I know it's a piece of evil commie junk... - Page 2

I know it's a piece of evil commie junk...

This is a discussion on I know it's a piece of evil commie junk... within the General Firearm Discussion forums, part of the Related Topics category; Words Of jeff Cooper: "We have received a couple of positive reports about the Chinese 1911 clone known as "Norinco." Quality control in a slave ...

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Thread: I know it's a piece of evil commie junk...

  1. #16
    Array QKShooter's Avatar
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    Words Of Jeff Cooper

    Words Of jeff Cooper:
    "We have received a couple of positive reports about the Chinese 1911 clone known as "Norinco."
    Quality control in a slave society can be anything the commissars decide, and, of course, slave labor is a lot cheaper.
    If you have a Norinco that works well, be satisfied."

    Words Of QKShooter:
    So...if you have one and it works well, be satisfied.
    I checked out more than a few of them over the years & quality was sporadic and always lacking in looks.
    Slide and frame base metal are reported to be good to very good but lacking cosmetic appeal. Slide serrations are usually quite ugly.
    Slide To Frame fit ranges from a good, tight, fit to very sloppy.
    Trigger pulls are always mushy. The exterior finish & metal prep. before finishing is never good
    Internal frame and slide finish is usually rough but passable with some minor deburring necessary.
    Functional Reliability is good. The one supplied magazine is usually not ever good. Barrels are 50/50 sometimes quite good ~ sometimes...not so good.
    Half the folks that buy them seem to love them to death and about half are sorry that they ever bought one. That never ceases to have me totally stumped. I still cannot figure that out.
    It would seem to me that in using a "rinco" for a build or base gun...by the time you got done changing out the internals...adding an aftermarket barrel & bushing...replacing the plastic stocks with additional new/better sights...and a refinish job....etc. You are already right to the cost of a nice quality used (but not abused) American Made Colt 1911 that will continue to hold value & increase in value.
    And a modified "Norc" will have absolutely no practical investment or resale value.
    If you wanted to buy one as a Plain Jane shooter then that's OK with me but, logically a "like new" Springfield would hold intrinsic value much better & is not that much more expensive.
    Liberty Over Tyranny Μολὼν λαβέ

  2. #17
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    Array Bumper's Avatar
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    May 2004
    As a "tool" gun I could probably live with one. One that is thrown in the back of a pickup truck, a tool box or left in cabin where it might be stolen. Possibly hammer a few nails if the proper tool was nowhere to be found. I cannot, however, treat a gun like a "tool". I would rather have a high quality but old and worn gun than a new cheap one. That applies, with me, to rifles, pistols or BB guns. Same with fishing gear. And tools. High quality is always cheaper in the long run. If I wanted to try a particular gun but could not afford the real thing I would continue wanting one unless there was a high quality knock off. Norinco is fine for AK or SKS type guns. Not ideal, but not bad either. Just my opinion.
    Coimhéad fearg fhear na foighde; Beware the anger of a patient man.

  3. #18
    Array QKShooter's Avatar
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    Thumbs up Bumper

    I could not have said it better than you just did.
    I also WANT to appreciate my firearms and my holsters & related equipment as being Fine Examples of their respective, traditional "craft" ~ and I always want to be able to absolutely trust that "serious equipment" ~
    You spoke some wise words.
    Liberty Over Tyranny Μολὼν λαβέ

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  5. #19
    VIP Member Array Euclidean's Avatar
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    I don't know I'd be so bold to make such a blanket statement. Our own domestic makers seem to turn out some stuff that makes commie guns look like the pinnacle of production sometimes.

    But Bumper's probably right that the Kalashinov action is probably the most worthwhile thing that ever came out of China. It was after all designed to be produced cheaply in large numbers with crude techinques and make the best of it.

  6. #20
    Senior Member Array rfurtkamp's Avatar
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    I've owned a bunch of Norincos of various stripes in my day.

    The Tokarevs? Generally OK, especially the early ones that looked to be military guns re-worked.

    The 1911s? Ugly, but functional. Back when they weren't asking $450 on average for one, it was a much better gun than the Llamas and the crapshoots in the $200 bin. Now I'd tell someone to get an Armscor in the same budget range. I'm sure Jeff Cooper wouldn't like those either, but well, I rarely agree with the codger.

    The M14/M1a? Not bad. I've shot several. Fit and finish was usually rack grade - not substantially below the Springfield entry level models. I'm just not enamored enough with the M14 design to want another one unless it was at the prices quoted. I ended up selling the non-Norinco I purchased a few months back for almost twice what it cost me, so that was good - but the rifle was finicky with ammo and wasn't as fun to shoot as my FALs.

    The Makarovs? Functional, not worth the $300-500 that the collectors seem to think they're worth.

    The oddballs? You know, the Browning takedown .22 copy, the Walther Olympia TT clone, the Uzi, that sort of thing? Surprisingly good. I bought their Walther copy for the 4H kids and it shoots better than the actual Walther that a local collector brought out for comparison - for a fifth of the price. My Norinco Uzi runs as well as my friend's Model B and shoots better than any 9mm carbine I've ever seen. Clay pidgeons out to 150 are a joke.

    On the Norinco guns, I have no guilt about buying a communist product if they're currently already here in the handgun department - there is no such thing as a 'new' one any more. The money's going into the hands of your local gun shop.

    On the M1A, I'd almost like to see the cheap ones re-imported to keep Springfield et al on their toes.

    I just have never understood how folks shooting 1911s and M14s and their clones seem to have such problems with the guns and still accept them.

    I've learned as I got older that if it doesn't work in the first box of shells, off it goes.
    Driver carries less than $45 worth of remorse.

  7. #21
    VIP Member (Retired Staff) Array P95Carry's Avatar
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    Mar 2005
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    Must say - my Norinco SKS is an excellent piece - it has a cheapie red dot but is a very accomplished plinker! I have a Yugo and Romanian SKS also - but this is the one I play with and like best.

    rfurtkamp - re your mention of Mak - I got a Russian (Bulgy import tho) for not too much over $200 - and it is a superb small semi - and totally robust and reliable - IMO.
    Chris - P95
    NRA Certified Instructor & NRA Life Member.

    "To own a gun and assume that you are armed
    is like owning a piano and assuming that you are a musician!."

    http://www.rkba-2a.com/ - a portal for 2A links, articles and some videos.

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