmet strapped on the back, rifles slung over their shoulders, going to and from reserve duty and training. Government-issued ammo was kept at home, and reservists qualified on a certain schedule with their assigned weapon which was kept at home and inspected on a regular basis. As men grew older, their year groups were reassigned to support units and service support units, and in the final years of their part-time military service they were assigned static guard duties, etc.

    I clearly remember hearing the popping of a rifle range--I looked out of the train window and a short distance away was the firing line, where reservists were banging away for their scheduled qualification exercises. Younger guys wore camo and carried (real) assault rifles, and older year groups wore earlier patterns of equipment and carried K-31 bolt actions.

    Our colonial militia companies and "Minutemen" were the closest we've had to such a generalized system of "providing for the common defense," and the 2nd Amendment specifically exhorted Americans to be armed with efficient weapons, and to be able to use them efficiently. Their way of expressing this was to call for a "well-regulated militia," as various colonies had experienced the decay of their militia systems from the 1600's through the 1700's. When the eventual call came to defend the region and/or country from French, Indians, British, or whomever, responsible citizens didn't want chuckleheads showing up with grandpa's broken matchlock, arguing about who owed military service this go-round, what units would be organized and officers elected, and generally comprise a half-armed, disorganized mob unable to pull their weight as a military force.

    It was also VERY clearly understood that the "old countries" of Europe kept guns in government armories, where mere subjects of the crown had no right to access efficient weapons. So when the king or lord sent around his army to collect taxes, dragoon conscripts into the army, etc., the subjects could just damn well take cap in hand and comply with the commands of their "betters."

    Anybody who looks at our history, the development of our Constitution and Bill of Rights, and reads the words of the individual right expressed specifically in the 2A, cannot--CANNOT--conclude that the Federal and/or state governments were intended to keep the firearms in this country. If they do, they're willfully blind or should apply for a tuition refund at the very least.

  8. #8
    VIP Member Array Kennydale's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2013
    Location
    Richmond/Rosenberg, TX
    Posts
    3,686
    swiss-guns-and-bikes-85530937385.jpeg

    Picture is worth a thousand words !
    BurgerBoy, VBVAGUY and Navydude like this.
    G-d, Make me fast and accurate. Let my aim be true and my hand faster than those who would seek to destroy me. And G-d if today is truly the day you call me home, then let me die in a pile of empty brass.

  9. #9
    VIP Member Array Ghost1958's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2012
    Location
    Kentucky
    Posts
    6,031
    Even their cheese has bullet holes in it
    " It is sad governments are chief'ed by the double tongues." quote Ten Bears Movie Outlaw Josie Wales

  10. #10
    VIP Member Array suntzu's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2011
    Location
    TX/NH
    Posts
    5,882
    If you guys read about Swiss gun laws I doubt you would agree they are much friendlier than most of the US
    wdbailey likes this.
    Then I heard the voice of the Lord saying, “Whom shall I send? And who will go for us?”
    And I said, “Here am I. Send me!”

    Isaiah 6:8

  11. #11
    VIP Member
    Array Jeanlouise's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2012
    Location
    Almost Heaven
    Posts
    2,169
    I bet if the Swiss had the societal challenges we do, it would be a very different story as to the amount of gun related crime.
    LouisianaMan and suntzu like this.
    It may be that your sole purpose in life is simply to serve as a warning to others.

    http://www.timeanddate.com/countdown...eaves%20office

  12. #12
    Member Array LouisianaMan's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Location
    Baton Rouge, LA
    Posts
    385
    Quote Originally Posted by suntzu View Post
    If you guys read about Swiss gun laws I doubt you would agree they are much friendlier than most of the US
    As for me, I wasn't proposing that we model our gun laws after the Swiss example. Having lived in Germany for 7 years, I'm sure the Swiss have a suffocating bureaucracy about guns & much else.

    My intended point was to highlight the fact that they have GI automatic weapons and ammo in practically every household, yet there are zero socially negative consequences--IMO, Jeanlouise has pointed towards the exact reasons why.

  13. #13
    VIP Member Array maxwell97's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2013
    Location
    Minnesota
    Posts
    3,410
    The point to take away is that it proves the falsehood of the big anti assumption: that if you have a lot of guns in people's hands, it's obvious and natural that they'll use them to murder each other.

    They define a civilized society, partially, as one without guns. I would define it, partially, as a society where people have guns and don't use them against each other.

    By either standard, DC, LA, Chicago and Detroit are savage places.
    "Yet this government never of itself furthered any enterprise, but by the alacrity with which it got out of the way... The character inherent in the American people has done all that has been accomplished; and it would have done somewhat more, if the government had not sometimes got in its way."

  14. #14
    Distinguished Member Array David Armstrong's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2004
    Location
    SW Louisiana
    Posts
    1,746
    Quote Originally Posted by maxwell97 View Post
    The point to take away is that it proves the falsehood of the big anti assumption: that if you have a lot of guns in people's hands, it's obvious and natural that they'll use them to murder each other.
    Not really, not any more than the fact that gun-rich areas in the U.S. tend to have higher murder rates tends to prove the truism that guns lead to crime. Never confuse correlation with causation, particularly when the correlation is contradictory. Cross-cultural comparisons of anything are always very tricky.

  15. #15
    Ex Member
    Array 1 old 0311's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2010
    Location
    Earth
    Posts
    2,429
    The Swiss also have more shooting ranges per cap-a than any other country.

Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast

Links

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  

» Log in

User Name:

Password:

Not a member yet?
Register Now!

» DefensiveCarry Sponsors