Overheating?

Overheating?

This is a discussion on Overheating? within the General Firearm Discussion forums, part of the Related Topics category; I tried a quick search but couldn't find any info along these lines: Question - can one overheat a semiauto pistol such as an M&P? ...

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  1. #1
    Distinguished Member Array brocktice's Avatar
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    Overheating?

    I tried a quick search but couldn't find any info along these lines:

    Question - can one overheat a semiauto pistol such as an M&P?

    Today I took the M&P 9c and put about 400 rounds through it. The range available to me at the moment is not very sophisticated and so I'm just trying to do round after round into a small target area.

    After I started firing fairly quickly (about 0.5-1s between rounds, 17 rounds + mag change + 17 rounds), the gun started to FTF. A slap on the back of the slide would get it back into battery. I thought it might be ammo, because I switched ammo during the outing, but that didn't seem to make a significant difference. I used 4 different brands over the course of the outing. The gun got quite hot, to where I couldn't touch the front half of the slide for more than a second or so.

    Someone else showed up at the range and I talked with him for a bit, and went back to shooting. No FTFs. The gun had cooled down.

    Could the heat have been the issue? How much is too much for a gun like that?
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    VIP Member Array WrongRecroom's Avatar
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    About the only guns I ever heard with the pharse overheating was Full auto guns ... I mean I have seen Slidfire AK dump a drum mag to the point of the handguards catching fire near abouts but the gun keep trucking

    To me about the only issue I could think of whith over heating is either the round cooking off pre firing as it is so hot or if steel case etc the laquer or other coating gumming up the works


    This is odd ...
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    VIP Member Array WrongRecroom's Avatar
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    Ah hah

    "Jeff

    Please keep us posted what S&W finds out what is causing the FTEs.

    I agree 2% FTE is unacceptable. I traded my Beretta Nano for my Shield when I was experiencing a 2% FTE rate.

    I am going to disagree with the lube posts.

    Lube is to extend the life of the weapon by reducing friction between moving parts.

    If I drained all the oil from my automobile and flushed with mineral spirits to ensure the moving parts are bone dry of all lube will the car start? Yes and it will operate until the moving parts overheat due to friction which for my brother who ran his truck dry of oil due to stupidity was pretty quick but my point is the truck still managed to start when dry and your ccw should go bang enough times bone dry without failure if your life depended upon it.

    In the real world I will go 6 weeks without lube on my Shield and factoring in 10 hours per day at 100 degrees in my pocket the cheap lube I use is pretty much evaporated. I try to squirt some spray lube before a range visit but at times I forget but she still works just fine and if she didn't I would sell the gun if it didn't operate without lube.


    Russ" ?

    Maybe too tight a gun and a lot of friction ??? M&P Shield 9 Failure To Extract (3)
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    Distinguished Member Array brocktice's Avatar
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    My only thought is that the parts could have expanded from being hot and messed up the tolerances.
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    Distinguished Member Array Recon1342's Avatar
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    It's good to "see" you again, Brock.

    Yes, excessive heat can cause malfunctions. It depends greatly on tolerances, lube, steel quality and a myriad of other factors. In rifles, too much heat can ruin a barrel in less time than you'd imagine. I suspect handguns play by slightly different rules due to amount of powder, velocity, and pressure. Just some food for thought.
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    Distinguished Member Array brocktice's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Recon1342 View Post
    It's good to "see" you again, Brock.
    Thanks, I've been insanely busy and haven't had time for any of my favorite forums, including DC. Good to be back.
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    I am not familiar with the M&P but if it is running very tight tolerances that amount of heat may cause it to seize up.
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    Senior Member Array Pete63's Avatar
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    Brock, I too was concerned you hadn't posted since Febuary ( I checked!). Missed your good input. Not to familiar with the M&P, so you might try a clean & re-lube (even switch to grease if you're using oil). Have to agree though if it won't run when HOT & dry, I would be concerned about continued reliability. I have switched to a synthetic grease on a none carry, but haven't run it through the wringer yet, so can't say this is a viable option. Will have to see when I can get to a place that allows extream rapid fire. FYI, it's an XD, so wouldn't answer your original question anyway. Keep us posted.
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    VIP Member Array maxwell97's Avatar
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    I don't think insufficient lubrication is likely to impact overheating. It will certainly generate heat, but little compared to the heat from the combustion of the powder.

    I'm not too familiar with how it works with firearms, but I'd suspect this could be caused by expansion of the barrel causing it to fit tightly where it locks up with the slide. I guess lube could play a role here; the presence of lubricant would make it more resistant to this.
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    Quote Originally Posted by brocktice View Post
    My only thought is that the parts could have expanded from being hot and messed up the tolerances.
    I'd list that as most probable cause. Reduced clearances and a dearth of lube = increased friction, like riding your thumb on the slide.

    Here in the AZ heat I use Slide Glide (medium weight) on slide rails and other parts that slide against each other (like barrel-to-barrel bushing) simply because oils don't last in the the heat. Parts that rotate still get oil.
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    Senior Member Array sammeow's Avatar
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    Hmmm, firing that many rounds that quickly with ftf's point to possible user error.
    It happens from overheating. Not the pistol but the grip/wrist.
    Try it again with concentration to your grip and see if history repeats its self.

  12. #12
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    You'd expect a super tight bullseye 1911 to act up firing that many rounds and getting that hot. Not an M&P. I'm not familiar enough with the interior of the M&P to venture a guess. Generally speaking the modern polymer handguns have generous tolerances to keep working. Frame to slide to barrel fit should not be effected by the heat in any noticeable manner.

    My best guess is the main spring's tension might have been effected.

    The next question would be is this indicative of the model or just a single example.
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    I would have lubed the barrel and tried again. I didn't see where you mentioned what lube you use, but it could have burned off, allowing increased friction.
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    I'm not sure what the M&P is rated at for maximum rate of fire, but you may have figured it out.
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  15. #15
    Senior Member Array CR Williams's Avatar
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    Failure to feed? Top of the head possibilities include: Getting tired without noticing and limp-wristing/loose-gripping; lubrication cooking/drying off causing enough friction to matter (or crud building up from shooting as much as you did); possible magazine problem; heating affecting tolerances.

    If I had to assign probabilities...(scratches head, counts on fingers)...

    1, 3, 2, 4 to check in about that order.

    If you come up with something definite, let us know. This is an interesting question.
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