Glocks and XDs, external safety? - Page 4

Glocks and XDs, external safety?

This is a discussion on Glocks and XDs, external safety? within the General Firearm Discussion forums, part of the Related Topics category; Originally Posted by cwblanco The reason that they are the safest is because they are inherently unsafe, and Glock owners know it. Therefore, your quote ...

View Poll Results: Should striker fired pistols without safeties have them?

Voters
108. You may not vote on this poll
  • Yes, this is an unsafe design.

    11 10.19%
  • No, I like them as they are and I'm safe following the 4 rules.

    85 78.70%
  • What about revolvers?

    11 10.19%
  • Never had a striker fired pistol, likely never will, so I don't care.

    8 7.41%
Multiple Choice Poll.
Page 4 of 4 FirstFirst 1234
Results 46 to 58 of 58

Thread: Glocks and XDs, external safety?

  1. #46
    VIP Member Array Rob72's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2005
    Location
    OK
    Posts
    3,468
    Quote Originally Posted by cwblanco View Post
    The reason that they are the safest is because they are inherently unsafe, and Glock owners know it. Therefore, your quote might be better stated:

    "Glock shooters are the safest shooters available."
    Circular reasoning negates an argument. Glock has fewer safety features than some people are comfortable/familiar with; if they were "inherently unsafe" there would be well and readily documented evidence of more frequent NDs with Glock. That is not the case.

    Is a nitrous-equipped car or motorcycle "dangerous?" Only if one is using it inappropriately...

  2. #47
    VIP Member Array Redneck Repairs's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2005
    Location
    Colorado
    Posts
    5,134
    Circular reasoning negates an argument. Glock has fewer safety features than some people are comfortable/familiar with; if they were "inherently unsafe" there would be well and readily documented evidence of more frequent NDs with Glock. That is not the case.
    There is plenty of documented evidince of an increase of ad/nd incidents with glock specificly ( since glock made the inrods into popular and or police carry with this action type , not a slam on glock ) . However i choose to view it as not an indictment of glock trigger type , rather an indictment of training officers coupled with officers disintrest in firearms . With a proper training/retraining program it is not an issue , without it is somewhat a trainwreck . Personally i dont like glocks , but i love kahrs which uses virtually the same system , I soon should get an xd to try out extensivly but untill will withhold opinions . Typical " half cock " striker fired firearms ( such as glock ) are neither safe nor unsafe , they do however take as much or more ( imho more ) training than a single action with a safety such as the 1911 . In closing there IMHO is no " right " action there is only training that makes whatever officer/ccw holder safe with any action .
    Make sure you get full value out of today , Do something worthwhile, because what you do today will cost you one day off the rest of your life .
    We only begin to understand folks after we stop and think .

    Criminals are looking for victims, not opponents.

  3. #48
    VIP Member Array peacefuljeffrey's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2006
    Location
    south Florida
    Posts
    3,168
    Yeehaaaa! Option 2, baby!

    I am always dismayed that the very same people who will say that no one should ever count on a manual safety can also bring themselves to say that a gun that doesn't have one is not safe enough.

    My personal feeling is that if you can't keep a gun from firing inadvertently even if it has no external safety, you should not be handling guns. The manual safety should never end up being the thing that saves you from an ND.

    And I like a streamlined, simple design with as few moving doohickies as possible. That's exactly why I love Glocks. Add a manual safety to a Glock and I will loathe it.

  4. #49
    VIP Member Array peacefuljeffrey's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2006
    Location
    south Florida
    Posts
    3,168
    Quote Originally Posted by SIXTO View Post
    I think the external manual safety breeds reliance on a mechanical device instead of proper pistol craft.
    Agreed.

    The finger is the safety.

    When it's out of the trigger guard, the safety is engaged.
    When its inside the trigger guard, the safety is disengaged and the gun is truly hot.

  5. #50
    VIP Member Array peacefuljeffrey's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2006
    Location
    south Florida
    Posts
    3,168
    Quote Originally Posted by Tangle View Post
    SIXTO,

    We were talking about a Glocks and XDs. This seems to be a prevailing attitude toward Glocks and XDs: "I think the external manual safety breeds reliance on a mechanical device instead of proper pistol craft."

    And at the same time we commonly accept the thumb safety on a 1911 as a necessary safety device. It seems to be a double standard.
    It's not a double standard, for the simple reason that we are talking about two very different mechanical designs.

    Of course I would not carry a 1911 cocked with no "lock." But that's because of how light the trigger pull is, and the fact that the hammer is fully cocked.

    On a Glock, you need a full pull of a double-action trigger to fire the gun. I see that as a powerful enough difference to negate a claim that it's a double standard.

    No one is saying go ahead and pull the trigger on your C&L 1911 just because you can rely on the manual safety.

  6. #51
    Senior Member Array cwblanco's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2007
    Location
    Amarillo, Texas
    Posts
    835
    Quote Originally Posted by peacefuljeffrey View Post
    On a Glock, you need a full pull of a double-action trigger to fire the gun. I see that as a powerful enough difference to negate a claim that it's a double standard.
    Glock and XD's are not double-action. They are striker fired, and partial cocking occurs when chambering a round with the slide. A true double-action will allow a second pull of the trigger on a round that fails to fire without having to work the slide. Glocks and XD's will not allow that second pull on a round that does not fire. You must eject it and chamber another round.

    A true double-action will allow that second trigger pull. Examples are the double-action/single action models such as the Ruger P series and most Sig pistols which have a heavier first pull, and a soft pull on subsequent rounds. Then there are the complaints of taking up the slack on the subsequent pulls.

    Don't get me wrong, I like Glock, XD, Sig, Rugers, as well as a lot of other brands.

  7. #52
    VIP Member Array Stetson's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2004
    Location
    Augusta,Maine
    Posts
    4,483
    This is getting old!

  8. #53
    VIP Member Array peacefuljeffrey's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2006
    Location
    south Florida
    Posts
    3,168
    Quote Originally Posted by cwblanco View Post
    Glock and XD's are not double-action. They are striker fired, and partial cocking occurs when chambering a round with the slide.

    This I knew. But my meaning was more to distinguish them from guns whose triggers take a hammer only from cocked to firing (e.g. a 1911).

  9. #54
    Senior Member Array cwblanco's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2007
    Location
    Amarillo, Texas
    Posts
    835
    Quote Originally Posted by peacefuljeffrey View Post
    My personal feeling is that if you can't keep a gun from firing inadvertently even if it has no external safety, you should not be handling guns.
    All LEO's who have had an accidental discharge felt the same way. The laws of Murphy will always be around. You may feel that you are immune from Murphy -- but

    Over confidence kills.

  10. #55
    VIP Member Array KenpoTex's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2005
    Location
    SW Missouri
    Posts
    2,193
    AFAIC, if you want a manual safety on your gun because it makes you feel warm and fuzzy, that's perfectly ok.

    If you feel warm and fuzzy w/o a manual safety, that's perfectly ok too.

    I do not feel that the Glocks, XD's, or M&P's (or any other DAO weapon w/o a manual safety) are inherently unsafe. If I felt this way, I wouldn't carry a Glock.
    "Being a predator isn't always comfortable but the only other option is to be prey. That is not an acceptable option." ~Phil Messina

    If you carry in Condition 3, you have two empty chambers. One in the weapon...the other between your ears.

    Matt K.

  11. #56
    Senior Member
    Array sojourner's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2005
    Location
    PA
    Posts
    1,054
    If you want a manual safety, get a gun that has one OEM. If you don't, get a gun that doesn't OEM. Simple. Don't mess around trying to add one to a gun that doesn't have one (glock) or disable one on a gun that does have one.

    IMO, for a CCW firearm, the only upgrades can be: night sights, grip enhancers (innertube, agrip, skateboard tape. etc. ...) and for the glock the jentra plug (but I am reconsiderting my decision on that).

  12. #57
    VIP Member Array LongRider's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2007
    Location
    Washington
    Posts
    2,622
    Quote Originally Posted by cwblanco View Post
    Glocks and XD's will not allow that second pull on a round that does not fire. You must eject it and chamber another round.
    On my XD compact you can get a second strike on a round with a partial pull on the slide about 1/2 an inch. To slide lock is about
    1 3/4 inches, so about a third of a pull It wont eject the round and you can get a second strike. A bit a trivia really because if a round does not fire I eject it automatically, not going to get into the habit of trying for a second strike.
    Abort the Obamanation not the Constitution

    Those who would, deny, require permit, license, certification, or authorization for me to bear arms are as vile, dangerous & evil as those who would molest, abuse, assault, rape or murder my family

  13. #58
    Lead Moderator Array Tangle's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2004
    Location
    Chattanooga
    Posts
    10,428
    Quote Originally Posted by cwblanco View Post
    All LEO's who have had an accidental discharge felt the same way. The laws of Murphy will always be around. You may feel that you are immune from Murphy -- but

    Over confidence kills.
    That's so good it deserves repeating.
    I'm too young to be this old!
    Getting old isn't good for you!

Page 4 of 4 FirstFirst 1234

Remove Ads

Sponsored Links

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  

Similar Threads

  1. External safety: What is your preference?
    By CDRGlock in forum Defensive Carry Guns
    Replies: 56
    Last Post: May 25th, 2010, 10:34 PM
  2. Glocks and Safety
    By crue2009 in forum Defensive Carry Guns
    Replies: 58
    Last Post: August 23rd, 2009, 10:18 PM
  3. Firearms without External Safety, etc.
    By preachertim in forum Basic Gun Handling & Safety
    Replies: 13
    Last Post: March 11th, 2009, 09:26 AM
  4. Glocks, Safety, & How to Carry
    By advantage1one in forum Defensive Carry Guns
    Replies: 20
    Last Post: February 22nd, 2009, 03:25 PM
  5. External Safety
    By Geo2020 in forum Defensive Carry Guns
    Replies: 31
    Last Post: July 27th, 2006, 12:45 AM

Search tags for this page

are striker fire pistols safe with out thumb safety
,
are xds safe guns
,
does the xds have a external safety
,
glock external safety
,
how safe is xds design
,
pistol without external safety
,
safety for xds
,
safety on xds
,
trigger safety on xds
,
xds external safety
,
xds pistol
,

xds safety

Click on a term to search for related topics.