Another of my half-baked ideas...Legal Defense Fund?

Another of my half-baked ideas...Legal Defense Fund?

This is a discussion on Another of my half-baked ideas...Legal Defense Fund? within the General Firearm Discussion forums, part of the Related Topics category; This came to me out of nowhere this morning. I know that I'd be hard pressed to come up with the cash to pay for ...

Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast
Results 1 to 15 of 16

Thread: Another of my half-baked ideas...Legal Defense Fund?

  1. #1
    VIP Member Array Cupcake's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    Michigan
    Posts
    3,164

    Lightbulb Another of my half-baked ideas...Legal Defense Fund?

    This came to me out of nowhere this morning. I know that I'd be hard pressed to come up with the cash to pay for a lawyer if I ever had to do the deed.

    Luckily, the statistics indicate that I won't. That said, with 10,000 members here, one of us might.

    Perhaps everyone could donate $10 or $20 bucks to a fund that sits, collecting interest, until a contributing member needs it. I don't know how we would keep it from being used to defend someone that decides to shoot out a tailgaiters' tires.

    I also wouldn't want members to feel emboldened by knowing they have a lawyer to help. Maybe the members could vote for each case?

    Like I said, half-baked. I have to go to work now, maybe I'll let it bake some more.

    Peace out

    Lloyd
    Spend few minutes learning about my journey from Zero to Athlete in this
    Then check out my blog! www.BodyByMcDonalds.com

    Cupcake - 100 pound loser, adventurer, Ironman Triathlete.


  2. #2
    Distinguished Member Array Bob The Great's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2006
    Location
    Slidell, LA
    Posts
    1,688
    interesting concept. I think the main worry is who would actually have access to the money. I'm sure the mod team here are all great people, but even so, I've never met them in person, and as such, I don't know if I would want to be depending on a pool of money that they manage. Nothing against them, for sure, it's just a personal policy of mine not to get financially entagled with people I don't know.

    Then of course, any prosecuter would be able to dig up the fact that you are basically paying into "shooting insurance" and maybe use that against you somehow. But they'll do that anyway.

    What happens when only 50 members contribute? There's no way to guarantee that everyone will chip in, and if not, you might as well stick with financing your own lawyer.

    Legal fees are certainly an issue, but I think there are other ways to handle the situation. Similar ideas have been tried at a car forum I moderate, and they never quite get off the ground.

  3. #3
    Moderator
    Array RETSUPT99's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2006
    Location
    Central Florida
    Posts
    44,843
    Quote Originally Posted by Bob The Great View Post
    ...Then of course, any prosecuter would be able to dig up the fact that you are basically paying into "shooting insurance" and maybe use that against you somehow. But they'll do that anyway.

    ...What happens when only 50 members contribute? There's no way to guarantee that everyone will chip in, and if not, you might as well stick with financing your own lawyer.
    The prosecuter WILL do that anyway, you're correct.
    Possibly, only the 50 members who contribute 'X' amount would benefit...but even at that, this type of program would require many legal hoops and tremendous oversite of fund uses...(Probably, taken over by the mob... )

    Two things that would be important? Having a Castle Doctrine in your state (only helps, IN your state), and a small fund for an attorney that you have already talked with...

    OMO

    ret
    The last Blood Moon Tetrad for this millennium starts in April 2014 and ends in September 2015...according to NASA.

    ***********************************
    Certified Glock Armorer
    NRA Life Member[/B]

  4. #4
    VIP Member Array artz's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2006
    Location
    Georgia
    Posts
    2,351
    good idea !
    " Refuse to be a victim, make sure there is a round chambered ! "

    Just call me a pessimistic optimist !

    U.S. Navy vet 1981-1992

  5. #5
    Senior Member Array PapaScout's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2006
    Location
    Indiana
    Posts
    569
    I'm in. Bumper could be Custodian and those that contribute a fixed amount ($20 to keep it fair to all) vote on paying out if needed.
    "If you so much as bunny hop I'll cut your heart out!" Billy Bob Thornton in The Last Real Cowboys

    "I carry a gun for the same reason that I carry health insurance and a cell phone - be prepared."

  6. #6
    VIP Member Array ccw9mm's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2006
    Location
    USA
    Posts
    27,083
    On a national scale, there are already two options: the NRA, and the pro bono work of attorneys. Though, only near innocence will move those two "funds" and even that's not guaranteed. I do like the idea of the NRA changing it's membership forms to have a little check box, whereby someone can donate $10 / $20 / $30 to this fund. But, as suggested above, financial controls would need to be in place to ensure that didn't get used and abused.
    Your best weapon is your brain. Don't leave home without it.
    Thoughts: Justifiable self defense (A.O.J.).
    Explain: How does disarming victims reduce the number of victims?
    Reason over Force: The Gun is Civilization (Marko Kloos).
    NRA, SAF, GOA, OFF, ACLDN.

  7. #7
    Member Array critterhog's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2006
    Location
    Kansas
    Posts
    390
    Quote Originally Posted by retsupt99 View Post
    but even at that, this type of program would require many legal hoops and tremendous oversite of fund uses...(Probably, taken over by the mob... )


    Quote Originally Posted by retsupt99 View Post
    Two things that would be important? Having a Castle Doctrine in your state (only helps, IN your state), and a small fund for an attorney that you have already talked with...

    OMO

    ret
    This is a good idea. Not only would you have some funds set aside for yourself. But most importantly you would have repore with an attorney already. Otherwise if god forbid you do need legal rep., you try finding someone quick in the phone book. That attorney my not be 2A friendly.
    Friendship... is not something you learn in school. But if you haven't learned the meaning of friendship, you really haven't learned anything.
    Muhammad Ali

  8. #8
    Distinguished Member Array Colin's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2006
    Location
    Vancouver, Canada
    Posts
    1,863
    We have 2 firearm associations up here and they have helped people fighting bad gun laws. I would have thought that membership with the NRA would provide some coverage for certain types of lawsuits or court cases?

  9. #9
    Ron
    Ron is offline
    Distinguished Member Array Ron's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2006
    Location
    West Linn, Oregon
    Posts
    1,628
    One potential issue is who would be the attorneys. Since we probably have members from every state, you would need to have located experienced CCW attorneys in every state where you had a participating member and made prior arrangements with those attorneys regarding fees, etc. And each time a new member joined up, someone would need to see if we already had an attorney signed up for that state. Not impossible, but a major task.

    Ron

  10. #10
    Senior Member Array raysheen's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2005
    Location
    Maine, USA
    Posts
    793
    We have something similar on another forum for which I'm an administrator...we've got about 15,000 members...of those 15,000 some people pay to help support the site and part of the payment goes into a fund called the "downed rider fund" (it's a motorcycle forum). The admin and moderator team have oversight of the funds and will dispurse them as needed. The money we use is just a % of the non-required "membership"...kind of like the forum donations button here..the idea being that, for example, five or ten cents of every dollar gets put in a jar...if someone needs the money in the jar then the admin/moderator team decides that. There isn't a ton of money in the jar and certainly not enough to make a HUGE difference, but the idea is if you can make even a small difference then it could really help someone someday. I think it's a great idea for a CCW site to do something similar.

    The real problem that I see with it as it relates to this site is how would the person show the need for the money....most people in a legal "situation" would be advised not to discuss any of the details...especially on the internet. So that's the biggest problem that I happen to have with it.

  11. #11
    VIP Member Array Cupcake's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    Michigan
    Posts
    3,164
    Just to keep this discussion alive a bit longer, let me reply to several replies in this post. These are just my thoughts.

    Quote Originally Posted by Bob The Great
    interesting concept. I think the main worry is who would actually have access to the money. I'm sure the mod team here are all great people, but even so, I've never met them in person, and as such, I don't know if I would want to be depending on a pool of money that they manage. Nothing against them, for sure, it's just a personal policy of mine not to get financially entagled with people I don't know.
    I understand this part completely. It would have to be set up like a proper not for profit corporation. Accounts can be set up that require two signatures. These can be member-elected officials. Fortunately, we're talking about everyone kicking in $20 or so, so noone could be screwed out of their life savings. I drop that eating lunch for 2 days.


    Then of course, any prosecuter would be able to dig up the fact that you are basically paying into "shooting insurance" and maybe use that against you somehow. But they'll do that anyway.
    maybe, laywers are lawyers after all. But it might be worth the peace of mind. This one everyone would have to decide for themselves. At least if they do, you would have a lawyer of your own though.

    What happens when only 50 members contribute? There's no way to guarantee that everyone will chip in, and if not, you might as well stick with financing your own lawyer.
    If only 50 chip in, then at $20, a membar would have $1000 if needed. With over 100,000 ccw'ers in MI alone (i think), i think we'd do better than that. For many, financing a lawyer is not even an option. Some of us can barely pay our mortgages and utilities.

    Two things that would be important? Having a Castle Doctrine in your state (only helps, IN your state), and a small fund for an attorney that you have already talked with...
    Even if I (I know I'm not alone) could save $2000, that wouldn't get you much time at all. Around here, Attorneys run $200-450/hour

    On a national scale, there are already two options: the NRA, and the pro bono work of attorneys. Though, only near innocence will move those two "funds" and even that's not guaranteed. I do like the idea of the NRA changing it's membership forms to have a little check box, whereby someone can donate $10 / $20 / $30 to this fund. But, as suggested above, financial controls would need to be in place to ensure that didn't get used and abused.
    It is not my understanding that the NRA will handle every case that involves a member. Sometime for landmark cases, but thats it. As you said, there is no guarantee of getting either of these. I can't afford that gamble. For security, it would be nice if the NRA took control of this option.

    We have 2 firearm associations up here and they have helped people fighting bad gun laws. I would have thought that membership with the NRA would provide some coverage for certain types of lawsuits or court cases?
    The only guaranteed defense benefit isn't really from the NRA. They have an affiliation with a private, for-profit Insurance company that offers "Self Defense" insurance. This runs around $165( I think) per term (which I didn't see, probably 6 mo or 1yr) for $100,ooo. Even so, insurance companies are NOT out to pay claims. They employ people to find ways out. I'm sure everyone here knows a few people that have had seemingly legit claims denied.


    I'm just thinking that we can get the best bang for our buck if there aren't stockholders that want to see profit. This is just us looking out for ourselves and eachother.
    Last edited by Cupcake; March 26th, 2007 at 01:07 PM. Reason: didn't mean to submit yet
    Spend few minutes learning about my journey from Zero to Athlete in this
    Then check out my blog! www.BodyByMcDonalds.com

    Cupcake - 100 pound loser, adventurer, Ironman Triathlete.

  12. #12
    VIP Member Array Cupcake's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    Michigan
    Posts
    3,164
    Quote Originally Posted by raysheen View Post

    The real problem that I see with it as it relates to this site is how would the person show the need for the money....most people in a legal "situation" would be advised not to discuss any of the details...especially on the internet. So that's the biggest problem that I happen to have with it.

    Good point, I don't have all the answers...anyone?
    Spend few minutes learning about my journey from Zero to Athlete in this
    Then check out my blog! www.BodyByMcDonalds.com

    Cupcake - 100 pound loser, adventurer, Ironman Triathlete.

  13. #13
    Senior Member Array INTJ's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2006
    Location
    Middle Tennessee
    Posts
    596
    NRA members have access to self-defense insurance coverage.

    The new Self-Defense coverage is a rider to the Excess Personal Liability coverage. It provides civil defense and liability and criminal defense reimbursement if you are involved in an act of self-defense

    What is Covered
    Provides coverage up to the limit selected for bodily injury or property damage caused by an act of self-defense.
    Cost of civil suit defense is provided in addition to the limit of liability for bodily injury and property damage.
    Criminal Defense Reimbursement for alleged criminal actions involving self-defense when you are acquitted of such criminal charges or the charges are dropped.

    Liability Limit Options

    $100,000 Combined Single Limit with $50,000 criminal defense reimbursement sub-limit
    $250,000 Combined Single Limit with $50,000 criminal defense reimbursement sub-limit
    "Beware of the man who only owns one gun. He probably knows how to use it."

  14. #14
    VIP Member Array Tom G's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2006
    Location
    Central Florida
    Posts
    2,375
    I'm supprised the NRA didn't come out with this idea. It's a good one. The NRA could start a line of insurence that would cover a shooter if he was in the right. There would be a lot of details to work out.

  15. #15
    VIP Member Array Cupcake's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    Michigan
    Posts
    3,164
    Idea dead already?
    Spend few minutes learning about my journey from Zero to Athlete in this
    Then check out my blog! www.BodyByMcDonalds.com

    Cupcake - 100 pound loser, adventurer, Ironman Triathlete.

Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast

Links

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  

Similar Threads

  1. ‘Cultural Difference’ as a Legal Defense?
    By DaveH in forum Law Enforcement, Military & Homeland Security Discussion
    Replies: 12
    Last Post: December 15th, 2010, 12:29 AM
  2. Prepaid Legal Services as legal defense?
    By Olsen in forum The Second Amendment & Gun Legislation Discussion
    Replies: 12
    Last Post: September 9th, 2010, 02:38 PM
  3. Legal self defense, Illegal carry
    By AtlantaSW40 in forum Concealed Carry Issues & Discussions
    Replies: 39
    Last Post: March 25th, 2010, 02:41 PM
  4. Military Developing Half-Robot, Half-Insect 'Cybug' Spies & Robotic Bats
    By DaveH in forum Law Enforcement, Military & Homeland Security Discussion
    Replies: 2
    Last Post: July 16th, 2009, 09:13 AM
  5. After a self-defense shooting, where do you get legal help?
    By HowardCohodas in forum Concealed Carry Issues & Discussions
    Replies: 38
    Last Post: April 15th, 2008, 01:41 PM

Search tags for this page

concealed carry defence fund

,

defence fund ideas

,

defense fund ideas

,

legal defense fund ideas

,

nra legal defense fund

,

nra legal expenses for members

Click on a term to search for related topics.